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Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 8:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Between doctors appointments and chasing down the parts I need to fix the Jeep, I haven't been able to get anything done on this project for the last week. After I got home from my latest appointment this afternoon/evening, I made some time to get a little bit done on it.

I have the exhaust all welded up now, so I started with sand blasting the J tubes. They had been mostly blasted before so they just needed a little touch up in a few spots. The HF blaster wasn't cooperating with me so I had to stop and work on it again. I tried all the regular quick fixes and nothing was working this time. I ended up having to disassemble the gun and remove a few lodged pieces of metal that looked like they were from the manufacturing process. That did the trick and the gun was now working as good as it ever was. Once both J tubes were done, I decided to address the flaws inside both ends of the pipes. The welds on the flange ends were encroaching into the bore almost 1/4" in some places. At the opposite ends of the tubes there was a sharp burr most of the way around the inside edge. I used a grinding stone in my Dremel to work out the majority of the imperfections and then switched to a small 80 grit flap wheel to smooth it all out. After that I went over the outsides of both pipes with some 00 steel wool just to get the surface texture a bit more smoothed out. Lastly I painted each tube with some silver Rustoleum 2000* high heat header paint and hung them out to dry. I didn't bring the camera out today with all the fine dust floating around the air in the barn. I'll take some pics tomorrow after teh paint is dry and the dust has had a chance to settle down.

Next up will be the main part of the 4-1 header. However, I most likely won't be able to get to it until this weekend since I'll be fixing the Jeep brakes tomorrow. The header needs to be completely blasted and painted like the J tubes. I'll address any imperfections as I come across them. After a casual first glance, it doesn't look like it will need near as much work as the J tubes did. However it has a lot more rust, and a bunch of overspray splotches from the PO's olive drab rattle crap paint job.

After that's done, the QP muffler section will get done last. It's not rusty at all, but it has that black shipping paint on the pipe and flange that needs to be removed before I can repaint it with the high heat paint. It would suck to get the glass pack filled with that aluminum oxide grit, and I also don't want to screw up the chrome tip, so the QP will not be getting sand blasted. The plan is to just use a wire wheel to get the black paint off, fix any remaining imperfections and then hit it with the high heat paint.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 10, 2016 8:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Here's some pics of the J tubes for the previous post.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Today I got around to fixing up the ports and getting the rust off the main part of the Empi 4-1 header. The Dremel was used to smooth out the bumps, weld blobs and tube seams from the insides of the exhaust ports, heat riser ports and the collector. The collector had a section of metal that was about 1/8" inside of the hole in the collector flange. I hammered that edge over so that it made contact with the flange and then used the sanding drums on the Dremel to get the rest of the area smoothed out. It may still look a bit ugly, but it's 1000% better than it was. All the major bumps are gone now and it's fairly smooth when you run your fingers around the inside of the edges.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I used a cup wire wheel mounted in a hand drill to get the loose stuff off of the outside next. Once that was as clean as the wire cup could get it I put the header in the sand blaster. Even with the sand blaster working better, it was still having trouble getting the deep rust off of the outside of the pipes. After I had at least gotten the outside all the same texture I took it outside and started going over it with some steel wool and sand paper. That got it a little better, but there was still a lot of rust residue discoloring the metal. At this point I decided to just coat the header with some Ospho to neutralize the remaining rust. That should kill the rust and keep it from coming back from under the paint. It was a nice day outside so I just hung it up to dry on the fence post. I'll paint it tomorrow after the Ospho has had a chance to fully cure.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Last item for today was the QP end pipe piece. I brushed a little Ospho on all the welds for some rust prevention in those areas. The chrome tailpipe tip was taped off to protect it from getting marred by the sand paper. I used some 60 grit paper to get the majority of the black preservative coating off quickly. I also used the same coarse paper to scuff up the outside of the glass pack. After it was all hit with the coarse paper I went over all of it again with some 120 grit sand paper. The inside of the collector flange area on this part was much better and didn't need major surgery like the other pieces did. I sprayed it with the high temp silver paint and hung it up to dry on the fence as well.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2016 9:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

That Ospho stuff gets hard as nails when it finally cures completely. At least I won't have to worry about the rust trying to bubble back up from under the paint. I spent quite a while getting the surface prepped and smoothed over for paint today. The weather was nice out again so I didn't have to wait too long for the header paint to cure well enough to be ok to handle.

While it was drying I went ahead and removed the dual cannon exhaust. It's still practically brand new, with just a few spots where some blue overspray misted onto it. I put this exhaust up for sale here in the classifieds if anyone is interested in it. This dual exhaust setup is the kind that has been factory built to clear dual carb setups without modification. This exhaust, like most painted headers out now, comes with a preservative paint on it for shipping and storage. That paint needs to be removed and replaced with high heat header paint in order to stay looking nice. As you can tell by the pics, this exhaust was completely stripped to the bare metal and I put some VHT 2000* header paint on it. The holes for the heat risers have NOT been drilled out yet. They are in the same condition I received them as far as that goes. If anyone want's to use this on a single carb setup they'll need to be drilled. If you want to run this exhaust with dual carbs, like I was planning to do, nothing needs to be done to them.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I also wire wheeled all the nuts, bolts and washers for the exhaust. One exhaust stud pulled out of the head with the nut, so I replaced it with a new one I had on hand. The threads in the head were fine, the nut had just rusted to the stud and it came out of the head with the nut. That particular stud that came out was shorter than all the others for some reason. The stud I replaced it with is the same size as all the others, so they all match now.

The header and the J tubes were loosely bolted up to the engine. Then the heat risers were loosely bolted up next. Once all bolts were in place, I tightened the flanges at the exhaust ports first and then tightened the heat riser flanges last. Everything lined up nicely and fit and looked good.
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After I had the header bolted down it was readily apparent that the quiet pipe wasn't going to fit my frame. The glass pack wants to occupy the same space where the license plate and rear lights are. I'll need to make about a 4-6" extension for the rear bolt on part of the engine cage. Until I can get the material for that, I just covered up the collector on the header with some duct tape for now.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

The brakes are finally done on the Jeep (for now) and the weather is cooperating as well so it's time to get back on the rail project. First I moved the rail over next to the barn so I could be closer to the power and air compressor. I jacked it up and put it on stands, one next to each wheel. I decided to start off by getting the seats out of the way so I'd more room to work in the cab area. While I was under the rail looking everything over I went ahead and unbolted the heavy skid plate. It was only held on with four 1/4" bolts, so I'll be adding more mounting bolts and using counter sunk heads on the new bolts when it goes back on.
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The seat mounting bolts weren't the same from side to side for some reason and they were all pretty much rusted solid. I just lopped all the heads and nuts clean off with the angle grinder and a cut off wheel. I plan on replacing all of that corroded hardware with new stuff anyway, so no loss there. The seats had different mounts from driver to passenger side for some reason. I'm not sure why that is since the frame underneath is the same on both sides.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


When I pulled the seat covers off, I figured out why my fiberglass seats didn't feel as horrible as most people say they usually do. The PO had put about 4-5" of memory foam under the seat cover pads down in the buckets at the bottom of the seats. I'm going to be replacing the seat covers with new ones since mine are cracked and stiff all over. When I do, I'll replace that old and dirty extra foam with some brand new (and clean) memory foam. It was good enough for me the way it was, so I'll just put it back together the same way.
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After the seats were out I tried to pull the steel sheet metal that was under the seats, out from under the aluminum diamond plate. There were a bunch of rivets holding it down everywhere, so I hit the rivet heads I could reach with the angle grinder. I also removed a few self tapping screws from the aluminum so I could get access the the steel sheet below it. It took quite a bit of work to get the hidden rivets separated from the frame. A small 12" crow bar and a hammer helped free it up wherever the angle grinder couldn't reach. There are still a lot of hidden rivets (under the aluminum) in the steel sheet that I didn't get to yet. Rather that dealing with removing the diamond plate, I just cut off the part of the steel sheet that I had freed up. The part of the steel sheet from under the seats was completely covered with holes everywhere. I want to try to make this rail usable year round, so I need to seal up as many of those holes as I can if I want to be able to retain heat in the cab in the winter.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Now that I have access to it, the rusty frame will get coated with Ospho to neutralize the rust. It will also seal it off so rust won't have anywhere to start up again (hopefully). When I replace the sheet metal under the seats, I'll also cover the gap the PO had left under the shift mount box and the shift shaft. That should help keep the elements from directly attacking the parts under the tunnel.

Ok, now comes the question that got me working on this part of the project today. I have a 5 rib transaxle to replace the sedan trans. Since I don't have a traditional tunnel in the way to deal with, I just plan to install the trans level, without using a 10* mount. I want to move the shift mount box higher than it is now to get the shift shaft to align with the hockey stick on the 5 rib. I really don't want to resort to using a 10* mount or one of those aluminum shaft adapters. Can someone here tell me how far up I should raise the shifter mount box to get it to align with the hockey stick?

I recently picked up some material to build a tunnel with. The plan is to figure out the shift mount box height first, and then build the tunnel around it. I still have the tunnel section from the Type 3 that I plan of harvesting the E-brake mount from. That will also be incorporated into the new tunnel as I build it. The seats are only going to allow about 2" between them, so I'll be mocking them up as I build to make sure everything fits together. The two stock heater levers on either side of the E-brake handle will be modified and repurposed to act as manual cutter brakes. I'll have to account for the extra width of those two handles as well when building the part that goes between the seats. At the front, where the tunnel will kick up under the lower windshield bar, I'll be putting the gauges, the key switch, the idiot lights and the front brake proportion valve. I'll make it long enough that I can hide all the wiring and the relays in front of the front part of the tunnel. The rest of the regular switches will go above the windshield between the two horizontal bars. I'll also need to leave room for the windshield wiper motor up there. The radio(s) will go in a custom console that I'll fit between the two center roof bars that run front to back. At the back of the tunnel I'll kick it up there as well and mount the battery cut off switch as well as the fuel cut of valve. Those two will both be built into a covered recess so they don't get bumped by anyone's arms while driving. I may also add some cup holders in the tunnel ahead of the shifter if I decide to get fancy with it.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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cbeck
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2016 5:59 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I believe the easy way out is to locate another shifter box on top of the existing box. I have no idea what the max angle on the stock coupler is. I have a u joint for a coupler which allows me to have my short stick shifter mounted higher and closer to the steering wheel.
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I'm going to be using a lot of pieces of the upper portion of the T3 tunnel in sections. The new shifter mount box will get welded to the existing box. As suggested I'll put the top of it 3" above the bottom box. The T3 tunnel also puts the shifter offset to the drivers side, but I will most likely narrow it so the new upper box is the same width as the one below it. As far as the heater levers go, I'll be replacing them with new ones of my own design. They will be about the same length as the E-brake handle for leverage, and yes, I will be hooking them up like the old school styled setups were done.

For the heat, I don't plan on using the regular VW setup that is run off of the exhaust manifolds. I'd like to use a VW gasoline fueled heater system up front where the battery box is now. From there I'll route the heat to the cab and to a defrost vent. The heat controls will be relocated elsewhere, most likely on the vertical part of the forward tunnel kick up, just below the gauges.

Once I have the shifter and the trans in place I'll be able to measure the length that the shaft will need to be cut to. The shift shaft out of the T3 is in very good shape, so I'll add a weld on adjustable end to it to allow me to hook it up to the shift coupler.

I'm pretty tired right now so I'll just post the pics from today with a caption above each pic describing what the pic is about. If you see something you have a question about, post it up and I'll go into more detail on it.

Tunnel pieces cut up:
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New shifter box profiled and clamped into approximate position:
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Pic showing how much wider the new box is than the old box:
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Shifter alignment will be closer to driver, which is what I wanted:
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Everything roughly mocked up to get an idea of shifter and E-brake handle positions:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This is the top of the fuel filter I plan on running on the rail. I milled the outer area flat around the two threaded ports so I can get a good surface to be able to mount it. The bracket will be regular sheet metal formed into a squared off "U" shape that will bolt to the rear firewall.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This view shows about how much room I now have to fit the bracket with a thick rubber grommet between the body and the hex on the fitting.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I'm drawing up a design for the tunnel in MS Paint and I'll post it up as soon as I finish it. The drawing will give a better idea of how I want to make the tunnel fit the rail and the seats.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 7:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I had to run to town today so I stopped by a tiny JY while I was there. I was able to find a couple of rear wiper assemblies from some mid 90's Jeep Grand Cherokees. I'll probably use the one with the silver arm on it. It looks to be made of stainless since the paint is long gone and there isn't any rust on the arm. I got both of them for $20, which is about half of one of the cheapest new ones on Ebay go for. One of them is a 5 wire and the other is a 6 wire. I'll have to do a little research to figure out which one will work best for my application. If I can only fit one on the front windshield, I may use the other one on the rear window I plan to add.
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The wife wanted to stop by Goodwill while were close by so I went in with her. I was taking a quick glance at the book section when an old book title caught my eye. It was a small hardback titled "King of the Dragsters (The story of Don Garlits)" written by Don Garlits and Brock Yates. When I opened the front cover to look for the price, I just about choked. On the inside of the front cover was what looks like Don Garlits autograph. Shocked Shocked Shocked I bought it for $1.99, but if the autograph is real, I wonder how much this book is actually worth? Cool Very Happy What do you guys think? Is it legit or not? I'll be hunting around on the interweebs tonight to do a little research to see if I can find some examples of his autograph to see if this one looks like a match.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Ok, I'll get back onto the rail project again now. After I got back home I started measuring where I wanted the pieces and parts for the tunnel. I'll be taking those measurements and putting them into a rough drawing. I'll probably have to modify it as I go, but it will be good enough to get me in the ball park. Here's the pics with more notes above them.

Here's the basic tunnel layout with the seats, E-brake and shifter in place. The aluminum yardstick in front of the shifter is showing where the front vertical part will go.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


The yellow ruler shows where the rear vertical part of the tunnel will go. The battery cut off switch and fuel shut off valve will be recessed in here with a cover to protect them. The switch and the valve will be completely isolated from each other with separate compartments on the back of that panel. The idea is that there shouldn't be any chance of fuel leaking onto the battery switch, even if the rail is upside down.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This pic shows that the angle of the forward part of the tunnel will match the angle of the steering wheel.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


The most obvious issue I ran into with this mock up is the passenger seat doesn't want to fit with the 4" wide shift box I have clamped to the 3" wide box below it. I expected that and already had planned to cut and reweld the new box to get it down to 3" wide. I might make it 2.5" so I can keep the tunnel top the same width all along the top of the center piece.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


The holes and cracks you see in the FG buckets will be getting patched up and reinforced before I reinstall them. They seem a little too thin in some areas for my liking and I'd like them to last a while longer. The mounts for them will also be getting remade so they are the same on both sides. I don't plan on adding seat sliders since I'll probably be the only person driving this rail. That should also help me keep the seat height down. Headroom wasn't an issue for me before, so I don't want to add any height to the seat base. I will be sliding the seat base forward about 2" to give the seat back a little more layback angle to it. The head rest will stay in the same place as it originally was.


EDIT:

O.
M.
G.
Shocked

Check this Ebay listing out that I just found! Mine is identical to this one except for the "To so-and-so" above Don's autograph. Mine is also a 1967 first edition, and is in the same overall condition as the one on Ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AUTOGRAPHED-1ST-EDITION-KI...4af599ffec

Now I just have to decide if I want to keep it, or sell it and put that money into the rail. If I can sell my book for what this guy is asking for his, I'll just about be able to afford to get the other carb I need to finish the dual carb setup.
Think
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493


Last edited by GoMopar440 on Thu Apr 21, 2016 9:20 pm; edited 3 times in total
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dustymojave
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 8:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I have that same book and have owned it since the late 60s. Mine didn't have the slip cover when I got it and never had the Garlits autograph. Maybe I should be putting mine up on the ol 'bay...
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Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
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dustymojave
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 8:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Also...Have you considered instead of putting turning brake levers where the heater control levers are at, maybe install the turning brake at the bottom of the forward console with the handle standing up forward of the shift lever in 1st?
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Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 9:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

dustymojave wrote:
Also...Have you considered instead of putting turning brake levers where the heater control levers are at, maybe install the turning brake at the bottom of the forward console with the handle standing up forward of the shift lever in 1st?


I thought of it, but decided against it for ergonomic and safety reasons. The shifter was hard enough to reach where it was at before, so it's getting moved about 1.5-2" rearward when I build the tunnel. Moving the shifter up 3" with the new shift box will also help give it a better fit for my reach while seated. The E-brake would be even farther forward than that and would be difficult to reach while driving IMHO.

Also I don't have a lot of room between the new shifter location and the vertical part of the tunnel. Pulling the E-brake or turning brake handles would probably knock the shifter out of 1st or 3rd gear with the handles up front like that. At best, it would not be a nice surprise if the shifter got kicked out of gear unexpectedly. At the worst, the loss of forward momentum from getting taken out of gear could lead to an accident.

There's also the fact that the handles are, or will be, long enough to obstruct my view of the gauges. If I mounted the hinge part of the handles down inside the tunnel it would effectively shorten the handles enough to clear the gauges, but the other issues would still remain. I'd also have to deal with the E-brake being right in the way if I wanted to remove the shift rod from the tunnel.

So, those are the main reasons why I settled on the location I did for the E-brake and turning handles.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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daanbc
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:49 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Nice find for both items! I to every once in a while search the local thrift stores. Always keeping an eye out for hess trucks and model cars the dealers use to give away. They are becoming less common now then a few years ago. Toys are changing to electronics now. Still love the look of that paint on the rims!
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 9:19 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Since you're planning to eventually add a heater of some sort (presumably old school gas heater ) have you looked into modern diesel heaters? For nearly the same price as some of the old units you could have a brand new heater that would occupy a fraction of the space and put out tons of heat, not to mention still have parts support if necessary .

Not sure if they make a gasoline fueled version, but 22 hours on a gallon of diesel is hard to beat, and the entire unit is very compact.

http://www.webasto.com/us/markets-products/truck/heating-systems/products/air-top-2000-st/
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:47 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I'm not opposed to other options at all. I was thinking about using an old VW gas heater unit, but only because that I hadn't heard about any modern alternatives yet. Thanks for that link BTW. I'll take a look into it and see if I can make something like that work in the space I have available. Diesel fuel wouldn't be a problem. If I go that route I'd just use a small dedicated tank for it. An I agree something modern would most likely have much better parts support than an old VW unit would. I'm not really a purist when it comes to modding vehicles, but I'd feel better leaving the factory VW gas heaters for the people trying to restore their vehicles back to original.

EDIT: It took a bit of searching around through that info in the link posted before I realized that they don't sell directly from that website. A quick google search looking for vendors that were selling the Air Top 2000 ST heater came up with this. http://www.amazon.com/WEBASTO-5000699D-0-9-2-0KW-vessel-27s-WEB-5000699D/dp/B00K8QR586 Everything about the unit looks like it would work great for my rail, except for that $2000 price tag on it. Confused I don't think I even have that much invested into the whole rail at the moment. After looking around a bit further I was able to find some used ones listed on Ebay for about $350-600 and some new ones for around $8-900. I don't know why Amazon's price is so high on this heater. They are usually about the same or a little less than Ebay for most things.
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Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 9:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I've been a bit under the weather lately so I haven't been getting much done on the rail over the last few days. The rain we've been getting for the last four days hasn't been helping either. In place of working outside or out in the barn I've been drawing up the new tunnel on AutoCAD Inventor. I already have the base of it drawn up, but I need to get the angles for the front and back kick ups before I can attach those parts to the base in the drawing. Hopefully I'll be able to get out there tomorrow if the weather and my health cooperates. Tomorrow's forecast calls for only a 10% chance of rain, so chances are good I'll be able to get the measurements I need.

If I feel up to it I'll start welding the pieces of angle I cut for the tunnel frame together afterwards. I've decided to remove the old shift box from it's current location on the frame and weld it directly to the new tunnel base. That will let me fine tune the shifter location so it fits me perfectly. The new tunnel base will be 5' long by 6" tall and only 2.5" wide. I am making the tunnel as narrow as possible to give the most room for the seats. I might have a little extra space when I'm done, but there's always the possibility I may want to change these seats down the road.
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Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493


Last edited by GoMopar440 on Wed Apr 27, 2016 2:31 am; edited 2 times in total
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Aerindel
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 12:07 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Quote:
The rain we've been getting for the last four days hasn't been helping either


Pretty sure I've been getting the same rain. Yeah, it kinda sucks after a couple days of summer to go to pouring rain and mid forty temps.
_________________
Homemade woods/street, bug out rail. IRS, Balljoint front end. 1967 1600cc DP, Weber 32/36 progressive, tri-mil quiet pack. Rear only cutting brakes.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=630046
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 5:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

That rain turned into snow yesterday and the day before. Confused

The second 40 HPMX carb has finally been ordered and should arrive in about a week. I ordered a snail sync tool at the same time, so I'll be able to get both carbs dialed in properly when I start tuning.

A universal throttle cable kit rounded out the order since my current throttle cable and tube have seen better days. I got the 9' Empi throttle cable kit with a plastic sleeve to run the cable through. It can't be any worse than the junk I've already got on the rail now.
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Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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dustymojave
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 2:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I prefer stainless cable and use drip irrigation 1/4" tube for the sleeve. The EMPI is rust-ready cable.

For where you live, I recommend some sort of sealing boot on the ends of the cable sleeve like motorcycle brake cable boots. I've had trouble here in the SoCal desert with getting water inside, freezing and locking up the throttle.

Google "brake cable boot".

Oh Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation
When cutting the cable to length. Hold the end with a vise grip, pull a little light tension, and cut with an acetylene torch. Takes care of fraying and jacked up cutters and lots of little painful holes in your fingers.
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Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
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Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.
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cbeck
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 5:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Nothing like a sharp klien wire rope cutter. Mine will do up to 3/16 nice and clean. My craftsman didn't last 6 months, I can get 4-5 years on the klien's.
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 8:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I'm not worried about using this tube type setup at all. I've had a lot of experience with building RC aircraft that use the tube and rod configuration almost exclusively for the controls. The key is making sure the tube is aligned at both ends and that the aren't any excessive bends in the tube. I'll have lots of places to be able to attach the clamps to support the tube with the new tunnel I'm making.

I figure for the price I paid for the Empi cable kit, I'll be able to get the rail back on the road and running well for now. I'm very familiar with the cable boots you're referring to as I spent most of my life (before back surgery) on dirt bikes. The older bikes are a good place to find those long cable boots on the drum brake cables. If you have a link to where I can find them that would help also. If not, I still have a few links saved where I can find a bunch of old bike parts. Either way, I should be able to find something that will work.

I'll be looking around for some stainless cable to eventually replace this cheap one, but I doubt I'll have it ready to use on the roads in time for this coming winter season. I'll just keep the Empi cable and plastic tube packed with waterproof grease and the ends capped off with the cable boots to get it to last until I can replace it.

That's a good tip on torch cutting the cables. I have a full set of large Oxy/Acetylene bottles and a cutting torch, so I can do it that way fairly easily. I had always been shown (by the riggers in the Navy) to wrap the wire tightly with duct tape over the middle of the cut line and then use a thin high speed cut off wheel to part the cable. The duct tape works very well in keeping the wire strands all held tightly together so they don't fray and separate while cutting. If you don't get the duct tape tight enough it can, and will, still come apart on you while cutting it though.

I still have to enclose the cab first and work out a heat and defrost system before the rail will be ready for cold weather use. I've found a couple of those Webasto big rig truck heaters mentioned above on Ebay used for about $350. At that price point I think it will probably the way I go. I might be able to get a used VW unit for less, but I'll have to buy all the other hard to find stuff to make it work, and it will end up costing more in the long run. I poked around and was able to find just about every internal and external part for the Webasto unit at what seemed to be reasonable prices. The parts cost and availability means I'll be able to maintain the Webasto heater, easier and cheaper, if any problems arise.

I also decided to get a radio for the rail, but not the KT8900R I had originally wanted. Instead I got a much cheaper ($35 vs $100) Baofung UT-5R-TP handheld radio instead. It seems to be one of the most popular hand held radios available today and has a lot of accessories available for it. In addition to the radio itself I also bought a mag base mobile antenna (NA-UT108 SMA-F), a better handheld antenna (I read the stock one sucks), a car battery eliminator, a 3800mAh extended li-ion battery (I read the 8W high power setting eats up the regular battery life fairly quickly), a carrying case and lastly a USB programming cable with the software CD. The UV-5R-TP radio and all the accessories all together were $62.67 total, which is about 2/3 of just the base cost for just the KT-8900R radio alone. This radio will only be dragged out occasionally for trips with other buggies and rails, so I don't want to keep it in the rail all the time. That's another big reason for wanting to go with the handheld radio vs the dash mounted unit. I'll still be able to take it out of the rail and use it as a hand held whenever I want/need to as well so that's another reason to pick the UV-5R-TP over the KT-8900R.

BTW, the "TP" part of the radio name stands for Tri-Power. This model of the UV-5R series of radios can be set at one of three different power output levels. Low is 1W, Medium is 4W and High is 8W. In the CGA thread over on STF, someone had remarked that their standard UV-5R radio was adequate at the regular 5W setting at the distances the vehicles were separated from each other on the trail. I don't really intend to go any farther than standard trail pace spacing so this one should work just as well, if not a little better since mine will be capable of 8W output and will have an external antenna. If the lead and tail vehicles get spaced pretty far apart I should be able to hit either end of the group wherever I may be at the time.

Radio:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/391404343500?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Mobile antenna:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/172063028023?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Handheld antenna:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/252323336022?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Car battery eliminator:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/111954647763?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
3800 mAh extended battery:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/172088059505?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Carrying case:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/331718774395?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
USB programming cable and software CD:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/262278275723?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

EDIT: I need to make a radio holder for when I have it in the rail. I hate having loose junk bouncing around in my vehicle when I'm off road. I saw a nice one listed on Ebay quite a while ago, but I haven't been able to find it again yet. I could just make one myself, so I can make it fit where and how I want it, and that's probably the route I'll actually take. I'll want to make it removable as well so I don't have to look at it all the time when I'm not carrying the radio with me.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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dustymojave
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 10:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

When torch cutting a small cable like a throttle cable, all that is needed is a regular welding tip. A cutting torch is not needed, but will work also without hitting the oxy blow through trigger. The ends of the cable strands will be fused together. Just don't burn yourself with the glowing ends when it lets loose.

As I said before: Google:
- "brake cable boot"
You'll find lots of cable boots.

- also "stainless throttle cable VW"
You'll find the stainless cable alone for about the same price as the whole EMPI kit with the tubing and the crappy cable.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.
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