My New 1969 Fastback

[nf6x]

Hi! This it my first post here. I just bought a 1969 fastback through eBay. It's my first VW of any kind. I plan to use it as a daily driver... even at the 20 MPG that the seller says he gets, it gets better mileage than my Toyota Tundra 4x4 and I have an 80 mile round trip commute... the fuel costs really pile up! I'm in southern California.

I gather from other postings I've read here that some folks get mileage closer to 25-30 MPG, so I'm hoping I'll get this car into that range with some tuning and gentle driving. If I can, then it should pay for itself in about a year in fuel savings. If not, then I figure I'll at least have a fun toy to play with for a while, and it'll hopefully hold its value if I decide it's not the right car for me later.

I don't have the car yet... the seller is delivering it to me this weekend, and I can hardly wait!

Here are the pictures from the eBay listing... maybe some of you Type 3 experts can comment on anything you see that looks especially good, especially bad, or missing? In particular, it seems like there ought to be something on top of the gas tank to keep cargo from garfing up the sender wiring and so forth... what goes there? Carpet? A board/cover of some sort? How different would the original whatever be from something I might make in my garage out of stuff from Home Depot? It looks like the jack is missing. Is that an oil-bath air cleaner?

http://www.nf6x.net/tmp/fastback/

Based on what little I know about Type 3s and VWs in general (mostly from reading the forums here!), it looks like it's in pretty good shape to me. It has the original fuel injection system, which I consider to be a plus. The seller says that the engine was rebuilt about 2000 miles ago, and a bunch of other stuff was done. I'm taking a bit of risk by buying the car before I've test-driven it, but I think the deal will turn out right. Anyway, I'll know for sure this weekend!

I've gathered the impression that many folks report mileage around 20-22 MPG from their bugs and fastbacks instead of in the 25-30 MPG range for one or more of the following reasons:

1. More aggressive driving
2. Car tuned/upgraded for performance vs. economy
3. Car not tuned up or maintained as well as it could be

Based on that understanding, it seems to me that I should reasonably expect to hit the high 20s if I take a stock car in good shape, tune it up properly, fix/adjust anything that can affect mileage (i.e., wheel alignment, tire pressure, wheel bearings, etc.) and drive it gently. Does this sound like a reasonable assumption?

There would certainly be other options for saving money on fuel. A friend of mine bought a crappy old Ford Festiva for $1000, and broke even from fuel savings in less than a year. I don't think a Fastback would ever approach the mileage of a Ford Festiva, but it would have two other advantages: 1) It's old enough to be smog-exempt in CA and 2) It's not a Ford Festiva!

I have a harebrained idea that someday I might like to try to roll my own closed-loop fuel injection and distributorless ignition control and then tune it for optimal efficiency (I'm an electrical engineer, so I get off on geeky stuff like that), and it seems like the injected 1600 engine could be a good platform for that kind of experiment since it already has properly-sized electric fuel injectors (i.e., I wouldn't need to machine heads or manifolds to add multiport injectors to a carburated engine, and the rest of the project would probably be a lot more electronic than mechanical). It would be my intention to keep any modifications as bolt-on as possible, so it would be possible to un-modify the car later if desired. While I want a nice experimentation platform that I can tune up for practical use, I don't want to destroy a classic car, either. Whether I decide to keep the car for the rest of my life or not, I have to consider that I won't be the car's last owner if I take good enough care of it.

Maybe I'm posting prematurely since I don't even have the car in my driveway yet, but I just couldn't wait! I have a Bentley manual on order. I'm mechanically inclined and I've done a bit of work on cars and trucks (I collect military trucks... ), but I've never really found the need to get too far inside an engine. Do y'all think I should get my hands on the Muir book, too?

Thanks in advance for any comments or encouragement! I've tried to read up here before posting, but I apologize in advance if I've spouted out any FAQs.

[COFBack]

NF -- Welcome.

Here's what an original frunk looks like. I don't see any issues with buying a thin fiber board and cutting some indoor/outdoor carpet to cover the gas tank and the rest of the floor.

You can hit the Performance/Engine forum here to get ideas on Fuel Injection. Also there was a LONG post back a couple months here in Type III on the stock fuel injection. I suggest reading through it for tuning ideas (you may have to look back a few pages as I haven't seen it come up in a while).

Take and post some pics when you get it.

RMS
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[dailydrivervw]

There' supposed to be a "cardboard" trunk liner in the front compartment.

Oil bath air cleaner is orig; easy to maintain. (and cheaper than filterelements)

Mileage: A friend bought a 70 fastback new. Back then he commuted from CT to Vt each weekend to build a cabin. He kept close tabs on mileage. He swore he got 31 on 100% highway driving with 2 adults and some extra weight of tools, etc; no idea what around town was. He switched to twin 67 carbs a few years later and lost 3-4 mpg (highway only). Speeds back then were closer to 60ish compared to today.

[nf6x]

Thanks for the replies and picture! Yes, I've read that thread on the fuel injection. Very informative. I'll definitely stay with the OG EFI (and go to the trouble of diagnosing and fixing it if necessary) until I get around to making my own improved controller (which may never happen... I'm a lot better at dreaming up big projects than completing them!).

If the original trunk lining was made out of cardboard-like stuff, then I guess that anything I fabricate will be nicer! I guess I'll make a floor board for it out of thin masonite with a coating of spar varninsh and optionally some thin carpet. I had a Subaru WRX for about a year, and its trunk floor over the spare tire was just a piece of thin masonite with a piece of even thinner carpet on top of it (not even glued down). Pretty cheesy, but it got the job done and the designers of that car didn't waste any weight where it wasn't necessary for performance, handling or safety.

[nf6x]

Well, it finally arrived this morning. What a neat little car!

I plan to do some work on it before I start driving it around (equal parts of fixing minor things and just plain getting to know my new car), but I think it's in good shape overall.

As an electrical engineer I'm especially picky about my electrical system, and I probably would have thought the wiring and switches were cheesy before the 37 years of wear, abuse and ham-fisted hacking that they've suffered. So, I'll fix whatever doesn't meet my standards, and I won't rule out deciding to just rip everything out and make a brand new wiring system from scratch.

Dang, I have a hard time cramming my big ol' foot between the brake pedal and the hump! I normally wear steel-toed work boots, and they just won't cut it with their wide soles. Different shoes might help, but I have a hard time finding regular shoes that'll fit my wide feet. I don't think I'm so freakishly deformed that I'm the only person who's ever had this problem... are there any options for improving the pedal placement/shape/height/whatever to make more room around the gas pedal? I don't wanna get my foot stuck at a critical time on the freeway!

[ddare]

if you end up rewiring the car you're either going to have to buy the kit from CIP or ISPWest and either use your old FI wiring or fabricate a new one

[nf6x]

My fastback has a deep oil sump bolted on. What are the pros and cons of that setup? I don't know whether I'd be better off leaving it in place, or removing it to increase my ground clearance a bit (I live on a rough dirt road).

[rusty57]

Buy thinner shoes!!! Just kidding. If you have mechanical skills, there are many aftermarket pedal assemblies out there. These will have to be Hacked in!!! As for the gas milage, 20 to 30 mpg seem to be the going rate. I have owned a few early vw's in my short time, and finally settled on driving them for what they are and not their practicality or savings. As you will soon find out, we are a different breed of our own. Welcome by the way. I get around 23-26 mpg on my 67 squareback. I can use some finer tuning and easier driving technics to better the milage, but i enjoy the driving experience as well. You'll soon see. Welcome to the family. I'm fairly bew at type 3's so i'm learning everyday. That is the fun. Hector
_________________
67 Ghia coupe, Retired military.
www.TagDefender.com

[nf6x]

My Tundra gets about 14 MPG, so I figure even the worst-case fastback mileage I've seen in the forum would be an improvement, and anything else I can get with tuning will be icing on the cake.

I'm going to Target tomorrow to see if I can find some better VW shoes. I'll be looking around for pedal mods, too. Maybe I'll roll my own modification.

[6T5 square]

How about a roller pedal?
_________________
John
65 square 1500S (weezer) sold but always on my mind
60 beetle (Ned)

Quoting John Muir -- Open the rear boot. Get out the stool and sit down. Contemplate the air-cooled beauty before you. - How to Keep Your Volkswagen Alive -- Step-By-Step Procedures for the Compleat Idiot

[blankmange]

[EverettB]

Nice looking car.

Yes, the mileage should be closer to 30 mpg. I'm not an expert on FI but I think most of them need the electricals cleaned and or various tune-up things done. Check the ohm readings of the temperature senders to make sure they are ok.

The accelerator pedal clearance problem is normal and you can't wear huge shoes.

The only thing that jumps out at me from the photos is that your rear seat looks weird - there should not be a gap between the bottom and the backrest.
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[nf6x]

I got the impression from other postings that roller pedals won't bolt in to a type 3. I guess that the type 1 doesn't have a little roller that the pedal pushes against like the type 3 does, so the pedals are pretty different? I don't know much about type 1s, but the roller pedals I've seen in ads don't look like they would swap with my type 3 pedal cleanly. Maybe I could fasten some kind of extension, like a riser block or even a roller, onto my existing pedal so I don't need to cram my foot as deep between the hump and brake pedal. Maybe I could use something like a caster or skateboard wheel, mounted on a fabricated bracket? Have any of y'all tried something like this before?

Me in skateboarder shoes... that's pretty funny! Well, I guess it's not that much wierder than me in a little VW is! I'll look at those when I'm shopping today.

I think that one of my main projects for today will be to try to get access to the turn signal switch. It doesn't work properly in "left", so I'll need to either fix or replace it. I have a Bentley and a Muir on the way, but they haven't arrived yet. The horn ring also doesn't work, but a previous owner thoughtfully bolted a horn button under the dash. I don't think that the idiot lights are working right, either, so I'll look into those. I downloaded a wiring diagram.

I'm guessing that Toyota didn't make seatbelts for the Type 3, so my front lap belts aren't original. I think the shoulder belts are, though, so I don't have working 3-point belts in the car right now. That's something I plan to fix. From a purely functional standpoint, would I be better off replacing the belts with original parts or properly installing some good aftermarket 3-point belts? I'm much more concerned with safety than with originality.

Thanks for the comments and suggestions! Please keep `em coming!

[nf6x]

I cleaned up the turn signal switch, and it seems to be working now. I still have some more electrical gremlins to chase down. The high beam circuit is intermittent, so I'll start looking at that next. When it was working, I saw that one of the high beams was out, so maybe I'll use that as an excuse to put in an H4 conversion. I haven't decided yet whether I'll patch up the hacked original wiring, or just make my own new harness from scratch. I don't especially like those screwy German fuses.

I got some smaller shoes at Target, and my big feet fit a lot better now.

The turn signals seem awfully dim in daylight. Are there any common fixes to improve the lighting?

I think I'll take tomorrow off to play with, er, I mean work on my new car.

[COFBack]

I have aftermarket retractable 3 point seatbelts in the front of my 71 fastback. They are from CIP1. Easy to install and work great.
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[Rome]

Congratulations on your car, NF! Looks to be very solid, what you'd expect from a California car. Gawd- the side panels of the front trunk are so solid- mine on my NY-based '70 fastback are rotted.

If your wiring diagram is in color, you should notice that the colors of the wires match the original ones in the car from the factory. That makes it so easy to trace circuits. Being an engineer, it will be really easy to trace current flow and determine if the part itself is not OK or if there are breaks in the wiring. If one of your fuses has its center strip still unbroken but the circuit is not working, rotate the fuse in its holder. This will break any miniscule corrosion on the fuse end and its holding pins and should allow the current to flow again. Just experienced this last night on my fasty when all the parking lights went out- I just rotated the leftmost fuse a few times and the lights came back on!

Those fuses were utilized by many other European car manufacturers in the entire German car industry in the 1960s and early '70s; my gal's '75 Volvo wagon has them too.

Don';t be afraid to drive your Fasty at 75-80mph for hours once everything is adjusted to factory specs. The Type 3 with your independant rear suspension (an "IRS" which is enjoyable ) feels really solid and stable on the road compared to Beetles, which had major detail differences.

The front trunk liner is made of a heavy ribbed waterproof cardboard like a corduroy pattern, in a cream color. Try an art supply store for a large piece, or go to a home center for a large piece of loop indoor/outdoor carpet. If you can find a local T3 enthusiast with a good trunk liner from '68 thru at least '70, maybe he would remove it (easy to do) and lay it flat so that you can use it as a pattern to cut your own. The trunk liner shown above is for a '71 and later Type 3 which has the large fresh-air box. Your car does not yet have that feature, and the flat face of the firewall makes it easier to make up a cover.

Nice to see your engine seems to retain all of its equipment and wiring.

So you know, Type 3s came from the factory with stainless steel/aluminum trim rings which fit under the stock hubcap and extend out to the wheel's outer rim. They have "sausage"-shaped openings which line up with the cooling slots in your wheels. Such rings would brighten up your car. But do what you like, it is YOUR car. Those rings were discontinued for the 1970 models when VW painted the wheels silver. That is another simple change you can do to your wheels, keeping the hubcaps.

[rusty57]

I have a roller pedal on my 67 square. As you can see in the picture, there is all kinds of room between the brake and gas roller. If you need more detailed pics let me know. hector

_________________
67 Ghia coupe, Retired military.
www.TagDefender.com

[nf6x]

Thanks for all of the replies, folks!

I received my Bentley yesterday, so that'll definitely help me out under the engine cover. I don't have any reason to belive that there's anything wrong with the engine (she seem to run just fine), but I still want to change the oil, check timing and valves, etc. before I start driving around. I have a Muir on the way, too.

The electrical system is another story; I'm still chasing down some gremlins in the lighting and so forth. I'm probably a lot more picky about the condition of my electrical system than most, because I'm an anal-retentive electrical engineer and military vehicle collector (MVs generally have immersion-proof electrical systems)! Anyway, I want all of the signals and idiot lights working before I make the 40 mile trip back home at night on my daily commute.

Are gasket and washer sets for the oil strainer cover usually available from the local auto parts chain store, or will I need to order a set or three?

It looks like that roller pedal sticks up a lot farther than the stock pedal, so it's not necessary to cram the right foot in between the brake pedal and hump. Does it mount in place of the small roller arm that the stock pedal presses against? Is adding one of these a Dremel-a-Beetle-pedal job, or is it more of a fabricate-your-own-from-steel-stock job?

[Rome]

nf, since you already bought narrower shoes, try to keep that strategy rather than going to the roller pedal, IMO. Last night I was wearing casual shoes with a wider sole and noticed a slight interference using my stock gas pedal. Traditional loafers or office shoes are not a problem with the pedal.

Oil strainer kits- being in SoCal you might get lucky with the kit being at a local car parts store. Much more so than out here where ACVWs are ancient history. If you call your nearest foreign car parts store, they also "might" have them. Make sure you tighten the acorn nuts on the sump cover to 60 INCH lbs which is 5 ft lbs. When you take the sump plate cover off after removing the 6 nuts, sight across the upper surface (the side that contacts the engine) to observe if the metal immediately surrounding any and each of the 6 holes is raised UPWARDS. If so, this will prevent full, uniform contact of the plate with the sump and gaskets. You can fix that by placing the sump flat on a hard surface like your garage floor. Put a ball-peen hammer with the ball end on the hole, making sure the hammer's handle is parallel to the ground. Take another hammer and it the ball-peen so that you are knocking down the raised area. Do this carefully, increasing your hammer blows slighty and looking after each blow to see if the area has been flattened.

As you see in your Bentley manual, you should also pull out the oil screen strainer after all the oil comes out and clean that off or replace it. Then put a gasket from the oil change kit above and below the strainer.

[nf6x]

Thanks for the oil change pointers. My local AutoZone didn't have the gasket kit, so I'll look around online.