'69 FI Squareback: The Continuing (Mis)Adventures

D/A/N · Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:54 pm Post subject:

Well, I made it to work and back without breaking down which was nice. I'm still not fully convinced of anything, though, seeing how we've gone hundreds of miles between breakdowns. I guess I'll just have to keep driving.

And now I can getting around to settling a few other issues! The first of which is a vac leak at idle. I changed injector seals and IAD to intake runner seals and that cured most of it. However, there's still a hunt (120rpm rise and fall) that I can't get rid of but have traced to the AAR. When I put my finger over the end of the hose from the AAR to the air cleaner, the idle stabilizes to its normal (at least for us for as long as we've been driving the car) 50-60rpm wandering. I have new hose from the AAR to the IAD so I don't fault that. But is it possible that the AAR is hanging open just enough to cause a slight vac leak but not a constant high idle like it would if fully stuck open? If so, should I just adjust it?

Then......play in the steering column. If I grip the wheel and move it up and down, there's visible play and an audible thunk. Also, the ignition switch cover moves but nothing lower down on the column seems to. Replace steering column bearing? Or is something else possibly awry here? Have a look/listen.

Link

Tram · Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:58 pm Post subject:

I'd say it's just loose under the dash at the Allen head bolts.
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D/A/N · Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 3:19 pm Post subject:

Tram · Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 3:24 pm Post subject:

D/A/N · Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 3:30 pm Post subject:

raygreenwood · Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 3:40 pm Post subject:

D/A/N wrote:

KTPhil · Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 4:23 pm Post subject:

KTPhil · Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 4:29 pm Post subject:

I had the same hunting (narrow band, not the wild swings up to 1800 rpm and back from a large air leak-- different problem). I cleaned and adjusted the AAR per spec, but it had the narrowed range from age Ray mentioned. I wanted it CLOSED when it should be so I'd have a stable warm idle, so I adjusted it a little further to closed, at the expense of a temporary rough idle when cold.

After I re-installed my thermostat, it warmed up faster and the problem has almost disappeared, though not quite completely. I was used to this as old carb VWs had similar behavior as the electric chokes aged. I was used to giving it a little gas to keep the idle smooth for a minute (good excuse to let it warm up at idle, just that long), so it works for me now.

Tram · Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 10:58 am Post subject:

So Daniel/And/Neena... any updates? You should have been able to break it by now if it's not fixed. Smile

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D/A/N · Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 11:29 am Post subject:

raygreenwood · Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:26 pm Post subject:

Just to throw another variable into the soup.......there was one time that virtually this same symptom happened to my 412......and it was not mechanical.

It was the night before i was about to start a new job....very early am. So sunday night i took both of my cars one at a time....up the street to fill their tanks at the same station.

The 412 with D-jet and my Saab 900 with CIS. In the morning at 5:00 they both exhibited the same symptoms you describe. I got 4 miles with the 412 and came home. When i turned it off.....it would not start again.
Hopped in the Saab......and got about 5 miles with it cutting out.....and returned home.....and it would not start again.

Took a cab. When i got home......and started disecting......i found that both cars had some kind of greasy crud in the tank .....that would not burn. Not water and not diesel.

It took a lot of MEK and cursing to get both systems clean. In fact the Saab with its CIS took about a,month. I had to pay to get rid of about 25 gallons of contaminated gasoline.

This stuff wrecked the pre-filters, fuel filters and gummed up the injectors and pumps.

A couple months later while describing this mess to an engineer friend who works in the petroleum industry....he noted that it sounded like improperly blended additives that made it into a tanker at the local farm. Since cities like Dallas have huge smog issues....swasonal fuel additives are added and blended at the farm. Its,main problem was not really the clogging and gumming...just th3 tact that it would not readily burn. Ray

neena · Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 4:03 pm Post subject:

KTPhil · Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 5:33 pm Post subject:

Removal: horn cap, horn ring/wire, steering wheel nut and wheel, turn signal switch (not required but it moves this fragile assembly out of the way), large c-clip, then remove the plastic cover and the two big cap stews, and also the small clamp capscrew, remove electrical connectors, then... not sure since I was digging for the ignition switch, too.

BUT...

To just get rid of the play, you may be able to leave it all on, and just remove the plastic cover and the two (maybe three) caps crews, and drop the whole assembly down an inch, then remove the two screws holding that "collapsing bracket" that you do the glue gun trick to... and pinch the "ears" together on those pot metal parts of the bracket assembly (which is a big part of the play), then put it back together.

D/A/N · Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 1:19 pm Post subject:

KTPhil · Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 6:41 pm Post subject:

D/A/N · Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 7:07 pm Post subject:

We've yet to check any downstream stuff, though our steering box is crap. It's less than 2 years old, has been adjusted several times at both spots, and develops slop after only a few weeks. In diagnosing the box, we've looked at the coupler and all the relevant bolts and nothing was out of line. Anyway, here's a video of how much play is in the wheel while driving.....I was able to do all this wiggling without moving the car/engaging the steering at all. I suppose this is a downstream issue, but related to the thunk? I don't know.....

Link

KTPhil · Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 8:08 pm Post subject:

The up-down play and the rotational play are probably unrelated.

You've eliminated the most common up-down source, so I'd suggest contorting under the dash with the camera, and having an assistant do the same up-down wiggling. We can then see what is tight and what is loose. Watch at the clamp, the two capscrews, the column tube, and the column assembly.

Rotational play is almost surely your steering box, from what you've said.

ataraxia · Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:35 am Post subject:

Are you using a VW / restored steering box or a TRW?

I had a couple of bad TRW steering boxes so I swapped back to VW steering boxes rebuilt with NOS parts.

W1K1 · Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2015 7:07 am Post subject:

Just something to check.... I had the bolts come loose a fraction on the steering box after a big bump in the road and the steering box was moving on the beam, that made for some loose steering. You couldn't see it move, but you could feel it when you had your hand on the steering box.
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1973 super
1965 squareback 1500E
1971 bay window westy- subi swap

D/A/N · Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2015 11:46 am Post subject:


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'69 FI Squareback: The Continuing (Mis)Adventures
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