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static337 Samba Member
Joined: December 04, 2015 Posts: 106 Location: United States
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Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 6:15 pm Post subject: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Put in a new starter in December. Went to drive my car the other day and got nothing but clicking. Exchanged my old starter for a new one and this one has only one option for a female end for the ignition wire where as my other had 3 plugs. Put everything together and went to put the battery terminals back on and the car was attempting to start without the key in the ignition. I'm assuming some wires are crossed somewhere but don't know how that could be. Here is a picture of how I have it installed. Anyone have any ideas of what's going on. Thanks in advance.
Last edited by static337 on Sun Jun 26, 2016 6:28 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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static337 Samba Member
Joined: December 04, 2015 Posts: 106 Location: United States
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Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 6:20 pm Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Also just to add. The last starter worked perfectly fine with no issues before it failed. And I haven't done anything to the wiring but change out the starter. |
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bluebus86 Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010 Posts: 11075
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Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 6:35 pm Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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cant really see what you got hooked up there. the key switch wires should be a spade terminal, one of the red wires. the other ed wire should be aring termination and it is connected to the same stud as the big fat blaxk wire that is from the battery.
dont know what you mean about the old starter having three plugs????? got a photo of the old one?
if you hooked it up as stated above, all should be fine. you could have a defective key switch, but it is rare for them to fail shorted out. you could have a defective starter solinoid, dispite it being new.
remove the wires and ohm out to between the spade terminal and the stud terminal that has the black wire on it, if it is not open circuit, the starter soliniod is defective. also make sure you dont have power on the red wire from the key switch when that wire is removed from the soliniods spade terminal, if you do have volts on it, then you maybe a have a defective jey switch.
good luck
ps also make sure the key switch wire at the soliniod is not bent such that is touching the black wire nor the other red wire, that will also cause this failure. _________________ Help Prevent VW Engine Fires, see this link.....Engine safety wire information
Stop introducing dirt into your oil when adjusting valves ... https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=683022 |
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flyboy161 Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2009 Posts: 2091 Location: Perry, GA
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static337 Samba Member
Joined: December 04, 2015 Posts: 106 Location: United States
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Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 7:03 pm Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Definitely have everything hooked up right according to that diagram. Need to double check that the ignition wire isn't touching anything. Then narrow it down to the starter silinoid or the key switch. Thanks for all the help. |
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KTPhil Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006 Posts: 33875 Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 8:30 pm Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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I bet the wire from the starter switch is contacting the main (battery) terminal on the solenoid. |
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chrism0107 Samba Member
Joined: June 15, 2014 Posts: 30 Location: San Diego
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Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2016 9:08 pm Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Have you checked the grounding strap on the transmission that could be your problem dirty and corroded connections are possible |
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static337 Samba Member
Joined: December 04, 2015 Posts: 106 Location: United States
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2016 1:20 pm Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Turned out to be the ignition wire was touching the other wires somehow the spade connector was bent in. Now all I'm getting is a clunk from the starter. Have new battery terminals. A freshly charged battery. I'm hoping this starter is not bad too. |
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flyboy161 Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2009 Posts: 2091 Location: Perry, GA
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bluebus86 Banned
Joined: September 02, 2010 Posts: 11075
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KTPhil Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006 Posts: 33875 Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2016 2:24 pm Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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How does your starter bushing look? |
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static337 Samba Member
Joined: December 04, 2015 Posts: 106 Location: United States
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Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:16 am Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Definitely think it has to be a bad silonoid as the car was attempting to turn over no problem when the ignition spade was touching the other wires correct me if I'm wrong. |
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flyboy161 Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2009 Posts: 2091 Location: Perry, GA
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Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:23 am Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Amperage is the key to making the solenoid work. You might be suffering from dirty connections at the ignition switch or even the fuse block.. Too much voltage drop can cause this issue. You say the car set up awhile.
Clean all the connections with a small wire brush. Disconnect the battery first. Then make sure the terminal for the "15" wire at the switch and where it comes from on the fuse block is shiny clean. Repeat for terminal "30" and terminal "50" at the switch. Clean up that terminal "50" at the starter.
Retry and report back the results.
Remember, electrons don't like to travel through corrosion. If your spade terminals and connectors look brown and not shiny gold, they are impeding the flow of electrons. _________________ My father's 1970 Beetle-
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=603879
The 1964...Diamond in the rough
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=612776
My 1958 Morocco Bug-
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=611483 |
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flyboy161 Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2009 Posts: 2091 Location: Perry, GA
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Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:37 am Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Like I said, it takes amperage to make things move. One ampere is approximately equivalent to 6.2415093×10 to 18th power electrons moving in one second through a point in time. That's a lot of electrons. If the starter solenoid is rated at 10 amps, then that number is multiplied by 10 and that's a lot of electrons. Any corrosion inhibits the number of electrons and once it drops below the rating of the solenoid you get a clunk, but no finished action.
Voltage drop is a way of checking for a problem. Put a voltmeter red lead on terminal 15 on the ignition switch and the black lead on terminal 50 on the ignition switch. Set the meter on volts and read the meter whilst you turn the switch to start. It should read zero. If it reads anything above zero, that is a voltage drop and is showing that the switch is corroded. Either internally, or at the connections.
Same goes for the wire from terminal 50 back to the starter. If it is corroded internally, then a meter reading my will show above zero volts from one end to the other. _________________ My father's 1970 Beetle-
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=603879
The 1964...Diamond in the rough
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=612776
My 1958 Morocco Bug-
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=611483 |
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static337 Samba Member
Joined: December 04, 2015 Posts: 106 Location: United States
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Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 11:30 am Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Thank you for the info. I'll take a look at all of the connections and clean them. |
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chrism0107 Samba Member
Joined: June 15, 2014 Posts: 30 Location: San Diego
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Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 12:58 pm Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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+1 on ktphil check your starter bushing, after seeing his recommendation I recall having an issue like yours and a new bushing corrected it. also check for the bolt for the solenoid arm pivot. I disassembled mine to clean it up once and forgot to reinstall and had issues. until I removed the starter and saw the bolt/screw missing. found it sitting on my bench vice where I had left it. |
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static337 Samba Member
Joined: December 04, 2015 Posts: 106 Location: United States
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 7:49 am Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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Here's an update. Cleaned all the wiring at the switch and fuse block. Cleaned the ground wire at the tranny. Put new ends on the ignition switch wire at the starter. Now the car will crank over but it is very weak. Not enough to get the car started. Battery was just charged and tested good a couple of days ago. Also starter bushing is good. |
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flyboy161 Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2009 Posts: 2091 Location: Perry, GA
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static337 Samba Member
Joined: December 04, 2015 Posts: 106 Location: United States
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 3:01 pm Post subject: Re: 6v starter wiring issue |
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So touch the generator wire to the ignition wire or use a screwdriver to jump it across? Key in terms on position? |
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flyboy161 Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2009 Posts: 2091 Location: Perry, GA
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