Megasquirt 2 system assembly and installation

esde

While my car was running really well last year and this year on some Dellorto 45's and one of Glenn's 010 distributors, I've been curious about the megasquirt system for a long time and have wanted to build one for something. As much as I love the old school carbs and distributor, trying something new that I haven't done seems like fun, plus I'll get to learn how to tune using the tuner studio software. There is a turbo engine in the 1.5-2 year future for my car, so probably better to learn the tuning now on an NA motor. I read as much as I could here, on shoptalk, the msextra.com forums, and talked with Mario at thedubshop.com, and finally took the plunge and ordered the MS2v3.0 kit, relay board, and ignition kit. I've been soldering electronics since I was a kid, but this is still intimidating. Thankfully Mario pointed me in the right direction to the instructions on msextra

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Made slow progress at first

But got confident and finished it up in a few evening sessions. I added the extra drivers for wasted spark, boost control, and the circuit for launch control. Had to run to radio shack for a few resistors that the cat ran off with. I can't believe that place is still in business, but thankfully they have a big selection and set me up..

Got it powered up with the jimstim, first success!

And then got shot down trying to load the firmware with my mac

Apparently it was mostly my ignorance of Unix programming, coupled with the way the system works with the mac. Only took days and me bugging the bejeezus out of many kind people. Thanks go to many for that one
I started looking for the hardware with the idea that I'd go the cheap route and scrounge the throttle bodies, injectors, pump, and sensors. Here's my mock up with a junk 48mm LT1 throttle body and a spare offset manifold.

I had figured out how to do the linkage, and fit the injector bosses into the throttle bodies, but it was just turning into too much time. I typically have a dozen projects cooking at once, plus my real job, family, and house. So, I ordered the CB throttle bodies, and the rest of the ignition stuff from Mario.

Some of the bits I sourced from other places I'm friendly with, my fuel injectors and pump came from a local shop. It's the walbro 255lph which should be enough. The injectors are matched Bosch gen3 32lb/hr, and I have an issue with them fitting the CB throttle bodies. Seems the step above the 14mm o-ring is 1mm larger than the bore they are supposed to fit into. I will either machine .5 off the outside of the injector, or bore the TB and be done with it.

As things would happen my engine divorced its flywheel and pulley
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=633745&highlight=
and I ended up pulling the engine out and apart. Time to fit the new pulley, from Jaycee, here it is fitting the trigger wheel

Here are the wires for the injectors and sensors, all twisted with the ends in braided sleeve. I hate sloppy wiring so making it neat is very important! As soon as my engine is dressed with tin and everything again I can figure out the lengths and make these into one nice harness.

Bought the nice ratcheting crimper to use with the weather pack terminals too,
WOW, this thing makes nice connections! I will be hard pressed to ever use a regular squash crimp end again.
And last for now, the fuel system. I picked up a roll of 3/8" stainless tube and have run hard lines through the tunnel for the supply and return. No pics till later as I've moved the car to storage for a few months while I get the engine sorted. The flex lines are all AN-6, except the tank to pump, which is AN-8. The tank to AN-8 fitting is from CB, the m10-1.0 X AN-6 fitting for the pump are ebay, and the balance of the fittings and braided PTFE hose is from anfittingsdirect, which someone on STF turned me on to.

So, as I'm doing this I welcome any criticism, or a friendly heads up that I've made some critical mistake. I've read that many people are running the MS systems, but there aren't many start to finish builds here. There are a few on STF, but hosting pics there sucks so people just skip it..
Hope to have this up and running in 2-3 months, I'll add pics as I chip away at it.
SD

clonebug · Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 9:21 pm Post subject:

Nice to see you make the move to MS ESDE....I'm sure you will like it.

I moved to it 4 years ago and never looked back. I haven't had to pull a carb or get gas on my hands since.

Don't wait too long to put that turbo on... that is where MS shines.....tuning for boost is a pleasure.

With those 32 lb injectors, you should be good to around 230 hp.

I'm getting close with my 1679 cc turbo.

Post some pics of the car it's going into.
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esde · Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 9:39 pm Post subject:

Thanks clonebug. I've learned a ton reading through your documented tuning.
This motor's not really set up for a turbo, I don't think. The compression is on the high side, and its got the hyper eutectic pistons. The turbo motor will be down the road, I have the case/ crank/ rods, pistons/cam/ lifters. Nothing measured, balanced, mocked, etc, so it'll be a while. The turbo and heads will set me back a bunch, so, next year..
The car is one my father bought me when I was 15, here it is now

Back then

I'm sure my dad would be amused to think I've been working on this for 28 years. Rest in peace dad.

esde · Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 9:43 pm Post subject:

j-dub · Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2015 10:09 pm Post subject:

Looking forward to following along with your build, looks like you have a nice start. Dancing

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andy198712 · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 3:29 am Post subject:

Nice one! My ms had been 100%reliable!

How are you doing the return to the tank?
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raul arrese · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 4:56 am Post subject:

Sweet !!!!! I made the move to fuel injection almost 25 years ago and have never looked back , I love carbs but they had there place and time ... your gonna love it !!!!!
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Casting Timmy · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 5:49 am Post subject:

Very interested to follow this. I want to run wasted spark first and then go to injection as well.

Dale M. · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 6:21 am Post subject:

Good to see another one to leave the land of carbs ...And see enlightenment...

Dale
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TinCanFab · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 6:24 am Post subject:

Very nice. We have an extremely similar conversion going. MS, Teflon hose, ITB's, clean wiring, trigger wheel, same pump and regulator, etc. I'll be watching Cool

I'd like to second what you've said about modifying the IDF manifolds and making matching rails. It's a HUGE undertaking to save a few bucks for an average Joe, but can be done.

Looks like I used the same injector bosses that you have? Ross machine

I too liked traditional carb setups, but was kind of bored with it. I was looking at the advantages of EFI and if you do it right, you'll get the most out of your combo. Getting everything set up snug and not crooked on the manifolds took me about 6 months working on it a little here and there. Making my harnesses as clean as possible has been my favorite part of the project.

I hate nasty wiring too, and if I see it on a dub, I just want to rip it out!
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They're never really ever finished 58 rag build...
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=658092

DeathBySnuSnu · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:37 pm Post subject:

I did not even try to mod the intakes.
Just started from scratch and made them to suit.

esde · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 5:09 pm Post subject:

DeathBySnuSnu · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 9:00 pm Post subject:

Mine is all cable linkage.
It is in a motorcycle and there is no clearance issues to deal with, sorta like an open engine buggy but straddling the engine with an intake by each knee.
Thone are 44mm butterfly but 43mm under the butterfly. Not crazy huge but hopefully big enough for my 2387.

TinCanFab · Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 7:15 am Post subject:

Bugzilla

clonebug · Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 8:54 am Post subject:

If you use Bosch injectors and GM sensors you can have Mario make up the twisted pair harnesses with expanded wrap for each run.
I got wiring for 4 injectors, IAT, CLT, TPS and crank sensor with the plugs installed then cut them to length and hooked them to the Relay board.
The nice thing about that is it is color coded for his wiring diagram and is easy to check.
You can wrap all them together and make a single harness after you have everything fitted for correct length.
Just order some harness wrap from him to cover it all in one unit.
It does take time to place it and make it look nice.
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Howard 111 · Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:39 am Post subject:

I run a CB, Turbo/FI system because I don't know the electronics of it at all. Just seeing that circuit board you have there would send me into shock. But I see the appeal of constructing it from scratch like you are doing.

I don't have to understand it to see you are doing a top notch job with it. Thanks for providing the photos and dialog as you put it together piece by piece. It should be a fantastic addition to your car! Very Happy

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1973 Karmann Ghia
Turbocharged, Fuel Injected
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=531270

esde · Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 12:56 pm Post subject:

nogoodwithusernames · Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:21 pm Post subject:

This is just the thread I was looking for!

I've been thinking about running EFI on a new motor I am building (The mileage master from ACN) and it looks *easy* enough anyways that I could do it. (With help from some more experienced members at least!)

My biggest question though, is if it is justifiable over carbs? I am thinking that an EFI setup would be double the cost of a nice dual carb kit, and does the increased efficiency and "trouble free" running make it worth it?
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71 Squareback, 1.7l T4 w/ crank trigger fuel and spark
(Conversion thread https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=732508&highlight= or https://shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=151375&sid=f0542d44a322d290c29d6609fac7f215 )
74 914, 2.0L w/ D-Jet

-Derek

gprudenciop · Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:28 pm Post subject:

WORTH EVERY PENNY!!!!!
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Megasquirt 2 system assembly and installation
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