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kfdf715 Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2005 Posts: 11
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 5:36 pm Post subject: Cutting off top of Baja Bug |
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Has anyone cut off the top of a baja bug and was it successful? I have been told that the center of the vehicle would be structurally weak. I have also heard that you can support the center of the vehicle by welding tabs off of the doors. Any help would be appreciated. Not using the baja for racing, only pleasure. |
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BugZyla.com Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2004 Posts: 642 Location: Mesa, AZ
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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Dont do it unless you plan on putting a full cage in the car. It may seem OK at first, but you drive it a little while and the doors wont shut anymore. If you really want one with the top off........get a convertible. _________________ Daryll http://www.azbaja.com P.R.
http://www.bugzyla.com
"Why is there Braille on a Drive Thru ATM?" |
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vwposeur Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2005 Posts: 19 Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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axishp wrote: |
Dont do it unless you plan on putting a full cage in the car. It may seem OK at first, but you drive it a little while and the doors wont shut anymore. If you really want one with the top off........get a convertible. |
Would a class 11 cage be enough to keep the pan from flexing? I might do the same, but I want to make damnsure it'll work right before cutting. How 'bout with the doors off, too? |
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SHMO Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2004 Posts: 1647 Location: Lynden, Washington
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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I totally agree about using a roll cage when removing the top from a sedan body. Convertible bodies are a different breed. Gussets in the doorjambs will not be nearly enough. Use a roll cage to add some integrity to the car, or end up with sagging like Axishp mentioned.
On the other hand, I totally disagree with the advice of using a convertible body (unless you can find one already cut into a Baja). The cars are too valuable to chop up. And, They are also prone to sagging when used off road; hence they benefit from a roll cage as well.
Another point I would like to make is regarding safety. Nobody “plans” to put his or her car upside down. However, rolling over with no roof and no roll cage is a definite way to get hurt. Use a roll cage, especially without the protection of a roof!
There are several ways to remove the top of a sedan body. It is very similar to the different ways of trimming for a Baja kit. It is all preference, and some plans do take more time and work than others. It would be a good idea to take some time in the gallery and searching online to see how others have done it. The process is actually VERY common. In the end, yours will be one of the countless chopped top sedans running around.
Here is my car with the top removed. It was fairly extensive to do. Nevertheless, I am happy with the way it turned out.
SHMO
Pics are clickable for a slightly larger view
_________________ SHMO's Baja |
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BugZyla.com Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2004 Posts: 642 Location: Mesa, AZ
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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First thing....Nice job on your Baja Shmo.
If I were going to do a topless car, I would tie the cage into the rear torsion, and the front beam. If you only mount the cage to the floor, its only as strong as the thin sheet metal you are mounting it to.
I actually bought a topless car that was beat up real bad. This is the cage that I that I removed from it that is going in my Baja.
As you can see it still has a torsion welded to it, and bars that run to the front beam. _________________ Daryll http://www.azbaja.com P.R.
http://www.bugzyla.com
"Why is there Braille on a Drive Thru ATM?" |
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kfdf715 Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2005 Posts: 11
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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I appreciate the feedback and by the way, that baja SHMO with the cut off top is unreal. I forgot to mention that I was going to use a 6 point roll cage in the baja. I was still told that this may not be enough support and would sag in the middle. They mentioned somehow joining the cage to the sides of the vehicle as well as the floor. I dont want to put a ton of money into this and have it fail. |
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vwposeur Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2005 Posts: 19 Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:41 pm Post subject: |
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I would like to take this opportunity to say to SHMO that you are damngood with the bodywork, mang!
One question I have about chop tops is the windshield frame. In your pics it looks like you cut pretty close to the glass. Do you need to reinforce the metal around the windshield area once its been cut? |
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kfdf715 Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2005 Posts: 11
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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I must say SHMO that I am idolizing your baja. How did you cut off the top ie. sawzall or what? How did you close up the gap between the sheet metal around the vehicle. Welded all around? Bondo? |
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dvd8n Samba Member
Joined: May 28, 2005 Posts: 36
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Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 7:45 am Post subject: |
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How about welding the doors up to add strength? Would that work? |
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bajaherbie Samba Sooner
Joined: November 27, 2003 Posts: 2985 Location: altus, oklahoma
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Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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cage the car from front to back. keep the doors functional, in an emergency, you would appreciate the door being able to open. _________________ blank |
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SHMO Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2004 Posts: 1647 Location: Lynden, Washington
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 12:09 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the compliments guys.
My chopped top was pretty involved. Basically, I removed the whole top portion from the rear of the car. I then built a tubular framework to act as an under-structure and provide the rounded edge for all the radiuses. While I was dong the tube work, I widened the tops of the quarter panels quite a bit to better match the doors. I also built recessed areas into the tops of the quarters for the shocks to pass through. Everything was then capped with sheet metal. The rear deck was hammer worked to provide a very slight crown.
The doors were shaped at the front to add a little swoopiness before being capped with sheet metal. The doors are also radiused to match the factory lines.
The windshield frame was cut pretty close. I then capped off the open end with sheet metal. While I was there, I did some massaging on the A-pillar to remove the factory groove for a smooth look. The drip rail was also slightly modified. The door and A-pillar now fit perfectly with each other, actually fitting into each other like a puzzle. The roll cage is also tied into the A-pillar for extra support with a simple gusset. On the rear deck area, I added some steel detailing around the roll cage.
Basically, this isn’t a good project for a first time metal worker….lol
I will try to find some close-up pics of the detail areas.
SHMO _________________ SHMO's Baja |
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SHMO Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2004 Posts: 1647 Location: Lynden, Washington
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 12:44 am Post subject: |
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Heres a few shots to kind of give you an idea. In these pics, you can see the detail around the roll cage, The rear deck section, the shape of the doors, The A-pillars, the widended quarters and the windshield gussets.
SHMO
_________________ SHMO's Baja |
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bajaherbie Samba Sooner
Joined: November 27, 2003 Posts: 2985 Location: altus, oklahoma
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 5:24 am Post subject: |
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shmo, let me guess, you did all that work with body tools from harbor freight?? _________________ blank |
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HamburgerBrad Je suis Napoléon!
Joined: February 21, 2003 Posts: 6957 Location: SoCal
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 8:39 am Post subject: |
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your talent makes me sick _________________ OGST | CU05 | OGJHC
1970 baja|1953 oval
Wanted: two beat up, ugly, curb rashed 6" phone dial wheels |
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SHMO Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2004 Posts: 1647 Location: Lynden, Washington
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 10:43 am Post subject: |
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Hmmmm I didn't actually use harbor freight, but I did do everything with run of the mill tools. It's surprising how much you can do with a good cutoff wheel, a body hammer and a welder. It just takes time. It also helps to have a good game plan before you start.
SHMO _________________ SHMO's Baja |
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bljones Resident Wit
Joined: February 08, 2002 Posts: 2377 Location: ontario canada
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 11:05 am Post subject: |
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Just a simple weekend project.
SHMO wrote: |
It also helps to have a good game plan before you start.
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Plan? i don' need no steenkin' plan. what fun is that?
Seriously, it is beautiful work. _________________ OG JHC
Author of Original Rant #1
"It stingd itself to dead... now that is control on you"
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kfdf715 Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2005 Posts: 11
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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Hey SHMO, when you cut off the top, you end up with a gap in between the door inside and outside. How did you finish that? Was it sheet metal welded to close the gap and then filler. I am still debating cutting off the top becuase I am afraid I will not have the resources to finish it correctly. My buddy does a lot of welding, but is concerned welding to the thin sheet metal and causing more damage. |
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Tim10 Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2004 Posts: 1433 Location: Minneapolis
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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Back in my nuttier days I tried to do this --- very tough.
Most of us can't pull off a clean/smooth 1 piece front end without trying to bring all the beauty stuff to eye level.
I've parted a few verts -- they do have tons more metal going various directions...just start at the cross-bar and rear seat.... then check under the front arc.
We have a vert --- it's a pre 63... this car flexes just driving down the road... probably not the next jumping option.
SHMO... for us average guys... would you suggest starting with a Rail then doing aluminum panels? Wouldn't this basically do the same thing for the same budget? |
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SHMO Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2004 Posts: 1647 Location: Lynden, Washington
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Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2005 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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Tim, I think your right. Building a rail with aluminum panels would be considerably easier than what I did. However, a rail is going to lack the "car feeling" a topless Baja will have. In my car there is no wind blowing up your pant leg, the door panels are soft on the elbows, it's quiet, it's easy to get in and out of. But on the flip side, a Baja is going to be heavier and probably won't perform as well as a rail with everything else being equal. It all boils down to what you want from the vehicle, and everyone has their own preference.
For those considering doing a chop top, here is my advice. I think most of us have seen at least a few chopped Bajas. Most of them are done "quick and dirty". If having a topless car is you main concern and you would be content with having some rough edges, by all means go for it. However, I cannot stress enough that performing a chop similiar to mine is not a good idea for a novice sheet metal worker. The difference in effort to do a weekend chop and a chop done like mine is enormous.
When you remove the top you will have SEVERAL areas that need attention. Here is a pic in the early stages to show roughly what it looks like with the top removed. You should be able to see the difference in widths from the doors to the quarter panels. You can also see the windshield frame that has open edges, as well as the edges where the door posts were removed and rear sail panels opened up. In the pics you can see where I had just started to work the sheet metal radius on the drivers side where the door jambs come together. You can also see where I have built a door gap section on the top surfaces. When the top is removed it leaves nothing but an open edge in that area. Keep in mind, all of the cuts throughout the removal leave a square raw edge. A lot of work goes into incorporating radiused corners and filling in areas that become open holes when the top is taken away.
SHMO
_________________ SHMO's Baja |
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Metal Twister Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2013 Posts: 405 Location: licking, MO.
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Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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Old thread but I found it helpful in making our decision to press forward.
We followed SHMO's lead and went ahead an lopped off the top. I think the key is tying the body to the cage nice and tight. My buddy got to crazy trimming up the cowl in front of the doors so I lopped off the windshield frame as well and replaced it with the front hoop of the cage. Not done but its going to be just fine I'm sure.
_________________ Change is Opportunity!
Instagram=metaltwister |
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