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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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 Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:29 am Post subject: |
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| vince1 wrote: |
| raygreenwood wrote: |
| vince1 wrote: |
| andy198712 wrote: |
| so the NGK BP6ET should work with the 044 heads? |
044 have 12 mm plugs, so a D#### plug, B#### are 14 mm plugs. |
So...are you saying the 044 heads have 12mm diameter spark plug threads? I doubt it.
Also you are mixing up what you are stating because you are writing the plug code in the incorrect order. If a Bosch plug part # has a "D" as the FIRST number in the code...... that would me an that it has 18mm X 1.5 diameter threads. Like... D####....that is a 18mm x 1.5 thread plug
A plug with a B as the first letter in the code.....like B#### (Bosch part # again).....does not exist. There is no "B" first digit code.
The two numbers I posted W7BTC and BP6HT...break down like this
W7BTC:
W=14mm x 1.5 thread diameter with 20.8mm wrench hex
7= Heat range
B=12.7mm thread LENGTH with a washer style seat
T= triple electrode
C= Copper
BP6HT
B= 14mm x 1.5 thread diameter
P= Projected insulator
6= heat range
H=12.7mm or 0.5"" thread reach/depth
T= Triple electrode
All f the plugs we are speaking of have 14mm diameter threads. The difference we are speaking of here is the LENGTH of those 14mm threads.
The W7DTC and BP6ET...all have 19mm thread length and 14mm x 1.5 thread diameter
The W7BTC and BP6HT...all have 12.7mm thread length and 14mm x 1.5 thread diameter
Ray |
Was talking about NGK part numbers |
  ...Doh! Yes.....i forgot to look at the NGK list. Thank you for the correction and the slap up side the head! Ray |
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dnielsen
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Joined: June 19, 2005
Posts: 80
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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| Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 11:11 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for all the info in this thread. I just got a set of the NGK BCPR6ES (2330), had to special order since nobody in town had them. I got these resistor plugs because with the non-resistor NGK BCP6ES I was using my tach was jumping all over the place. Switching over to the resistor plugs smoothed it out a bit, still not perfect. I've read the MSD has a noisy tach output so maybe it's to be expected.
Would have liked to get the BCPR6ET (2197) but they seem to be unobtainable. If anyone has a source for these please post the info so I can order a set. |
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dwill49965
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Joined: August 08, 2005
Posts: 1396
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:09 am Post subject: |
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Can anyone tell me what the factory pre-set gap is on the BP6ET plugs are?
I am running a MSD 6A box (with MSD Blaster 2 coil), using older platinum Bosch WR8CP plugs, opened up to .045" gap from the stock .028". I'd be interested in trying the NGK BP6ET plugs, but if re-gapping them is a real pain and is critical to get exact, it may not be worth it. Note that I am running an otherwise stock engine in my bus.
Not sure if leaving the plugs at the factory-set gap would take advantage of the multi-spark capability (or if it matters). Or, would I be better off sticking with a single electrode plug (of whatever brand) and leaving the plug gap wider than stock (like I am now)?
Subhuman - I notice you are running a MSD 6AL box in your sig - did you regap the BP6ET plugs, or run them straight out of the box?
_________________
Darryl
--------------
'78 Westy, Boston Bob built 2.0 L, FI, MSD 6A
| Meyer wrote: |
| Lastly, you just referred to US citizens as 'Americans'. Exactly what kind of Canadian are you? From what continent? |
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subhuman
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Joined: January 22, 2008
Posts: 539
Location: north carolina
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 7:24 am Post subject: |
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| dwill49965 wrote: |
Can anyone tell me what the factory pre-set gap is on the BP6ET plugs are?
I am running a MSD 6A box (with MSD Blaster 2 coil), using older platinum Bosch WR8CP plugs, opened up to .045" gap from the stock .028". I'd be interested in trying the NGK BP6ET plugs, but if re-gapping them is a real pain and is critical to get exact, it may not be worth it. Note that I am running an otherwise stock engine in my bus.
Not sure if leaving the plugs at the factory-set gap would take advantage of the multi-spark capability (or if it matters). Or, would I be better off sticking with a single electrode plug (of whatever brand) and leaving the plug gap wider than stock (like I am now)?
Subhuman - I notice you are running a MSD 6AL box in your sig - did you regap the BP6ET plugs, or run them straight out of the box? |
running the bp6et right out of the box, not one issue!
_________________
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never argue with an idiot, they will only drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!
Mark Twain |
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raygreenwood
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Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:53 am Post subject: |
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| dwill49965 wrote: |
Can anyone tell me what the factory pre-set gap is on the BP6ET plugs are?
I am running a MSD 6A box (with MSD Blaster 2 coil), using older platinum Bosch WR8CP plugs, opened up to .045" gap from the stock .028". I'd be interested in trying the NGK BP6ET plugs, but if re-gapping them is a real pain and is critical to get exact, it may not be worth it. Note that I am running an otherwise stock engine in my bus.
Not sure if leaving the plugs at the factory-set gap would take advantage of the multi-spark capability (or if it matters). Or, would I be better off sticking with a single electrode plug (of whatever brand) and leaving the plug gap wider than stock (like I am now)?
Subhuman - I notice you are running a MSD 6AL box in your sig - did you regap the BP6ET plugs, or run them straight out of the box? |
Hang tight. After lunch I will pull a brand new one from my collection and measure the gap for you.
You will need a proper gap tool. No stupid ramped ones...no feeler gauges...cause they wont work.
This is the gauge you need...you can get it all over the web...and usually about $8-10
http://www.europaparts.com/spark-plug-gap-tool-098...aQodVt4F4Q
The gauge has a rather useless "looking" hook tool..that actually works very well. It hooks the end of the electrode you are moving, levers against the top rim of the plug and bends the electrode outward. Moving them backing...just as Bosch suggests...is done by very light repeated tapping on the side electrode in question ONLY.
They are simple to gap....just you have to be patient and work slowly.
The reason why the gaps have to be precisely EQUAL. (they can be larger or smaller than stock....but must be EQUAL)......should be obvious.
The factors that lead to ionization point...the point where the spark will arc or jump a gap....are many and vary by the millisecond. Any minuscule difference between resistance ...caused by temperature...fuel charge between electrodes, compression/pressure ground state...etc......will make one of those three identical gaps the best aand easiest candidate for an arc to be created.
Those variables change infinitely all the time. All three of these gaps create sparks all the time......just NEVER at the same time. I suppose if you had something like 300Kv...they might be enough voltage to spark more than one at any given time...but thats not the point of these plugs.
You can also see this because virtually NEVER...maybe once or twice (and usually tracked to sloppy re-gapping)...have I ever found the three electrodes to have different gaps from wear. Just like any plug...the gap will increase with age...but they will almost always be virtually identical.
Exceptions to this I have ...heard...from people who use them for specific applications...are when you have some sort of unique swirl or injection pattern that causes one electrode closest to a specific feature, swirl, flame front or even shrouding of plug or odd plug angle....to fire one electrode greatly more than others.
The point is reliability of uniform spark at high rpm and high compression. The common belief that these were meant to be some kind of extended mileage plug...or that its simply extra electrodes so one will always work when others are burned out....while it may be true....has nothing to do with why these plugs were created.
They were most probably originally used in in aircraft and high compression motorcycles (many people know these as ONLY motorcycle plugs). they were made for uniform spark reliability under high performance conditions.
They are almost always perfectly gapped out of the box. With the gauge I listed...I check them anyway to make sure some counter monkey has not been juggling boxes on the lunch break. Ray |
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dwill49965
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Joined: August 08, 2005
Posts: 1396
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks, Ray, and Subhuman.
Ray, I do have a wire gauge spark plug gapping tool - similar to this one - KD 165:
http://www.amazon.com/K-D-Tools-165-Wire-Gauge/dp/B000CODE0M
but it doesn't have the same hook thing for widening the gap.
_________________
Darryl
--------------
'78 Westy, Boston Bob built 2.0 L, FI, MSD 6A
| Meyer wrote: |
| Lastly, you just referred to US citizens as 'Americans'. Exactly what kind of Canadian are you? From what continent? |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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Sorry for the delay. I thought i had a new set of NGK BP6ET. ..the Bosch W7DTC notes .8mm gaps (.03149"). My books note the NGK BP6ET is .032".
Yes those pin gauges will work fine if they have the sizes you need. Virtually any tool you can hook over the fop of the electrode can work.
I will see if i can post a picture of it in action in the am. As long as you get the concept you can safely do it with many tools. Ray |
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esde
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Joined: October 20, 2007
Posts: 5969
Location: central rust belt
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| Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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| So, I've been reading and still am not sure I've found what I'm after. I'm looking for a 12mm, 3/4 reach, resistor type plug. Does anyone have either a Bosch or NGK part number? Is there a multi electrode option like the W7DTC? |
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Boolean
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Joined: January 19, 2012
Posts: 1712
Location: Stockholm
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 3:50 am Post subject: Re: Which Spark Plug ?? |
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DPR6E comes to mind. Single ground strap, but there are others if you google the NGK complete listing.
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Build thread here:
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esde
Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2007
Posts: 5969
Location: central rust belt
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| Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 7:16 pm Post subject: Re: Which Spark Plug ?? |
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So, looking through the listing of NGK plugs I have found a few other options to fit 12mm X 3/4 reach, resistor type
The dual ground electrode JR8C, which I see is possibly too cold
And a DCPR8EKC also dual ground. The platinum tipped version is DCPR8EKP
ANd the single ground DCPR6E, 7E, 8E, 9E
Last but not least, a projected tip ZKR7A10
I'll throw in a few snap shots from the NGK pdf, as I've lost the link to wherever I found it.
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rrcade
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Joined: May 29, 2010
Posts: 735
Location: WI 1962 Bug 2276
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Boolean
Samba Member
Joined: January 19, 2012
Posts: 1712
Location: Stockholm
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| Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 7:15 am Post subject: Re: Which Spark Plug ?? |
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Great for nitrous. A protruded center works better on a street T1 engine.
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Build thread here:
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