Fuel pump constantly running

[getmyvwontheroad!]

I'm not sure if this is all 77 VW buses or what, but my fuel pump keeps running when it is in the ON position? Is it supposed to stay running while just in the ON position. I wanted to just use my radio, but don't feel comfortable having it on with the fuel pump running. Maybe someone can clear this up for me.
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[Wildthings]

You will damage your ignition contact points and/or coil if you leave the key in the "ON" position to run the stereo. There are lots of threads on how to properly power your radio without having to turn your ignition on.

But to answer your question, the fuel pump should not be running.

[SGKent]

^^^^^^ what Wildthings said

there is no accessory position on that 1977 ignition switch. You need to move the stereo to an accessory position on the fuse block where the power is always on if you want to do that. The downside is that if you forget and leave it on the battery will run down. you could also put in a single pole double pole switch where one side is an always hot source, the other the normal ignition switched source, and the center the stereo. That would give you the ability to listen to it when the ignition is off but have it switched the rest of the time.

As for the fuel pump. Either the contact in the AFM is out of adjustment, the AFM door stuck slightly open, the double relay bad, or a PO changed the wiring in that area.
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[getmyvwontheroad!]

Thanks for the tips on the radio, guess I'll make that a second project and ask questions on that later.

So as far as the fuel pump, it doesn't seem that the AFM door is stuck. As far as the wiring, how could it have been changed? There's only a positive and a negative connection on the fuel pump and I'm sure those I put on correctly when I changed it.
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[SGKent]

I am doing this from memory but most models there are two ways the pump runs.

When the Key is in the start position it provides power to the pump. This is so that when you try to start it there is fuel pressure. That wire comes from the solenoid and is switched so that it only has power when the key is in the start position and the engine cranking over.

The other is from the double relay. There is a small set of points in the AFM that touch only when the AFM door begins to open. When those points touch they trigger the double relay to pull down as to the fuel pump relay, which turns the pump on. Sometimes the points in the AFM can be too close and touch all the time, or the points in the double relay stuck together. You can try the light whack on the side of the double relay with a screw driver HANDLE to see if that jars the double relay and stops it. If it does then it is time to get a new one. Most are the same but 1979 California is different.

Sometimes prior owners and mechanics wire the pump on al the time rather than replace the relay. Really bad idea.
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[getmyvwontheroad!]

[busdaddy]

[SGKent]

[Tcash]

I am hearing a click when the door is lightly pushed. So would it still mean the double relay is stuck/bad?
That means the relay is switching. So the points are not stuck.

Sounds like someone hooked up an extra wire to the fuel pump circuit.

See if you have any extra wires on the Double Relay?
thanks to amskeptic
Double Relay Article

You may need to follow the +positive wire from the fuel pump and see if they spliced a wire into it.

Good Luck
Tcash

#7 is the acc. fuse. connect the radio power there.

[getmyvwontheroad!]

Okay so I followed the postive wire all the way to the relay. The blue is the postive to the fuel pump. But I'm unsure what the green is? It seems bridged? Is that supposed to be like that?

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[Tcash]

The big fat red wire should not go to the fuel pump. It goes directly to the battery and it does have the jumper wire.

Open these up.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/baybus_77-78.jpg
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/baybus_77-78_key.jpg

If yours is a 1977 there should be a:
Red/blue wire on terminal 88d that goes to the fuel pump.
I don't see it in the picture.

Tcash

[SGKent]

not near the bus but found this and it looks the same. The brown in this image is darker but it is still brown.

I'd say turn the ignition on with the plug disconnected and see if the fuel pump comes on. If it does there is another source of voltage you are looking for. If it does not then use the tests in that PDF of the FI manual to test the relay or try a new relay.

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[getmyvwontheroad!]

It's hard to follow these wires! Ha alright I'll go back and check from 88d and follow that. I'll give it a shot with the plug disconnected as well to see if the fuel pump runs and let yall know what I come up with.
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[Wildthings]

The wire supplying the fuel pump should be either a red wire with a blue tracer or maybe a blue wire with a red tracer (this last is from the black and white version of the '79 schematic, sometimes it is best to check multiple years for info). You should find this color wire hooked up to the one side of the fuel pump (it may have a sheath over the wire of some other color like black) and a light brown ground wire hooked up to the other side of the pump. As others have said, if the pump runs with the plugs removed from the double relay your problem lies elsewhere.

[Tcash]

I am hearing a click when the door is lightly pushed. So would it still mean the double relay is stuck/bad?
That means the relay is switching. So the points are not stuck.
I miss spoke, the points may be stuck.

Sometimes by unplugging the relay and tapping gently on it will un-stick the points in the relay. Try that and if it works, time for another relay.

Good Luck
Tcash

[getmyvwontheroad!]

So I did the test with turning the key to the "ON" position with the double relay disconnected and I was able to hear the fuel pump running still.
So does anyway else know why/where the wire could have been moved? In your opinion. Or do you think someone previously just wired it wrong?
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