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vwracerdave
Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004
Posts: 15297
Location: Deep in the 405
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 Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2016 8:52 am Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| planenut wrote: |
| Seems like after 201 pages, something could be agreed on!! |
Oil topics will never be agreed upon by anybody. Go to any car forum Ford, Dodge, Honda, Toyota, or Corvette, and you will always find the same 200-300 page dribble that nobody agrees upon.
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2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK
Featured in Dec. 2001 HOT VW's Magazine page 63
Watch my racing video's http://www.youtube.com/user/okvwracer/videos |
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kevlarian
Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2014
Posts: 636
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2016 9:49 am Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| vwracerdave wrote: |
| planenut wrote: |
| Seems like after 201 pages, something could be agreed on!! |
Oil topics will never be agreed upon by anybody. Go to any car forum Ford, Dodge, Honda, Toyota, or Corvette, and you will always find the same 200-300 page dribble that nobody agrees upon. |
I'll finalize the discussion...
Castrol GTX 20/50
Alright mods. You can lock this thread now.
And...
You're welcome!
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planenut
Samba Member
Joined: April 12, 2012
Posts: 334
Location: Georgia
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2016 1:21 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| The top heads definitely look better, but not saying anything about the bottom head, you really can't be sure how clean they were when they were put on. I've seen some home projects where they weren't 'shiny' clean when they were put together. I see your point, though. |
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vugbug68
Samba Member
Joined: June 25, 2006
Posts: 2696
Location: sacramento
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| Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2016 2:32 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| kevlarian wrote: |
| vwracerdave wrote: |
| planenut wrote: |
| Seems like after 201 pages, something could be agreed on!! |
Oil topics will never be agreed upon by anybody. Go to any car forum Ford, Dodge, Honda, Toyota, or Corvette, and you will always find the same 200-300 page dribble that nobody agrees upon. |
I'll finalize the discussion...
Castrol GTX 20/50
Alright mods. You can lock this thread now.
And...
You're welcome!
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They can't lock this thread, there needs to be someplace to argue about oil! 
All joking aside, I've been daily driving aircooled VW's for over 10 years with engines from 1300cc to 2110cc and everything in between, I've never had an engine failure. I've used 5-30 to 20-50, diesel oil, synthetic, semi synthetic, straight weight. NO Failures! The engine failures I've seen have been due to crappy parts or builder error.
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sgraham602
Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2016
Posts: 140
Location: Chapel Hill, NC
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 8:33 am Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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A lot of information on this thread. I've searched through but still have a question (I may have missed it somewhere). I'm picking up a 1975 bus (1. and I know the guy isn't going to be sure what oil has been used in it (he's selling it for a family member). I read in John Muirs book that you shouldn't put detergent oil into an engine has been using non-detergent oil. So what should I do? Is there a safe oil to use when you do not know the oil that has been used previously?? |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50331
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 9:54 am Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| sgraham602 wrote: |
| A lot of information on this thread. I've searched through but still have a question (I may have missed it somewhere). I'm picking up a 1975 bus (1. and I know the guy isn't going to be sure what oil has been used in it (he's selling it for a family member). I read in John Muirs book that you shouldn't put detergent oil into an engine has been using non-detergent oil. So what should I do? Is there a safe oil to use when you do not know the oil that has been used previously?? |
It is very unlikely that your engine had a non detergent oil in it so that really isn't a worry.
A look inside your rocker boxes will tell you how much crud is built up in your engine.
FWIW, one of the big engine killers from Muir's day was leaded gasoline, but that was so universal and accepted that almost no one bothered to point it out. |
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vwracerdave
Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004
Posts: 15297
Location: Deep in the 405
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 2:44 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| sgraham602 wrote: |
| A lot of information on this thread. I've searched through but still have a question (I may have missed it somewhere). I'm picking up a 1975 bus (1. and I know the guy isn't going to be sure what oil has been used in it (he's selling it for a family member). I read in John Muirs book that you shouldn't put detergent oil into an engine has been using non-detergent oil. So what should I do? Is there a safe oil to use when you do not know the oil that has been used previously?? |
That is an old myth from 30 years ago. Oil today is much different. Your oil filter should do it's job and filter out any loose crude. Change oil and filter as soon as you get it. Put in whatever your favorite is and cruise on. Change it again after 500 miles.
_________________
2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK
Featured in Dec. 2001 HOT VW's Magazine page 63
Watch my racing video's http://www.youtube.com/user/okvwracer/videos |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50331
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 4:07 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| vwracerdave wrote: |
That is an old myth from 30 years ago.. |
How about an old mechanic's tale from sixty years ago.  |
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sgraham602
Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2016
Posts: 140
Location: Chapel Hill, NC
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| Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2016 10:21 am Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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My head is spinning reading through this thread. I'm picking up a 75 in FL and driving back to NC. Its hot down here in the south east. I'm not sure what kind of oil to pick up to keep with me as I make the drive. Do i need to match the weight of whats in the engine currently (should I need to top it up during the drive). I was just gonna grab some Castrol GTX 20w-50...and start heading north.
My initial goal is to make it home in one piece. Once I'm back, then I can start diving into which oil is right for my engine..climate..and so on?
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What a long strange trip it's been. |
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EverettB 
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69798
Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2016 11:01 am Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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Yes, if I am out if BFE buying a car and can't do a complete oil change beforehand I try to match what is in the car for the drive home.
In Weight, don't care about brand.
I'm not sure it matters though, I've dumped a quart of 20/50 into a car with straight 30wt when I had to and nothing blew up.
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Frodge
Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2006
Posts: 1991
Location: Dump
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2016 2:09 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| Is casrrol 10w30 and 10w40 OK? 5w30 and 5w40? Stock application. |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50331
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2016 3:07 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| Frodge wrote: |
| Is casrrol 10w30 and 10w40 OK? 5w30 and 5w40? Stock application. |
Any of those will work if they make sufficient hot oil pressure. For the 5w30 and 10w30 oils you might want to look for "high mileage" oils to get higher antiwear additive levels. |
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SamboSamba22
Samba Member
Joined: August 06, 2015
Posts: 2772
Location: Benton, Arkansas
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| Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 10:15 am Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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So I have put about 1500 miles on the bus since the top end rebuild. I live in a year round humid climate. Currently been running SAE 30 weight Vavoline. Why? My grandpa was a Valvoline guy, and my local bus buddy says to use straight 30. So Valvoline 30wt it has been. Oil pressure has been good (no manual gauge checking).
Now when I have been driving for a couple of hours, coming to a red light I get the flickering of the oil pressure light.
Also when doing around town, stop and go, the flicker comes and goes.
Is there benefit to running a multi-grade conventional vs. a single grade engine oil.
What the hell is so special about Castrol GTX 20w/50?
I am after to the most consistent oil pressure and temperature regarding oil, especially since even when in winter (coming in a couple months) temps won't be below 40* much but the humidity is always high.
Let's reach 300 pages!! Kidding, but I don't have time to regurgitate 200 pages of opinions, so I am asking for current opinions.
Cheers
Edit: so 20w50 has the desired zinc content. Is it not too thick? Especially for colder climates coming?
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rockerarm
Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2009
Posts: 3552
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 3:12 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| Frodge wrote: |
| Is casrrol 10w30 and 10w40 OK? 5w30 and 5w40? Stock application. |
Found this on Pelican Parts' website.
I meant to say 20W50 but anyway here is what they said:
"Thank you for contacting Castrol,
Castrol North America does not manufacture GTX in a 20w-40 grade.
The latest API SM/ILSAC GF-4 category calls for reduced Zinc and Phosphorus levels to allow extended catalyst life in current model vehicles. There appear to be field issues associated with the SM/GF-4 oil's level of antiwear in the classic car engines known as flat tappet cam engines. The current late model passenger car engines are not flat tappet cam engines and have no reported field issues related to the level of antiwear chemistry in the SM/GF-4 oils.
Product Recommendations for Flat Tappet (Solid Lifter) Cam Engines:
Castrol Syntec 20W-50 (Recent reformulation identified by "Recommended for Classic Cars" text on back label) (min Zn = 0.12 = 1200 ppm)(full synthetic)
New Motorcycle Products
Castrol Power RS GPS 10W-30, 10W-40 and 20W-50 (min Zn = 0.12 = 1200 ppm) Castrol Power RS R4 10W-50 and 5W-40 (min Zn = 0.12 = 1200 ppm) Castrol Power RS V-Twin 20W-40 and 20W-50 (min Zn = 0.12 = 1200 ppm)
Castrol Consumer Relations
Somewhere there is a Castrol statement that basically stated their traditional GTX oils were not recommended for flat tappet cam engines.
Hope this helps, Bill. |
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rockerarm
Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2009
Posts: 3552
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 3:40 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| SamboSamba22 wrote: |
So I have put about 1500 miles on the bus since the top end rebuild. I live in a year round humid climate. Currently been running SAE 30 weight Vavoline. Why? My grandpa was a Valvoline guy, and my local bus buddy says to use straight 30. So Valvoline 30wt it has been. Oil pressure has been good (no manual gauge checking).
Now when I have been driving for a couple of hours, coming to a red light I get the flickering of the oil pressure light.
Also when doing around town, stop and go, the flicker comes and goes.
Is there benefit to running a multi-grade conventional vs. a single grade engine oil.
What the hell is so special about Castrol GTX 20w/50?
I am after to the most consistent oil pressure and temperature regarding oil, especially since even when in winter (coming in a couple months) temps won't be below 40* much but the humidity is always high.
Let's reach 300 pages!! Kidding, but I don't have time to regurgitate 200 pages of opinions, so I am asking for current opinions.
Cheers
Edit: so 20w50 has the desired zinc content. Is it not too thick? Especially for colder climates coming? |
Hi. Look at the full line of Valvoline's white bottle conventional oils and view the zinc/phosphorus levels. These levels of 830 and 760ppm are a bit low.
http://content.valvoline.com/pdf/premium_conventional.pdf
Regarding your concern with the oil lite flashing at idle sometimes, I would look into the tune of the engine, meaning jetting, timing, etc. The type 4, carbed engines took a beating back when I was a dealer tech. The heat was killing these engines, from 1972-1974. VW's fix was to install 9mm sodium filled exhaust valves. They didn't fix the heat problem, they just installed a high tech exhaust valves to extend engine life.
If you believe your engine bearing clearances are adequate, then look into diagnosing if the oil temps are getting too high. Look into the SaveMyBug oil temp dipstick for approx. $45 and verify your oil temps aren't getting too high and thinning the oil, hence oil lite flickering.
Castrol GTX used to be the VW/air-cooled oil decades ago. I worked many dealers/independents where Castrol 30wt was for VW and 40wt was for Porsche or Mercedes. My, have times changed, but some opinions have not.
Hope this helps, Bill. |
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vwracerdave
Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004
Posts: 15297
Location: Deep in the 405
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| Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 3:55 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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SombaSamba22, since your a Valvoline guy I'll suggest you use Valvoline VR-1 10W-30 racing oil. Napa and O'Reilly's don't stock it but can get you a case the next day.
_________________
2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK
Featured in Dec. 2001 HOT VW's Magazine page 63
Watch my racing video's http://www.youtube.com/user/okvwracer/videos |
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rockerarm
Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2009
Posts: 3552
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 4:10 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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Dave, do you believe this Valvoline oil has sufficient additives to be used for, lets say 4K miles? Normally, the type 4 bus holds a bit less than 4 qts.
Bill |
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SamboSamba22
Samba Member
Joined: August 06, 2015
Posts: 2772
Location: Benton, Arkansas
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rockerarm
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Joined: December 16, 2009
Posts: 3552
Location: Los Angeles
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modok
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2009
Posts: 26776
Location: Colorado Springs
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| Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 5:13 pm Post subject: Re: Official "What oil / additives should I use" topic |
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| The zddp content of the VR1 is fairly standard, it's not HIGH, however it has less other stuff in there interfering with it, and not all "zink" is created equal, your lab test only tells the amount of elements not they type and properties of it. It IS "racing oil" NOT designed to achieve the LONG service intervals of modern cars, and not intended to work with cat converters, so you should change it every 3k miles or twice a year, and you probably do anyway, and you probably don't have a cat. that's why they keep it off the shelves, because it's not really made for modern cars, but fairly ideal for older classics. |
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