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tanhis
Samba Member
Joined: July 23, 2005
Posts: 655
Location: Rauma Finland
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 Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:19 pm Post subject: |
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I have a early 69 automatic EFI fasty.
I finally got it runnig good enought to go for a ride whit it.
But I still have few issues whit it so here are some questions.
I checked the distributor and according to The old volks homepage it is not for the automatic but for a manual from the same year (VW 311-905-205L, Bosch 0231 163 001). So is adwance curves of these distributors wery different or am I ok whit this manual dissy.
The second question is about injectors. What injectors would be correct for my system or are all 311 xxx xxx injectors good for my car.
Third question.
Is this temp sensor in correct position or a hack job.
And if it is a hack job where this cylinder head sensor should be mounted originally.
Fourth question.
Where should the injectors be grounded originally as I have not been able to find any apico males around the injectors so I just wired all injector ground wires to the generator.
Fifth question
How do i test the full load pressure switch that it is working as it should.
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-58 Typ2 ambulance
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KTPhil 
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 34021
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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| tanhis wrote: |
| So is adwance curves of these distributors wery different or am I ok whit this manual dissy. |
It should run fine. The automatic will spend less time at low RPM and the vacuum signature will be different, so I'd look for the right one... eventually. It will not hurt anything in the meantime. I think the Bentley details the different advance curves, if you want a better answer.
| tanhis wrote: |
| The second question is about injectors. What injectors would be correct for my system or are all 311 xxx xxx injectors good for my car. |
I think they are all the same.
| tanhis wrote: |
Third question.
Is this temp sensor in correct position or a hack job.
And if it is a hack job where this cylinder head sensor should be mounted originally. |
It originally went on the #4 head. If the engine was rebuilt with Bug heads, they would have lacked the threaded boss for the sensor. If you get weird behavior over temperature, you may want to substitute a fixed resistor, or perhaps bias this one. I bet the block takes longer to heat up than the head.
| tanhis wrote: |
Fourth question.
Where should the injectors be grounded originally as I have not been able to find any apico males around the injectors so I just wired all injector ground wires to the generator. |
Late models gathered all grounds to a central "porcupine" multi-prong connector, so your method should work fine.
| tanhis wrote: |
Fifth question
How do i test the full load pressure switch that it is working as it should. |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22431
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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| tanhis wrote: |
I have a early 69 automatic EFI fasty.
I finally got it runnig good enought to go for a ride whit it.
But I still have few issues whit it so here are some questions.
I checked the distributor and according to The old volks homepage it is not for the automatic but for a manual from the same year (VW 311-905-205L, Bosch 0231 163 001). So is adwance curves of these distributors wery different or am I ok whit this manual dissy.
The second question is about injectors. What injectors would be correct for my system or are all 311 xxx xxx injectors good for my car.
Third question.
Is this temp sensor in correct position or a hack job.
And if it is a hack job where this cylinder head sensor should be mounted originally.
Fourth question.
Where should the injectors be grounded originally as I have not been able to find any apico males around the injectors so I just wired all injector ground wires to the generator.
Fifth question
How do i test the full load pressure switch that it is working as it should. |
That distributor should work fine. It's actually got a better advance curve in it.
As for injectors, you want them all the same color. Either all 4 yellow, or all 4 black. You really don't want to mix the colors, even though all 4 might have a 311 part number.
Yes, that temp sensor location is a hack job. Normally it'll be located next to the cylinder #4 exhaust port, or right on that corner of the head (top side, but would need a hole in the tin for it). If it's had a head change, then more than likely there isn't a spot for 1. You could add 1 near the #4 exhaust port though. And you'll need to plug that hole in the case (if there is one).
For the 68-69 years, the FI was grounded on the cylinder tins. The 70 on cars used a porcupine on 1 of the breather tower mounting studs.
To check the switch, use an ohm meter, and a fresh hose and put vacuum on the hose to get the switch to click on or off. I hope this helps.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
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tanhis
Samba Member
Joined: July 23, 2005
Posts: 655
Location: Rauma Finland
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| Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Bobnotch wrote: |
As for injectors, you want them all the same color. Either all 4 yellow, or all 4 black. You really don't want to mix the colors, even though all 4 might have a 311 part number.
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Well what sort of broblems this causes as now I have two yellow and two black.
| Bobnotch wrote: |
To check the switch, use an ohm meter, and a fresh hose and put vacuum on the hose to get the switch to click on or off. I hope this helps. |
Can I get enough wacuum by suckin the hose or should I ask my wife to help 
_________________
-58 Typ2 ambulance
-62 Typ 34
-65 Typ 34
-73 411 variant all metal custom
-69 typ 2, 9 seater
-89 vanagon camper conversion matkaaja
-08 3.0tdi phaeton |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22431
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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| tanhis wrote: |
| Bobnotch wrote: |
As for injectors, you want them all the same color. Either all 4 yellow, or all 4 black. You really don't want to mix the colors, even though all 4 might have a 311 part number.
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Well what sort of broblems this causes as now I have two yellow and two black.
| Bobnotch wrote: |
To check the switch, use an ohm meter, and a fresh hose and put vacuum on the hose to get the switch to click on or off. I hope this helps. |
Can I get enough wacuum by suckin the hose or should I ask my wife to help |
You might not have any problems at all, or you might have a difference in spray patterns. In theory, they're the same, and the yellow ones replaced the black ones later on.
You might be able to draw enough vacuum (depending on how good your lungs are ), or if your wife is really good at that sort of thing.  But a vacuum pump might be easier way to do that.  You just want to pull a vacuum on it, so that the switch inside makes (I think it's a NC switch, that opens with a certain amount of vacuum on it (going off of Phil's drawing).
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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| Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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I'm back with an update. I had a non-spec fuel pressure regulator that was not adjustable and I have just replaced it with a proper one. I also had a "B" MPS that is now replaced with a "C" version, however I had to put one together from 2 units I bought here. The first one had a tear in the brass diaphragm and I had to take it's replacement from a second unit. The diaphragms were not identical though, the first having 3 concentric ribs and the second (good) one had only one rib. The 2 units also had two different switch mechanisms on the other end.
So now its running even worse. It won't idle well regardless of adjustment, it misses consistently, got hot very quickly.
The MPS has obviously been tampered with (the epoxy is gone) but I'm getting a good 29-1/2 psi of fuel. I still suspect the TPS (Tram, were you able to find one?) and I'm still worried about broken wires at all the connectors (anyone know how to find replacement ferrules?). I am about to recheck values at the ECU connector again but before that should I make an attempt to adjust the MPS? |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22728
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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Tom, check your PMs.
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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Tram, here is a couple photos of the non-adjustable fuel pressure regulator you asked for.
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22728
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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| tomf51 wrote: |
Tram, here is a couple photos of the non-adjustable fuel pressure regulator you asked for.
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That looks like an L- Jet regulator with the vacuum port cut off and taped. 
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Under the tape is an allen head screw that is fixed somehow because it will not move. I thought maybe that was the adjustment mechanism but its either epoxied in place or impacted to be permanent. |
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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| Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2014 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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| I have a few questions about the AAR. Among other things, I'm experiencing idle hunt issues. In the process of inspecting and cleaning everything I noticed the AAR was adjusted all the way to "-". After reinstalling it I pulled hose and put my finger on it. The idle slowed down and stopped hunting (the engine was fully warm). Just for grins I removed it again and adjusted it all the way to "+". Nothing changed so went ahead and adjusted the idle with the AAR plugged. Same hunting but a little less severe I think. Does this indicate a bad AAR or is this just part of my "wrong MPS" issue? |
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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| Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2014 9:04 pm Post subject: |
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One more thing...
I've never seen anyone comment on voltage issues as relates to alternators. I have one on my Squareback and the voltages are fine, but does this change anything? |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22431
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:31 am Post subject: |
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| tomf51 wrote: |
One more thing...
I've never seen anyone comment on voltage issues as relates to alternators. I have one on my Squareback and the voltages are fine, but does this change anything? |
It shouldn't. As long as you have 14.1 to 14.5 volts at the battery with the car warmed up, you should be fine. In fact that's part of the reason why some here go to an alternator, stable voltage.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Thanks Bob. Its sometimes a little nerve racking to work on this system with its odd features like voltage and current sensitivities that aren't there in other vehicles (especially older ones) and when somethings not working right it can be a little couner intuitive. Again, the resources on Samba in general and this thread in particular is such a massive help. I know my way around most things mechanical but I would be absolutely lost trying to fix D-Jet without this guidance. Thank you all, especially the lead instigater, Tram. |
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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Still fiddling with the AAR. I plugged it and drove for ten miles. It was 90* out so after a very short period of rougher than normal idle it ran very well. Good power, strong acceleration. Only negative, it backfired once on deceleration. When I got back the engine was significantly cooler than it would normally be. Can I assume the cooler temperature is due to less air in the mix (which it was getting before being plugged because AAR was still passing air when fully warm)? Also, does anyone know what the "+ or -" adjustment inside the AAR does, adjust the amount of air + or -, or does it relate to temperature?
I thought I saw a post regarding deburring the AAR. What areas get debarred? Or does it sound like my AAR is just shot?
Thanks |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22728
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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| tomf51 wrote: |
Still fiddling with the AAR. I plugged it and drove for ten miles. It was 90* out so after a very short period of rougher than normal idle it ran very well. Good power, strong acceleration. Only negative, it backfired once on deceleration. When I got back the engine was significantly cooler than it would normally be. Can I assume the cooler temperature is due to less air in the mix (which it was getting before being plugged because AAR was still passing air when fully warm)? Also, does anyone know what the "+ or -" adjustment inside the AAR does, adjust the amount of air + or -, or does it relate to temperature?
I thought I saw a post regarding deburring the AAR. What areas get debarred? Or does it sound like my AAR is just shot?
Thanks |
Yes, that's exactly why the engine was cooler. the + means it closes faster, the - means it closes more slowly. Right in the middle is where you start.
Pull it apart, clean it out with carb cleaner, and soak the works in the "barrel" overnight in penetrant. Clean it out with spray cleaner again, and then lube it up inside with ATF. Try it out.
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| Bryan67 wrote: |
| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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| Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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| That did it. The shaft was apparently stuck and after cleaning I tested it in hot oil and it moves well. In the car the idle hunt has stopped and its running quite a bit better. And cooler. Thanks again, Tram. |
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22728
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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Cylinder #2 has a problem. Make sure it's firing. Seems lean from the pics.
FWIW I'd lose the Russian Bosch plugs and either get German ones or NGKs- preferably nonresistors, too.
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Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
| Bryan67 wrote: |
| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
To best contact me, please use the EMAIL function in my profile |
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tomf51
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2011
Posts: 34
Location: Calif.
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| Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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| I'll check #2. What is the part# of the preferred NGK? |
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