Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic
Page: Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 204, 205, 206 ... 233, 234, 235  Next
Jump to:
Forum Index -> Performance/Engines/Transmissions Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Vw1600dellortoGR
Samba Member


Joined: May 01, 2012
Posts: 267

Vw1600dellortoGR is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 11:04 am    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

I came aware of a company in holland that sells an 20w50 oil but it is a API SF/CD spec oil and I was wondering if it will be a good idea, the site says that
• Stable viscosity index.
• Good protection against rust, corrosion and wear.
• Good dispergency and detergency properties.
• Good antifoam properties.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Wildthings
Samba Member


Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50260

Wildthings is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 12:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Vw1600dellortoGR wrote:
I came aware of a company in holland that sells an 20w50 oil but it is a API SF/CD spec oil and I was wondering if it will be a good idea, the site says that
• Stable viscosity index.
• Good protection against rust, corrosion and wear.
• Good dispergency and detergency properties.
• Good antifoam properties.


Why throw out thirty years of technical improvements to your oil? SL rated oils (high mileage oils) are available most anywhere as are SM/SN oils with viscosities with a first number of >10w or with a second number of >30, do avoid the few "Resource Conserving" oils out there which seem to be mostly found in 0w40 and 10w40 weights.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Vw1600dellortoGR
Samba Member


Joined: May 01, 2012
Posts: 267

Vw1600dellortoGR is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 12:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Wildthings wrote:
Vw1600dellortoGR wrote:
I came aware of a company in holland that sells an 20w50 oil but it is a API SF/CD spec oil and I was wondering if it will be a good idea, the site says that
• Stable viscosity index.
• Good protection against rust, corrosion and wear.
• Good dispergency and detergency properties.
• Good antifoam properties.


Why throw out thirty years of technical improvements to your oil? SL rated oils (high mileage oils) are available most anywhere as are SM/SN oils with viscosities with a first number of >10w or with a second number of >30, do avoid the few "Resource Conserving" oils out there which seem to be mostly found in 0w40 and 10w40 weights.


Because it might be an oil good enough for our cams and followers
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Wildthings
Samba Member


Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50260

Wildthings is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 3:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Vw1600dellortoGR wrote:
Wildthings wrote:
Vw1600dellortoGR wrote:
I came aware of a company in holland that sells an 20w50 oil but it is a API SF/CD spec oil and I was wondering if it will be a good idea, the site says that
• Stable viscosity index.
• Good protection against rust, corrosion and wear.
• Good dispergency and detergency properties.
• Good antifoam properties.


Why throw out thirty years of technical improvements to your oil? SL rated oils (high mileage oils) are available most anywhere as are SM/SN oils with viscosities with a first number of >10w or with a second number of >30, do avoid the few "Resource Conserving" oils out there which seem to be mostly found in 0w40 and 10w40 weights.


Because it might be an oil good enough for our cams and followers


I would think you would be better off with a carefully selected modern oil, particularly a modern synthetic that will just shrug off the heat they might see in an aircooled engine.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Vw1600dellortoGR
Samba Member


Joined: May 01, 2012
Posts: 267

Vw1600dellortoGR is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 3:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Wildthings wrote:
Vw1600dellortoGR wrote:
Wildthings wrote:
Vw1600dellortoGR wrote:
I came aware of a company in holland that sells an 20w50 oil but it is a API SF/CD spec oil and I was wondering if it will be a good idea, the site says that
• Stable viscosity index.
• Good protection against rust, corrosion and wear.
• Good dispergency and detergency properties.
• Good antifoam properties.


Why throw out thirty years of technical improvements to your oil? SL rated oils (high mileage oils) are available most anywhere as are SM/SN oils with viscosities with a first number of >10w or with a second number of >30, do avoid the few "Resource Conserving" oils out there which seem to be mostly found in 0w40 and 10w40 weights.


Because it might be an oil good enough for our cams and followers


I would think you would be better off with a carefully selected modern oil, particularly a modern synthetic that will just shrug off the heat they might see in an aircooled engine.

In Europe.there is mutch less variety in oils so I can't find any ones that have enough zddp the ones I can find are very regular oils
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
rockerarm
Samba Member


Joined: December 16, 2009
Posts: 3552
Location: Los Angeles
rockerarm is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 6:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Hi. I guess that Europe doesn't have the spec's that the USA has? Do any of these oil companies that may specifically be in Europe have web site where one can look at a spec sheet that breaks down many of the additives? I know that Chevron and Shell are world wide companies. Are their oils available to you with any interest? If you have a certain companies oil product that you are interested a site you may find of interest is www.bobistheoilguy.com, specifically the VOA (virgin oil analysis) section.
Bill.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
Wildthings
Samba Member


Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50260

Wildthings is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 9:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Vw1600dellortoGR wrote:
Wildthings wrote:
Vw1600dellortoGR wrote:
Wildthings wrote:
Vw1600dellortoGR wrote:
I came aware of a company in holland that sells an 20w50 oil but it is a API SF/CD spec oil and I was wondering if it will be a good idea, the site says that
• Stable viscosity index.
• Good protection against rust, corrosion and wear.
• Good dispergency and detergency properties.
• Good antifoam properties.


Why throw out thirty years of technical improvements to your oil? SL rated oils (high mileage oils) are available most anywhere as are SM/SN oils with viscosities with a first number of >10w or with a second number of >30, do avoid the few "Resource Conserving" oils out there which seem to be mostly found in 0w40 and 10w40 weights.


Because it might be an oil good enough for our cams and followers


I would think you would be better off with a carefully selected modern oil, particularly a modern synthetic that will just shrug off the heat they might see in an aircooled engine.

In Europe.there is mutch less variety in oils so I can't find any ones that have enough zddp the ones I can find are very regular oils


An oil with 1100 PPM (parts per million) zinc should do fine, less is there are other antiwear additives.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Aussiebug
Samba Member


Joined: June 03, 2002
Posts: 2162
Location: Adelaide Australia
Aussiebug is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2016 12:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

You could always try Australian Penrite oils. They make a huge range of oils for classic and vintage cars including a specific oil for bugs. They note "full zinc" on oils for cars which need ZDDP.

Need oil for an old Harley, model T Ford or old Jaguar, they have those too.

There stockist in the USA is
Restoration Supply
Highland Valley Way
Escondido CA
Ph (800) 3067008
_________________
Rob
Rob and Dave's aircooled VW pages
Repairs and maintenance for the home mechanic
http://www.vw-resource.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
jacoby1007
Samba Member


Joined: July 28, 2016
Posts: 105
Location: North Hollywood, CA
jacoby1007 is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 2:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

I feel like I spent the last 3 days reading oil fourms and I still dont feel I found the best oil weight for Southern California. Yes I could have missed something so sorry if it is already posted within the 200+ pages. I also searched my keywords and found a little info but nothing that will help me sleep at night. Smile Engine is older and already broke in. I am also looking at getting a filter and gauge setup but do not have it yet. Not sure if that would change my weight or type of oil.

1. Socal year round oil (is there a type?) 20w-50 15w40 something else?

2. This is for my daily driver 1600DP and I will also be getting a 74-75 Bus. (when I find the one) Should I use a different weight for the pancake engine in the bus?

Think I am going to go with Brad Penn due to so many good reviews on here.

Thanks!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Wildthings
Samba Member


Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50260

Wildthings is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 3:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

jacoby1007 wrote:
I feel like I spent the last 3 days reading oil fourms and I still dont feel I found the best oil weight for Southern California. Yes I could have missed something so sorry if it is already posted within the 200+ pages. I also searched my keywords and found a little info but nothing that will help me sleep at night. Smile Engine is older and already broke in. I am also looking at getting a filter and gauge setup but do not have it yet. Not sure if that would change my weight or type of oil.

1. Socal year round oil (is there a type?) 20w-50 15w40 something else?

2. This is for my daily driver 1600DP and I will also be getting a 74-75 Bus. (when I find the one) Should I use a different weight for the pancake engine in the bus?

Think I am going to go with Brad Penn due to so many good reviews on here.

Thanks!


Both the Type 1 and Type 4 engines have similar oil cooling systems that are dependent on fairly low pressure for oil to pass through the cooler. If you do something that jacks the pressure up less oil will pass through the cooler and thus the oil will run hotter and the level of engine protection within limits will be no better than if you had run thinner oil. You want an oil that gives you a minimum of 10 psi per thousand RPMs when the engine is hot, you don't need or want an oil that gives a whole lot more oil pressure than that. Synthetic oils can handle more heat than can dino oils so offer a higher level of protection in severe conditions and will keep
the engine cleaner.

Maybe start with a 5w30 "high mileage" oil and see what your oil pressure runs and go from there.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
rockerarm
Samba Member


Joined: December 16, 2009
Posts: 3552
Location: Los Angeles
rockerarm is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 4:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Hi. Mr Jacoby, you bring up some very valid points, even if you didn't intend to.
An ideal oil weight may depend on many factors. One easily method is the 10psi (oil pressure) per 1000rpm, when the engine is fully warmed up.
Another topic is oil brands. A $5k to $10k engine's owner might want a different (expensive) oil than a completely stock (over the counter oil) style engine. Each of these engine's may demand a different lubricant. The actual engine's builder, or cam/lifter supplier could dictate the required oil desired.
Breaking in a new engine's cam/lifters could require a more robust oil vs the oil for the same engines routine maintenance.
Another key item here is product loyalty. You will find folks will not budge from what that person has successfully used in the past. I admit I was one of those "sheeple" who followed what I "was told was good".
Hope this helps, Bill
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
wcfvw69 Premium Member
Samba Purist


Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13383
Location: Arizona
wcfvw69 is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 4:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

jacoby1007 wrote:
I feel like I spent the last 3 days reading oil fourms and I still dont feel I found the best oil weight for Southern California. Yes I could have missed something so sorry if it is already posted within the 200+ pages. I also searched my keywords and found a little info but nothing that will help me sleep at night. Smile Engine is older and already broke in. I am also looking at getting a filter and gauge setup but do not have it yet. Not sure if that would change my weight or type of oil.

1. Socal year round oil (is there a type?) 20w-50 15w40 something else?

2. This is for my daily driver 1600DP and I will also be getting a 74-75 Bus. (when I find the one) Should I use a different weight for the pancake engine in the bus?

Think I am going to go with Brad Penn due to so many good reviews on here.

Thanks!


If your engines are in good shape with tight bearing clearances, all you need is 10W-30 oil. I'm in hot Phoenix and run it year around. I run Valvoline VR1 racing oil for the Zinc. You do want an oil that has more zinc than what's in most oils today. Brad Penn is well thought of for flat tappet cam engines like our VW's.
_________________
Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc

Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.

**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche fuel pumps or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche distributors or I can restore yours**
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Danwvw
Samba Member


Joined: July 31, 2012
Posts: 8892
Location: Oregon Coast
Danwvw is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 4:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

misterkey wrote:
Here: Oil Viscosity What brand and type of oil do you recommend ? What should be the oil viscosity for a 74 Thing with original engion?


Not sure if the "Thing" should run a special oil, don't see why any kind of USA SAE Automobile oil for gas engines wouldn't work, I was running Castrol oil 5W30 plus ZDDP but switched to a full synthetic Mobile 1 0W40 which has enough ZDDP in it. The Mobile 1 does not stay in the engine any better though than the 5W30 GTX did though. I think VR-1 was the oil of preference for the Air Cooled engines though. I don't think you can find that anywhere anymore.
_________________
1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Facebook Twitter Gallery Classifieds Feedback
rockerarm
Samba Member


Joined: December 16, 2009
Posts: 3552
Location: Los Angeles
rockerarm is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 5:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Hi. As Bill states he likes the Valvoline VR1. It looks to me to be an adequate oil for oem engines and mild motors as well. Looks to have adequate zinc/phosphorus/calcium/etc for a street car. Lots of viscosity choices also.
I've seen this oil at numerous stores but haven't compared it with the spec sheets. Napa is a big supplier of this oil, I've heard.
Here is the spec sheet.
http://content.valvoline.com/pdf/vr1_racing.pd

Hope this helps, Bill
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
rockerarm
Samba Member


Joined: December 16, 2009
Posts: 3552
Location: Los Angeles
rockerarm is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 5:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Danwvw wrote:
misterkey wrote:
Here: Oil Viscosity What brand and type of oil do you recommend ? What should be the oil viscosity for a 74 Thing with original engion?


Not sure if the "Thing" should run a special oil, don't see why any kind of USA SAE Automobile oil for gas engines wouldn't work, I was running Castrol oil 5W30 plus ZDDP but switched to a full synthetic Mobile 1 0W40 which has enough ZDDP in it. The Mobile 1 does not stay in the engine any better though than the 5W30 GTX did though. I think VR-1 was the oil of preference for the Air Cooled engines though. I don't think you can find that anywhere anymore.


Hi. A VW Thing with the standard type 1 engine should fit the same requirements as many other type 1 engines.
Castrol GTX's oil is praised my some and criticized by some, as it does not meet some basic requirements for a flat tappet engine, and that's Castrol's wording, not mine. But many people swear by its history within the air-cooled community. Castrol's 30wt used to be called the VW oil. The 20w-50 had to be in second place here.

For a synthetic, Mobil 1's 0w-40 has to be the gold standard here. It is the only Mobil 1 oil that is recommended by Porsche.

Bill
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
rockerarm
Samba Member


Joined: December 16, 2009
Posts: 3552
Location: Los Angeles
rockerarm is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 6:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Hi. Maybe I can assure some folks here on lubricants for many production/oem or even mildly built engines.

1- I worked for a couple of VW dealers back in the days when VWoA was transitioning from air-cooled to water-cooled. These dealers were pumping 20w-50 oils in the Los Angeles area. With the introduction of the 1977 Rabbit diesel engine the dealers did not make a change in the lubricants used. We used the 20w-50 passenger car oil in these diesel engines. RESULT: I performed no engine repairs based off the use of this oil.

2- I worked for a gov't agency that utilized passenger cars, SUV's, light pick-up truck's, etc for their fleet. The motor oil was a 15w-40, old school, diesel spec oil. Ford motor company once they heard of the lubricants being used on their fleet stated there would not be any warranty, as Ford was recommending a 20wt oil for their new fleet, if an engine failure occurred.
RESULT: In over 20 years I saw no engine failures that could be attributed to a too thick of a viscosity. Not one vehicle went to the dealer for an oil related failure.

3- I worked, briefly, as a military contractor, and assisting the light wheel mechanics at a motor pool viewed that the oil of choice was a "recycled" or "reclaimed" motor oil for all of the diesel powered military vehicles (Humvee's and larger). RESULT: I never saw an oil related issue with the use of these oils or operator failure while in the field.

So, bottom line, or endstate, is the motor oil choice may not be as big a heartburn as some sambanistas believe! But there are definitely oils to stay away from.
Hooah. Bill
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
Wildthings
Samba Member


Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50260

Wildthings is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 6:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

rockerarm wrote:

So, bottom line, or endstate, is the motor oil choice may not be as big a heartburn as some sambanistas believe! But there are definitely oils to stay away from.
Hooah. Bill
Having insufficient oil in the crankcase is worse than using the cheapest oil you can find at Walmart or on supermarket shelves.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
wcfvw69 Premium Member
Samba Purist


Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13383
Location: Arizona
wcfvw69 is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 6:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

I'm really surprised VW dealers were using 20w-50 weight in an aircooled VW with its sensitivities to oil pressure's effect on the oil relief valve. The higher the oil pressure, the longer it takes for the oil to heat up and thin enough (and the pressure to drop enough) to allow oil through the oil cooler byway of the relief valve.

I've never run any kind of 50 weight oil in 35 years of owning air cooled VW's. Living in Phoenix, I WAS running 10w-40 in my VW's. I read that it could create higher oil temperatures. I dropped to 10W-30 and saw about a 8-10* oil temperature reduction. Now, it's important to be clear that my engines have all been single relief cases so maybe the dual relief cases are not as sensitive to thick oil?
_________________
Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc

Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.

**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche fuel pumps or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche distributors or I can restore yours**
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Danwvw
Samba Member


Joined: July 31, 2012
Posts: 8892
Location: Oregon Coast
Danwvw is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2016 7:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

I've run 10W40 and 20W50 years ago in old engines! Thank goodness though they had 21mm oil pumps!
_________________
1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Facebook Twitter Gallery Classifieds Feedback
vugbug68
Samba Member


Joined: June 25, 2006
Posts: 2696
Location: sacramento
vugbug68 is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:21 am    Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic Reply with quote

Does anyone have pictures of damage caused by a certain kind of oil? Not an old engine with worn journals and bearings but a new engine that was built correctly and broke in correctly. The only explanation for the damage is the oil.

Just curious???

I've built several VW engines over the years and never had a cam go flat or a lifter get damaged. In fact I've rarely seen damaged cam lobes or lifters on old beat up engines I've torn apart.
_________________
71 Super - Backroad Thrasher
66 Corvair - Weekend Cruiser
90 4 Runner - Muddin
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Performance/Engines/Transmissions All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 204, 205, 206 ... 233, 234, 235  Next
Jump to:
Page 205 of 235

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2023, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB
Links to eBay or other vendor sites may be affiliate links where the site receives compensation.