Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Koni shocks
Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
Forum Index -> Vanagon Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
airkooledchris
Samba Member


Joined: January 25, 2005
Posts: 2700

airkooledchris is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

markz2004 wrote:
Can anyone who switched to Koni shocks comment on an improvement in "nose dive" the van may experience during breaking?


that is exactly why I bought my Koni's and they did wonders for the nose dive under heavy breaking. adjusted to be slightly stiffer than they come out of the box in the back and adjusted to be slightly softer than they come out of the box up front seems to be the perfect settings for my aircooled westy.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
1621
Samba Member


Joined: May 15, 2006
Posts: 2174

1621 is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

randywebb wrote:
are you guys comparing NEW Bilsteins with new Konis??

or OLD shocks with new one?

FWIW, Bilstein will revalve your chocks for a nominal fee (at least they will for the ones that fit a Porsche 911) and set the jounce or rebound wherever you want it.

on the aforementioned 'azz-engined nazi-slot car' the typical hot setup is Bilsteins, not Konis

maybe the ones of the Vanagon are not as good, I dunno re that


2 year old Bilsteins to new Koni's. Even new the Bilsteins were a bit bouncy, but an improvement over the tired stock shocks.

The Bilsteins are set to the factory rebound rates, just a more solid construction. The HDs are NOT any stiffer than the TCs, just a stouter construction designed to cycle more without failing. You can have them rebuilt, but it's an additional cost over purchasing them to begin with. Also, if you have it done you're still left with no adjustability should you decide the rebound rate is not to your liking.

The Konis lightest setting is the stock rebound rate for the Vanagon. Turning them all the way out will give approximately 100% increase in rebound rate. I set mine to 75% and love the difference. There are some who don't care for the ride in my van, stiffer in some respects, but the confidence I have in turns, stops, high winds is more important to me than a cushier ride.

BTW- the ride is not harsh by any means, just firmer. Could also be a combination of tires, tire pressure, springs, etc.
_________________
'85 Westy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
SeattleDownhill
Samba Member


Joined: July 29, 2009
Posts: 131
Location: Seattle
SeattleDownhill is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm liking the sound of Koni's. I race downhill mountain bikes, so I can see the adjustability being really nice to tune in the ride quality.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
randywebb
Samba Member


Joined: February 15, 2005
Posts: 3815
Location: Greater Metropolitan Nimrod, Orygun
randywebb is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

" The HDs are NOT any stiffer..."

for other cars, Bilstein Sports are significantly stiffer than HDs.

you may want to run various shocks on a dyno to really find out what is going on


what we all really want is an active shock...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
pighamling
Samba Member


Joined: November 30, 2007
Posts: 67
Location: Southern NM
pighamling is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Konis on sale at Tire rack now.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
r39o
Samba Polizei


Joined: May 18, 2005
Posts: 9800
Location: San Diego
r39o is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pighamling wrote:
Konis on sale at Tire rack now.

Set of 4 is $362

Set of 4 at shox.com is $361.20 and they have FREE shipping.

Not a good sale.

You got my hopes up for nothing, sigh.......
_________________
"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!

1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....

Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
EvanDJ
Samba Member


Joined: December 15, 2009
Posts: 49
Location: Minnesota
EvanDJ is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Bilstein HD's that my son installed on our camper did not add any noticeable degradation in ride quality so that makes me think that they are valved pretty close to what the originals were. Still a pretty soft ride IMHO; you will NEVER think that you put on some stiffer shocks Smile

My opinion is get in touch with them (Koni & Bilstein) via e-mail and tell them what application you have, trying to achieve, etc. so they can make an appropriate recommendation on what is needed. Both of these companies will build whatever you desire for any application you have in mind. The choices and prices they offer will boggle the mind, at least it did mine when I was still seriously playing with cars Smile

http://www.koni-na.com/index.cfm

http://www.bilsteinus.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
markz2004
Samba Member


Joined: November 13, 2007
Posts: 944
Location: Portland, OR
markz2004 is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

r39o wrote:


Set of 4 at shox.com is $361.20 and they have FREE shipping.



That's what I got a last week. Got the Koni's in and I do like them much better than the Bilstein's I had on previously. To be fair, the the Bilstein's were on the van when I bought it, so I have no idea of their age.

I set all the Koni's to 3/4 of their maximum stiffness. Nose dive in breaking is vastly improved and cornering is better. I good upgrade for the money if you ask me.
_________________
87 Westy, 250k GW 2.4 - 2.0 Wink, 16" wheels
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
regis101
Samba Member


Joined: July 28, 2005
Posts: 2078
Location: Livermore, Ca
regis101 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Koni's are rebound adjustable only. So they will compress at the factory setting but will come back up , (rebound), at your setting. Try not to make them too stiff. It's just as important for the suspension to bounce up as well as down.

I run the Koni red's on our 78 Westy. I had it lowered 2.5 inches. I thought that the shocks needed to be stiff for the ride height. What I found out is that when the Bus would go into a corner or blaze across the whoops and dips in the road, it had a tendency to stay down too long. This meant that it would bottom out more often than when the shocks had a more neutral setting that allowed the vehicle to back back to a more resting position.

I now run them at 1/2 from soft in front and 3/4 from soft in the rear. All seems well.

Just some thought. YRMV
_________________
Peace, Regis
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
SeattleDownhill
Samba Member


Joined: July 29, 2009
Posts: 131
Location: Seattle
SeattleDownhill is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 12:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is true. We call that "packing up" in the mountain bike world. When your suspension doesn't rebound fast enough to take up the next bump it just puts you further into your travel after each consecutive hit. Slow is good, but too slow is bad. There is a fine line between the two. But it also depends on what type of terrain you're on.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
pighamling
Samba Member


Joined: November 30, 2007
Posts: 67
Location: Southern NM
pighamling is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Set of 4 at shox.com is $361.20 and they have FREE shipping."

and Tire Rack is back ordered. Thanks for saving me some time and money!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
r39o
Samba Polizei


Joined: May 18, 2005
Posts: 9800
Location: San Diego
r39o is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pighamling wrote:
"Set of 4 at shox.com is $361.20 and they have FREE shipping."

and Tire Rack is back ordered. Thanks for saving me some time and money!

Welcome.

They are physically close to me, next city over, so I am hoping for a "cash discount."

Smile
_________________
"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!

1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....

Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
gnarly 928
Samba Member


Joined: April 17, 2006
Posts: 46
Location: Lyle, Washington
gnarly 928 is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you really want to be able to adjust your shock's action you need to get them with double adjustability. Koni red sport shock are just adjustable for rebound. They (Koni) also have a series (12?) that are double adjustable, for rebound and for compression. You can also adjust these Konis on the vehicle. They have some small dials up near the top mount that you can click for adjustment while on the vehicle. These are also readily 'valved' for the weight of the vehicle. If you are serious about improving handling...the way to go...

Look at Koni's website for further info.

Don Hanson
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
r39o
Samba Polizei


Joined: May 18, 2005
Posts: 9800
Location: San Diego
r39o is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gnarly 928 wrote:
If you really want to be able to adjust your shock's action you need to get them with double adjustability. Koni red sport shock are just adjustable for rebound. They (Koni) also have a series (12?) that are double adjustable, for rebound and for compression. You can also adjust these Konis on the vehicle. They have some small dials up near the top mount that you can click for adjustment while on the vehicle. These are also readily 'valved' for the weight of the vehicle. If you are serious about improving handling...the way to go...

Look at Koni's website for further info.

Don Hanson

Iam lost on that site. Do you have some part numbers or URLs?
_________________
"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!

1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....

Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
CTB
Samba Member


Joined: July 19, 2010
Posts: 152

CTB is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1621 wrote:
The Konis lightest setting is the stock rebound rate for the Vanagon. Turning them all the way out will give approximately 100% increase in rebound rate.

1621, how did you determine this? Did you run them on a shock dyno? That's exactly the kind of info I'd like to know about them and the Bilsteins. Also, how many "clicks" do the Konis have? If the rebound range is from "stock" to 2xstock, how many clicks are in between those two? Also, do you know if the adjustment is only to low-speed rebound (bleeds) or is it more of a disc stack preload that increases the damping at all speed ranges? Thanks for any light you can shed, as I'm about to purchase shocks for my van and have been agonizing over the Bilsteins vs Konis. I'm a racer and love adjustability, but all the Bilstein road vehicles I've been in (no Vanagons, tho) have been very nicely done for damping.

Also, I had seen a thread that mentioned the Touring-class Bilsteins are "the same damping" as the the HD's. That's highly unlikely, given the TC's are twin tubes and the HD's are monotubes. Usually those designs give very different damping curves at the higher speeds, with monotubes often being digressive and twins being progressive.
_________________
CTB
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
dogcoves
Samba Member


Joined: September 09, 2005
Posts: 266
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
dogcoves is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had my Koni shocks at 3/4 but after 3 years the fronts have become a bit too bouncing. Last long road trip left the family feeling sea sick. I just set them at 4/4 on the front and the Westy handles much better again. Time for new springs. But until then is there any problem with running konis at full stiffness?
_________________
Current VW: 1987 Westfalia

My Past Volkswagens:
1958 karmann ghia
1963 Beetle
1963 Westfalia
1966 Westfalia
1970 Beetle
1970 Westfalia
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
CTB
Samba Member


Joined: July 19, 2010
Posts: 152

CTB is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope, as long as you're happy with the ride, there should be no issues with running the Konis at full stiffness. It sounds like they might need gone over by Koni, though. They have a lifetime warranty, don't they? If there's a time you can live without the van, maybe they can rebuild them for you.
_________________
CTB
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
insyncro
Banned


Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
insyncro is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 7:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gnarly 928 wrote:
If you really want to be able to adjust your shock's action you need to get them with double adjustability. Koni red sport shock are just adjustable for rebound. They (Koni) also have a series (12?) that are double adjustable, for rebound and for compression. You can also adjust these Konis on the vehicle. They have some small dials up near the top mount that you can click for adjustment while on the vehicle. These are also readily 'valved' for the weight of the vehicle. If you are serious about improving handling...the way to go...

Look at Koni's website for further info.

Don Hanson


There are two shocks shown under Van, 80-90.....both have a single rebound adjustment.
Where are you finding compression and rebound adjustments?
Are you sure they were not for a Eurovan???
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
presslab
Samba Member


Joined: September 29, 2008
Posts: 1730
Location: Sonoma County
presslab is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dogcoves wrote:
I had my Koni shocks at 3/4 but after 3 years the fronts have become a bit too bouncing. Last long road trip left the family feeling sea sick. I just set them at 4/4 on the front and the Westy handles much better again. Time for new springs. But until then is there any problem with running konis at full stiffness?


If you need to set your Konis at full stiffness (all the way turned in), something is wrong with them. At full stiffness you should not be able to extend them by hand, if you can that means that the fluid is bypassing the rebound orifice somehow.

I had one front and one rear Koni fail in this exact way on my van, but Koni replaced both without question.

Springs ONLY wear out by sacking out. That means you lose ride height. If your ride height is fine, your springs are fine.
_________________
1986 Vanagon Westfalia EJ25
1988 Subaru GL-10 EJ20G --- 2000 Honda XR650L
2010 Titus El Guapo --- 2011 On-One 456 Ti
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Christopher Schimke
Samba Member


Joined: August 03, 2005
Posts: 5375
Location: PNW
Christopher Schimke is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

presslab wrote:
dogcoves wrote:
I had my Koni shocks at 3/4 but after 3 years the fronts have become a bit too bouncing. Last long road trip left the family feeling sea sick. I just set them at 4/4 on the front and the Westy handles much better again. Time for new springs. But until then is there any problem with running konis at full stiffness?


If you need to set your Konis at full stiffness (all the way turned in), something is wrong with them. At full stiffness you should not be able to extend them by hand, if you can that means that the fluid is bypassing the rebound orifice somehow.

I had one front and one rear Koni fail in this exact way on my van, but Koni replaced both without question.

Springs ONLY wear out by sacking out. That means you lose ride height. If your ride height is fine, your springs are fine.



I agree with presslab 100% here!
_________________
"Sometimes you have to build a box to think outside of." - Bruce (not Springsteen)

*Custom wheel hardware for Audi/VW, Porsche and Mercedes wheels - Urethane Suspension Bushings*
T3Technique.com or contact me at [email protected]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Facebook Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Vanagon All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
Page 2 of 8

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2023, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB
Links to eBay or other vendor sites may be affiliate links where the site receives compensation.