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panzerfuska Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2005 Posts: 142
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:23 pm Post subject: kommandeurwagen, class 11-type beetle |
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hi all. i have this '66 bug that i'm turning into a class 11/kommandeurwagen machine. i'm trying to get all the mechanical things together, but it's not going as easy as i thought.
i gutted a big nut bus trans and have to clean up the reduction boxes. it was a pain to open up and that's not enough-the current trans in the bug does not fit the 12-volt motor.
question: how much grinding is needed to get the motor to fit?
i know i have to flip the ring gear but i can't imagine doing it because it was hard getting the boxes out from the bus transmission. would it be cheaper to have a shop flip it and install the boxes?
i'll post some pictures, at least of the engine for now until i figure out the transmission dilemma. any thoughts appreciated. |
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bljones Resident Wit
Joined: February 08, 2002 Posts: 2377 Location: ontario canada
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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if you are running reduction boxes you don't have to flip the R&P. _________________ OG JHC
Author of Original Rant #1
"It stingd itself to dead... now that is control on you"
2% |
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panzerfuska Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2005 Posts: 142
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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 1:43 pm Post subject: |
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i know, but the bus tranny is shot and only the boxes are usable. |
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panzerfuska Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2005 Posts: 142
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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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this is the stock engine, cleaned up a bit and incomplete for now, but shows the color for the car. |
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panzerfuska Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2005 Posts: 142
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Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2005 12:19 pm Post subject: |
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for the front, i am thinking of doing jatech (?) lift spindles. there's a place that sells thing spindles for $60 each, and for a pair cheaper than the aftermarket spindles but maybe core charges could jack up the price. fthe rear reduction box pictures to follow, and the bugzyla adapters will come in next week. |
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HamburgerBrad Je suis Napoléon!
Joined: February 21, 2003 Posts: 6957 Location: SoCal
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Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2005 12:54 pm Post subject: |
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with thing spindles, you would also need thing arms. therefore increasing the overall price. just something to think of _________________ OGST | CU05 | OGJHC
1970 baja|1953 oval
Wanted: two beat up, ugly, curb rashed 6" phone dial wheels |
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jaybe_2 Samba Member
Joined: September 05, 2005 Posts: 169 Location: N.H.
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Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2005 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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I have a complete thing front end I will let go for $175 plus shipping |
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vwjimbo Samba Member
Joined: January 10, 2005 Posts: 201 Location: akron, ohio
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Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2005 9:39 am Post subject: good setup..... |
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i am doing right about the same thing with a 67 type 1 pan and a zwitter body....i am running the thing front end and the reduction box setup...well it actually is still in the parts collection stage but if you want the front and back to sit about the same height...the thing setup and the reduction box setup should sit about the same height as long as you use the adapters that hold the "boxes" straight not the angled! |
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sgallaty Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2005 Posts: 44
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Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2005 10:04 am Post subject: |
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I know what class 11 is I think, is that 1000 cc semi-stock baja racing?
what is kommandeurwagen though?
Are you following some kind of guide here? |
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HamburgerBrad Je suis Napoléon!
Joined: February 21, 2003 Posts: 6957 Location: SoCal
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Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2005 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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sgallaty wrote: |
I know what class 11 is I think, is that 1000 cc semi-stock baja racing?
what is kommandeurwagen though?
Are you following some kind of guide here? |
class 11 is 1600 if i'm not mistaken.
kommandeurwagen was the class 11 beetle of world war 2.
_________________ OGST | CU05 | OGJHC
1970 baja|1953 oval
Wanted: two beat up, ugly, curb rashed 6" phone dial wheels |
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sgallaty Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2005 Posts: 44
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Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2005 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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I see.
When I did a search for that I came up with a vehicle that looks very different.
If I am not mistaken, THAT vehicle is 4 wheel drive, is it not?
Is that the target here? |
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HamburgerBrad Je suis Napoléon!
Joined: February 21, 2003 Posts: 6957 Location: SoCal
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Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2005 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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sgallaty wrote: |
I see.
When I did a search for that I came up with a vehicle that looks very different.
If I am not mistaken, THAT vehicle is 4 wheel drive, is it not?
Is that the target here? |
the bottom one is 4 wheel drive. and it's a VERY difficult conversion without using synchro parts. and even then...
and the target was probably to do a class 11 style car. lifted, with full steel body _________________ OGST | CU05 | OGJHC
1970 baja|1953 oval
Wanted: two beat up, ugly, curb rashed 6" phone dial wheels |
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sgallaty Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2005 Posts: 44
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Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2005 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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I'll just risk looking total newbie here and ask -
first all steel body I presume you mean stock sheetmetal, without going kit-fiberglass anything?
synchro parts? What's that? |
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HamburgerBrad Je suis Napoléon!
Joined: February 21, 2003 Posts: 6957 Location: SoCal
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Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2005 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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sgallaty wrote: |
first all steel body I presume you mean stock sheetmetal, without going kit-fiberglass anything? |
correct
sgallaty wrote: |
synchro parts? What's that? |
4x4 vanagon _________________ OGST | CU05 | OGJHC
1970 baja|1953 oval
Wanted: two beat up, ugly, curb rashed 6" phone dial wheels |
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LiveJay Samba Member
Joined: December 01, 2005 Posts: 130 Location: Nipomo, CA
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Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 11:03 am Post subject: |
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That is awsome. I want one!
This 4x4 idea I like. Has anyone pulled it off, or is this just daydreaming at this point? _________________ Jay
'73 Beetle
'73 Bus |
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vwclass11 Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2002 Posts: 811 Location: MESA,AZ
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Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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LiveJay wrote: |
That is awsome. I want one!
This 4x4 idea I like. Has anyone pulled it off, or is this just daydreaming at this point? |
Well 4x4 beetles were a reality in WWII. They were called Kommanderwagens, they were basically Beetle bodies on Kubelwagen/Schwimmwagen chasiss. With the right amount of time and MONEY, anything is possible. I would imagine you would have to scrap the stock vw pan, and start with a tube chasis. By the way Class 11's are played out . Later, Mitch. _________________ www.lowlifeaz.com
Vanhag wrote:
On a scale from 1-10 I see a class 11.
hotratz wrote: |
I hold a level 2 certification in Tribology |
http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/194538.jpg |
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panzerfuska Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2005 Posts: 142
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Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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thanks for the offer jaybe_2. but it seems the shipping might make it uneconomical. if i could have it for $200 shipped?
the engine i have is a 1200cc. i have the opportunity to get a 1600 sp which would also make the 12-volt conversion easier, according to the mechanic who's selling me the motor and tranny. the current tranny won't need grinding.
i'm thinking that the 1200 should be ok, with a 6-volt flywheel and starter. he argues i should do things right the first time and that i'll be better off with the 12-volt tranny and 1600 engine in the long run. any thoughts?
on the 4x4 subject, there's a rally superbeetle with such a system. is there a way to perhaps make some nose cone that has an output so that it can transfer power to a front diff? |
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sgallaty Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2005 Posts: 44
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Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 7:43 am Post subject: |
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HamburgerBrad wrote: |
sgallaty wrote: |
I know what class 11 is I think, is that 1000 cc semi-stock baja racing?
what is kommandeurwagen though?
Are you following some kind of guide here? |
class 11 is 1600 if i'm not mistaken.
kommandeurwagen was the class 11 beetle of world war 2.
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Lifted a little, and with internal rollcage, cages front and rear, skidpan, bobbed rear, roof cargo and you have pretty much what I am after - looks wise, if you replace the headlight reflector bullet-shields with rock screens. |
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vwclass11 Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2002 Posts: 811 Location: MESA,AZ
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Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 9:41 am Post subject: |
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panzerfuska wrote: |
On the 4x4 subject, there's a rally superbeetle with such a system. is there a way to perhaps make some nose cone that has an output so that it can transfer power to a front diff? |
I would say the easiest way would be to use a trans from a Synchro Vanagon. Later, Mitch. _________________ www.lowlifeaz.com
Vanhag wrote:
On a scale from 1-10 I see a class 11.
hotratz wrote: |
I hold a level 2 certification in Tribology |
http://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/194538.jpg |
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sgallaty Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2005 Posts: 44
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Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 10:03 am Post subject: |
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vwclass11 wrote: |
panzerfuska wrote: |
On the 4x4 subject, there's a rally superbeetle with such a system. is there a way to perhaps make some nose cone that has an output so that it can transfer power to a front diff? |
I would say the easiest way would be to use a trans from a Synchro Vanagon. Later, Mitch. |
I would guess that this would really limit your front suspension options unless you were going to heavily fabricate ---
I'm trying to imagine this.
so you have the vanagon synchro front differential and synchro transaxle to put somewhere, and I guess you would have to fab a front end that could handle the front wheel drive and have room for this.
I don't have a diagram handy, does the vanagon deliver torque to the frontend with a drive train with two universal joints on either end, and where does this come off of? I wonder what you would have to fab/cut/make room for to have this clear under the pan.
I'm guessing on the front end you would have to use the vanagon synchro spindles. I wonder what sort of attachment that is.
very interesting, anyhow. |
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