| Author |
Message |
Lencki
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2013
Posts: 33
Location: Kentucky
|
 Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 1:59 pm Post subject: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
 |
|
| Having any issue on my number 4 exhaust valve. There basically is no gap. Can't get .006 even close, but when I loosen nut and adjust screw the gap never changes. Trying to figure out what problem my symptoms point to. I feel like I can fix it, I just don't have much experience on the diagnostic end. Any help would be greatly appreciated |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50336
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 2:05 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| Sure you don't have hydraulic lifters? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lencki
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2013
Posts: 33
Location: Kentucky
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 2:19 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| It does have hydraulic lifters. Like I said I'm not much on diagnosing issues. How do you know if a lifter is bad? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16861
Location: sticksville, ct.
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 2:23 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
stop now....
get the valves to TDC. turn in 1.5 to 1.75 turns. run engine. may sound like hammers to hell, but they should (eventually) pump up. 10-30 oil...no road tar.
may need 2 turns but start there first
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ac78
Samba Member
Joined: March 18, 2008
Posts: 330
Location: Nashville
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 2:52 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
I wouldn't do anything else until you read through this:
http://www.ratwell.com/technical/HydraulicLifters.html
And review Page 61 and 62 starting at 17.2 in your Bentley.(Edited here)
These are not adjusted like any other. Just come back here with any questions.
Good luck!
_________________
78 Westy 2.0l hydr. FI
VW Campmobile
For people who believe a family's
car should be it's castle ! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lencki
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2013
Posts: 33
Location: Kentucky
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 8:47 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| Holy crap. So throw out the feeler gauge, adjust to zero clearance and then go an additional 1.5 turns tighter. So what potential problems did I cause by having them adjusted to .006 for the last year. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lencki
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2013
Posts: 33
Location: Kentucky
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 8:52 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| By the way, thanks for the comments. It's nice to know people who don't know me from Adam care about my bus |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tcash
Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011
Posts: 12844
Location: San Jose, California, USA
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:17 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| Lencki wrote: |
| So what potential problems did I cause by having them adjusted to .006 for the last year. |
The lifter retainer wire or clip could pop out. Possible not probable.
Good luck
Tcash |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
porky79
Samba Member
Joined: October 11, 2015
Posts: 56
Location: Fresno
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:47 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| Lencki wrote: |
| Holy crap. So throw out the feeler gauge, adjust to zero clearance and then go an additional 1.5 turns tighter. So what potential problems did I cause by having them adjusted to .006 for the last year. |
Holy crap if you feel like it but its really not necessary  You're valve timing would be off at worst but if its still running then its no big deal. Do you know for a fact that your engine has hydraulic lifters? It should, but a PO might have changed that... Have you seen them or the pushrods? The correct pushrods would be aluminum with steel tips, but if a PO put solids in then you still wouldn't know for sure until you saw the lifters. If you in fact have hydraulic lifters which is correct for your Bus then yes throw out the feeler gage. Well don't use it for adjusting lifters anyway 1-1/2 turns past contact at TDC for each piston. I haven't touched my lifter adjustment in over 2 years now. The heads and rockers are squeaky clean tho.
_________________
| Wasted youth wrote: |
While this is unpleasant, it is a great learning experience, so I hope I can contribute something useful for next guy. |
| itskyle wrote: |
| "It's ugly, but it gets you there." Nuff said. Kyle |
"The Precious" 79 CA Bay Window BUS runnin hot @ 75 or 80
Vincent ~ 84 Vanagon GL 95% Original |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50336
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:29 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| porky79 wrote: |
| Lencki wrote: |
| Holy crap. So throw out the feeler gauge, adjust to zero clearance and then go an additional 1.5 turns tighter. So what potential problems did I cause by having them adjusted to .006 for the last year. |
Holy crap if you feel like it but its really not necessary You're valve timing would be off at worst but if its still running then its no big deal. Do you know for a fact that your engine has hydraulic lifters? It should, but a PO might have changed that... Have you seen them or the pushrods? The correct pushrods would be aluminum with steel tips, but if a PO put solids in then you still wouldn't know for sure until you saw the lifters. If you in fact have hydraulic lifters which is correct for your Bus then yes throw out the feeler gage. Well don't use it for adjusting lifters anyway 1-1/2 turns past contact at TDC for each piston. I haven't touched my lifter adjustment in over 2 years now. The heads and rockers are squeaky clean tho. |
As others said the retaining clip in the lifter can come out and in the worst case the lifter might come about. The valve timing is not going to be changed more than the tiniest bit and will auto correct when the valves are adjusted properly. Hydraulic lifters used all STEEL push rods, while the original solid lifter pushrods used steel tipped aluminium push rods.
An experienced hand can tell if an engine has hydraulic or solid lifters by feel when doing the adjustment.
It is best to feel for the point of contact by just using ones fingers to turn the adjusting screw in, as the point can be very subtle and easy to miss. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DJfromNH
Samba Member
Joined: June 25, 2016
Posts: 12
Location: New Hampshire
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:02 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
I have the same bus, the following is what I did about 2 weeks ago...
Find out if you actually have hydraulic lifters, magnet on the middle of the pushrod will do (if it sticks then they are hydraulic). Remove adjuster screws and check for wear. Replace if worn, they get beat up pretty bad if run loose. Find TDC for each cylinder starting with #1 and rotate engine counter clockwise. Push on rocker arms, and see if any feel squishy, if so they will need to be pumped up (leave those a bit loose). For others adjust screw until touch, then turn 1.5 - 2 turns in for each. Move on to the next, etc.
When finished run the engine to pump up the lifters, some will be loud and may take 20 minutes to pump up. Let the bus sit until cool and re-adjust the squishy lifters (check others too).
That's what I did, my bus seems happy.
_________________
1978 Bus, 1963 Beetle |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50336
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:35 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| DJfromNH wrote: |
I have the same bus, the following is what I did about 2 weeks ago...
Find out if you actually have hydraulic lifters, magnet on the middle of the pushrod will do (if it sticks then they are hydraulic). Remove adjuster screws and check for wear. Replace if worn, they get beat up pretty bad if run loose. Find TDC for each cylinder starting with #1 and rotate engine counter clockwise. Push on rocker arms, and see if any feel squishy, if so they will need to be pumped up (leave those a bit loose). For others adjust screw until touch, then turn 1.5 - 2 turns in for each. Move on to the next, etc.
When finished run the engine to pump up the lifters, some will be loud and may take 20 minutes to pump up. Let the bus sit until cool and re-adjust the squishy lifters (check others too).
That's what I did, my bus seems happy. |
Hydraulic lifters don't need to be pumped up to be adjusted, you just need to use care in finding the point of zero contact, as I said this point can be very subtle. You do not want to push on the bottom of the rocker when setting hydraulic lifters as this will partially collapse a soft lifter making it impossible to get a proper adjustment. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tcash
Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011
Posts: 12844
Location: San Jose, California, USA
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cmonSTART
Samba Member
Joined: July 15, 2014
Posts: 1915
Location: NH
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 11:19 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
Actually, I find my bus starts more easily if the lifters are not pumped up when I adjust them - you just have to use a bit more "feel" like Wildthings said.
_________________
'78 Bus 2.0FI
de K1IGS |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sawspa
Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2012
Posts: 173
Location: South-East Ohio
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 1:19 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
How is this so screwy. What is Bently talking about with .006 gap? I did this and ran my motor and just couldnt stand the sound. I read up on it, on Colins page, and it fully explained the process. I readjusted my valves according to this, and it took about 30 miles for the lifters to pump up. But its super quiet now. How did Bently get this wrong, or am i misunderstanding the write up?
_________________
1978 Westfalia Campmobile 2.0L oversized ham heads and a stepped up cam, running points and a 76 exhaust "Lefty Loosy" |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
porky79
Samba Member
Joined: October 11, 2015
Posts: 56
Location: Fresno
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 1:53 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| Wildthings wrote: |
Hydraulic lifters used all STEEL push rods, while the original solid lifter pushrods used steel tipped aluminium push rods.
|
My bad... memory.... 
_________________
| Wasted youth wrote: |
While this is unpleasant, it is a great learning experience, so I hope I can contribute something useful for next guy. |
| itskyle wrote: |
| "It's ugly, but it gets you there." Nuff said. Kyle |
"The Precious" 79 CA Bay Window BUS runnin hot @ 75 or 80
Vincent ~ 84 Vanagon GL 95% Original |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lencki
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2013
Posts: 33
Location: Kentucky
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 2:46 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
Alrighty then. So I changed my oil and adjusted my valves 1.5 past contact. What an immediate difference. 1 and 2 are quiet as a mouse right off the rip.
3 and 4, I'm leaning more towards four, still sound pretty rough, but not really any worse than it was. I'm fixing to head out for a little trek, and am hoping it will get better as I go. I did have a nasty adjustment screw on number 4 exhaust that I changed out. So I'm hoping some miles will pump up my lifter and she'll be purrin like a kitten once again.
Again, thanks to all who have replied. Happy motoring |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
curtp07
Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2007
Posts: 874
Location: Mass
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:23 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
When I first ran my bus after sitting a few weeks I was alarmed by the sounds of "clack clack clack"...thought something was busted...
Nope - after 10 mins of driving lifter was fine. If you havent run into it already you may.
_________________
Subaru |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cmonSTART
Samba Member
Joined: July 15, 2014
Posts: 1915
Location: NH
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 5:34 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
Ya, after I put my 78 together it made a terrible tappet sound until I took it for a good long blast down the road. Then suddenly - literally instantly - the lifter filled and it quieted down.
_________________
'78 Bus 2.0FI
de K1IGS |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lencki
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2013
Posts: 33
Location: Kentucky
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2016 7:45 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjusting issue on my 78 bus. 2.0 fuel injected |
|
|
| well, I've had her out for about 60 miles now and still have a pretty awful sounding click in 3 and 4. 1 and 2 are purring like kittens, can barely hear them with ear by back tire. 3 and 4 sound like hammered hell comparably. So I'm considering ordering 2 new lifters for number 4, which brings me to my questions. 1st am I on the right track or are there other things I need to check out before I go that route. And second do I also need to replace my push rod and tube at the same time, or am I just wasting money. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
