Stroker vs Big Bore

craigman · Posted: Thu May 05, 2011 12:29 pm Post subject:

Strokers rule! Twisted Evil

Only thing better is, stroker with big bore! Twisted Evil

DarthWeber · Posted: Thu May 05, 2011 12:34 pm Post subject:

craigman · Posted: Thu May 05, 2011 1:16 pm Post subject:

Ya i'd like to play with a set of those! Cool

DarthWeber · Posted: Thu May 05, 2011 1:41 pm Post subject:

It appears, from what I've read from those who have used them, that even with a performance cam and 2276cc's they are getting gas mileage in the mid 20's to low 30's mpg. Impressive for a performance engine. I wonder if that combustion efficiency would translate to say a 1600, if SS pistons were made in 85.5mm size. Maybe with efficient breathing capability, a mild cam and the benefits of SS design a 40 mpg engine would be possible with better than stock performance. Think

advinnie · Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:36 am Post subject:

I now this is an old thread and im no engineer but I will tell you want I noticed with my little stroker 74mm crank with 85.5mm pistons 1699cc engine. It started of as a mildly tuned 1600cc in a beetle with 90 my top speed and a 0-60 time of just over ten seconds. Then I fitted a 74mm crank every thing else was the same, same heads, cam, rockers, exhaust and carbs. The top end speed never changed still 90 mph but the 0-60 time dropped to 8.5 to 9 seconds. Now that was an important. Plus my brother has a 1776cc 69mm crank 90.5mm pistons and of the line I win every time and he does struggle to keep up with me in town. But once he hits over 4000 ish rpms he's gone so in town my 1699cc mini stroker wins hands down but on the open road the 1776cc wins. Now I much prefer my 1699cc to my bothers 1776cc it's so much better to drive.

mark tucker · Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 9:48 am Post subject:

I dont think you want a small cam with super squishey thingies in the barrells...
stroke it then bore it,it feals good.

advinnie · Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:04 am Post subject:

I have a gene berg 307 cam with 1.4 rockers. But boring it would of cost me another £300 to £400 more and I didn't have that money to hand plus I was not sure my kadron 40s would work if I had fitted 90.5mm pistons ( 1905cc with the 74mm ).

vwracerdave · Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:08 pm Post subject:

AlteWagen · Troll Joined: February 23, 2007 Posts: 8501 Location: PNW

The small cam and Kads are what limiting your upper rpm range. What cam and carbs is your brother running?
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Danwvw · Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 9:17 pm Post subject:

Don't strokers make more power at lower RPM? And Bore will give more power at Higher RPM. Guess it just where you want your power! Put the 74mm CrankShaft in the 1971 Bus and man what a difference that makes!
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1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths!

craigman · Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 9:23 pm Post subject:

advinnie · Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 3:44 am Post subject:

advinnie · Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 3:46 am Post subject:

Sorry one more thing just thought he has a Engle 110 cam I have a gene berg 307 cam witch is equal to the Engle 100.

Vanapplebomb · Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 4:14 am Post subject:

Funny thing to think about... The 1700 and 1800 type 4 engines had a bigger bore but were destroked compaired to a type one, and everybody loves the torque that they have. Guess that just goes to say that there is more to the picture than simply bore and stroke. Winkwinnk Wink

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1800 Type 4 Berrien 295

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=487021

Danwvw · Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 11:08 am Post subject:

The type 4 came in at least 2 different strokes didn't it? I think the 1800 was 66mm Not sure but the early Type 4 engine may have had even less stroke and the later Type 4 more.
_________________
1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths!

modok · Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 2:03 pm Post subject:

yeah, stroke is 66 and 71 I think. Also note the length of the rods, much shorter!! The shorter rod ratio probably did help the "torque", but has opposite effect on exhaust flow.......which was part of it's misfortune.

craigman · Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 2:56 pm Post subject:

Yes, the type 4 had 66mm and 71mm stroke stock.
The 66mm was used for the 1.7 & 1.8. The 71mm was used for the 2.0.

Vanapplebomb · Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:51 pm Post subject:

The 1.7 and 1.8 engines are tanks...arguably one of the most durable gas engines ever installed in a car. They were more of an industrial engine than an automobile engine. They could run at or near full power for a ridiculous amount of time. Solid torquey motors made to pull like an ox all day long.

And just for fun, there are always those 2.5 meter long stroke Sulzer engines...big two stroke diesel engines. The inline 14 cylinder engine made over 5.6 MILLION FtLbs for torque at 102 RPM. All that at above 50% thermal efficiency!

MAN, now controlled by Volkswagen, also makes large low speed two stroke diesel engines that compete with Sulzer that make crazy torque and efficiency...I think the number was 54% or 56% thermal efficiency.
_________________
1800 Type 4 Berrien 295

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=487021

Vanapplebomb · Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:17 pm Post subject:

Bet ya didn't know VW had their hands in this kinda engine work, did ya?!?

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Check out the size of this guy compaired to the hydraulic exhaust valve lifters on the top floor of the engine. Those nice shiny curved pipes are the high pressure oil lines that move the exhaust valves!!! (no intake valves, uniflow two stroke diesel.)

Here is another good bore vs stroke one for ya guys. This is the Fairbanks Morse 8 1/8 D8. It is also a two stroke industrial diesel, just much smaller. Still, the pistons are 8.125in in diameter, but each piston has a stroke of about 10 inches for a combined expansion stroke of about 20 inches!! Opposed piston engines do away with the exhaust valves by replacing them with another piston and ring of ports. They make lots of these engines for the US NAVY as well as for standby generators for Nuclear Power plants. Over half of Americas Nuke power plants have these engines installed in them for standby power.

_________________
1800 Type 4 Berrien 295

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=487021

Type 4 Unleashed · Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 7:59 pm Post subject:

I work on these every week, MAN B&W and Sultzer Cargo ship engines. Rods are about 14 feet long running bearing clearances around 1.9mm, pistons are about 3 1/2 feet in diameter with 5 compression rings. The exh valves with a 2 1/2 ft head and 5 feet long and are made of Inconel, each bank of cyl's has it's own 10 ft tall Turbo Charger. Heads are torqued to 900 BAR (a bar is about 15 psi), a single head nut weighs about 70 pds.
A 42 day round trip to Guam, China, Korea, Japan back to California burns about a Million dollars in Heavy Fuel Oil (HFO). So yes Torque monsters, running 80 to 90 rpm 24 hrs a day 7 days a week or until arrival at their destination.

I was in a storm one time, the propeller started caveating with a lot of vibration because while the 300 yd long ship was on a swell the propeller was spinning in the air... Cool


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