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pgtips
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Joined: July 23, 2009
Posts: 860
Location: essex
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 Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2015 2:27 pm Post subject: 003 to 010 Automatic Transmission Swap |
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Hi,
I've read a few threads/discussions about swapping auto gearboxes but nobody seems to have actually done it. the main difference (only one mentioned) is linkage.
I parted out my 003 for a 010 auto box and within the next couple of weeks will start to install. Does anyone know how much body difference there is to mount this, if any at all.
I am naively hoping to offer up the 010 and it will find its way home, existing mounts etc will be useable but that's probably wishful thinking.
I know the linkage is different but what else, would VW have needed to change the dimensions/size/mounts of the boxes in any way or are they the same size. I know I should have taken the opportunity to measure up but it wasn't possible at the time.
It's a difficult Q because there probably aren't many people with 2 gearboxes side by side but fingers xd 
Many thanks
PG
_________________
1975 1.8l FI Auto Westy - Subaru converted
1971 356 kit 1600 TP - semi/stickshift
1971 1302 LS - semi/stickshift
Trim ring info here -> http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=559668
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=451210
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=479721 |
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Wasted youth
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Joined: July 06, 2012
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Location: California's Hot and Smoggy Central Valley
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| Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2015 2:44 pm Post subject: Re: auto box 003 to 010 |
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| pgtips wrote: |
...I parted out my 003 for a 010 auto box and within the next couple of weeks will start to install. Does anyone know how much body difference there is to mount this, if any at all.
I am naively hoping to offer up the 010 and it will find its way home, existing mounts etc will be useable but that's probably wishful thinking.
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I'm sorry, but I am somewhat confused. Are you removing the 003 and installing the 010? |
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pgtips
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Location: essex
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Wasted youth
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Location: California's Hot and Smoggy Central Valley
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| Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2015 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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OK... I have been wondering the same thing. Two thoughts have come to mind on this.
1- If the improved transmission design of the 010 was introduced in late 1974 or 1975, would VW really want to change the body of the bus to accommodate this? Hopefully not, so if there was a change in mounting, perhaps it would be limited to bracketing or hardware... comparatively easy to work around.
2- If the improved 010 was meant for the larger 2.0 engine, then would the mating design of either/both of the 010 and the 2.0 engine need to be re-designed? Hopefully not, because that seems like a large cost to accommodate an engine that is only 200cc larger that an 1.8 Type 4 and said another way, would it really be necessary to change the mating of any combination of Type 4 engine to either the 010 or 003? I believe this is sort of what you are asking.
Currently, I have my rebuilt 003 transmission installed in my 1973 bus with a dying 1.7 Type 4. I have two spare, fully dressed 2.0 fuel injected engines. I would like to marry one of them up to my rebuilt tranny. Sort of the opposite of what you are thinking, I guess.
Just not a priority for me right now. |
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pgtips
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Wasted youth
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| Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2015 12:31 am Post subject: |
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| pgtips wrote: |
| If you take a 1.8 and upgrade to 2.0 you could use the same engine and so the same gearbox, i looked into this using my 003 and 1.8 engine. |
I wonder if the 2.0 Vanagon engine would bolt up to the 003?
| pgtips wrote: |
I read the 010 was bettered to accommodate extra HP but unlikely in my opinion, it would be loads of tooling, I think more manual linkage than vacuum was the mod.
I'll take pics as I do it, hopefully it will go smoothly . |
When I opened one of my 010 to see inside, my immediate impression was the clutch assemblies were bigger and heavier than the 003 I rebuilt. |
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pgtips
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Wildthings
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| Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2015 5:25 am Post subject: |
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Find a "Z" torque converter for a 83 Vanagon and use it over the TC that came with the Bay. I think the "H" torque converter out of a water cooled Vanagon will work as well.
Mounting wise, I think you are okay doing the swap, just make sure you have all the correct mounting parts for the 010 box as they may be different, not sure??? If you have all the throttle linkage parts for the 010 including the front engine tin that will save fabricating. Do let us know of any problems you have. |
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pgtips
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pgtips
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raygreenwood
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| Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 6:12 am Post subject: |
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Yes....the vanagon engine and 2.0 bolt right up to the 003. Its the same automatic that came in the 411 and 412....which are type 4 engines.
The vanagon torque converter has a higher stall point to allow the engine to rev higher before the converter reaches hydrostatic lockup and engages the gears. This is better for the lowering gearing of the bus and vanagon.......as compared to the 003 diff that came in the type 3 and 4 cars.....that has a final drive ratio of from 3.73 to 3.91.
I would also speculate that the higher lockup point would work better in a 411 or 412 as well. I think a few others from reading here have already done this. Ray |
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pgtips
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Wildthings
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| Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 8:51 am Post subject: |
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| pgtips wrote: |
thanks Ray but I traded the 003 for a 010 (later version auto box)
does same apply ?
Also where is the V or H identification for the torque converter (never seen one in the flesh) |
The "Z", "H", or other marks are on one of the three mounting bosses where the TC bolts up to the flex plate.
Yes the higher stall speed TC lets the engine rev higher so that the engine will get spend more time near peak torque. There is a note in the Vanagon Bentley recommending the use of the "Z" torque converter to replace earlier models.
There are probably very few "Z" torque converters out there, but there should be a lot of "H" torque converters as they were used throughout the Waterboxer run. As I said I have never actually used the "H" converter on a T4 engine, but I did fit one up once and it appears to be dimentionally identical to the "Z" and earlier converters. The "H" converter is specced pretty much the same as the "Z" converter so I don't know what the difference is.
If you find and use an "H" converter let us know how it works for you. |
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