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JMazier
Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2006
Posts: 900
Location: In my garage, Georgetown, Ontario, Canada...
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 Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 6:41 am Post subject: City Lights |
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Hi all,
I just purchased a set of Hella H4s with city lights. I intend to use the city lights as daytime running light. What I want to see happen is that I start the bus and the city lights come on. As soon as I turn on the regular headlight bulb then the city lights turn off. I figure that I can do it with a relay however it would have to be one that opens the connection (shuts off power) when energized. Is this possible, what kind of relay??? Any tips?
Thanks
_________________
Cheers!
Jérôme
’79 Cali Westy 2.0 F.I.
'74 Honda CB 350 Four
'78 Honda CB 750 K
'12 Golf GTI
'11 Ural Patrol |
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Hippie
Samba Tinner
Joined: August 16, 2004
Posts: 1781
Location: Iowa: The Mud State
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 6:55 am Post subject: Re: City Lights |
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| CJMazier wrote: |
Hi all,
I figure that I can do it with a relay however it would have to be one that opens the connection (shuts off power) when energized. Is this possible, what kind of relay??? Any tips?
Thanks |
Yes. Get a relay with both normally open and normally closed contacts (which is most of them)
When the relay is energized,
1. the normally closed ones will open and shut off current.
2. Simultaneously, the normally open ones will close and turn on current to their circuit (if a circuit is hooked to them.)
(In electricity, a closed switch is on...like a drawbridge. Open is off.)
Usually, this one will be marked as a single pole, double throw relay.
Think of the pole as the switch arm, and the throw as the movement:
__/..............0----------->\______________
throw 1,........pole,..........throw 2
The principle is that when the coil is powered up (coil not shown) the arrow will flip left until power to the coil is shut off. The center of the pole, (the "0" in the picture) will be the current source as 12 volts will have a connection to it. The left and right ends will go to the things you want on or off.
You might just find double pole, double throw relays in stock.
That's OK. It's just twice the above and you only use the contact connections you need.
Just make sure to match the coil voltage and match or exceed the contact voltage and current rating. The relay should be for DC current, also.
Auto parts stores carry a variety of these.
Rob |
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JMazier
Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2006
Posts: 900
Location: In my garage, Georgetown, Ontario, Canada...
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:07 am Post subject: Re: City Lights |
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| Hippie wrote: |
| CJMazier wrote: |
Hi all,
I figure that I can do it with a relay however it would have to be one that opens the connection (shuts off power) when energized. Is this possible, what kind of relay??? Any tips?
Thanks |
Usually, this one will be marked as a single pole, double throw relay.
Think of the pole as the switch arm, and the throw as the movement:
__/..............0----------->\______________
throw 1,........pole,..........throw 2
The principle is that when the coil is powered up (coil not shown) the arrow will flip left until power to the coil is shut off. The center of the pole, (the "0" in the picture) will be the current source as 12 volts will have a connection to it. The left and right ends will go to the things you want on or off.
You might just find double pole, double throw relays in stock.
That's OK. It's just twice the above and you only use the contact connections you need.Rob |
This is exactly what I was looking for. I will pick up a relay on Saturday and hook them up. Thanks Rob!
_________________
Cheers!
Jérôme
’79 Cali Westy 2.0 F.I.
'74 Honda CB 350 Four
'78 Honda CB 750 K
'12 Golf GTI
'11 Ural Patrol |
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dwill49965
Samba Member
Joined: August 08, 2005
Posts: 1396
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:14 am Post subject: |
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Jerome - do you think the city light will be sufficient for a day-time running light? A small 4 watt bulb (or so) looks okay at night with darkness all around, but during the day, on a highway, I'm not sure it'll be effective.
I've thought of doing the same thing with my city lights, but I think a 20 watt or so bulb would be better, if they come in that wattage at that size.
_________________
Darryl
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'78 Westy, Boston Bob built 2.0 L, FI, MSD 6A
| Meyer wrote: |
| Lastly, you just referred to US citizens as 'Americans'. Exactly what kind of Canadian are you? From what continent? |
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Herbst '71
Samba Member
Joined: April 14, 2004
Posts: 245
Location: Augusta, GA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:28 am Post subject: |
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I had city lights on my bus and they could not been seen until it was dark. Also, when turned on, the headlights over power the city lights.
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Rik
'71 Deluxe/1600 DP
"Fortunately my mistakes are serving as a warning for others." |
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dwill49965
Samba Member
Joined: August 08, 2005
Posts: 1396
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:44 am Post subject: |
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| Herbst '71 wrote: |
| Also, when turned on, the headlights over power the city lights. |
Yes - but Jerome's city lights will be shut off by the relay he'll rig up when the headlights go on. Day time running lights are all about being seen from a distance.
_________________
Darryl
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'78 Westy, Boston Bob built 2.0 L, FI, MSD 6A
| Meyer wrote: |
| Lastly, you just referred to US citizens as 'Americans'. Exactly what kind of Canadian are you? From what continent? |
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JMazier
Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2006
Posts: 900
Location: In my garage, Georgetown, Ontario, Canada...
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:54 am Post subject: |
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| dwill49965 wrote: |
Jerome - do you think the city light will be sufficient for a day-time running light? A small 4 watt bulb (or so) looks okay at night with darkness all around, but during the day, on a highway, I'm not sure it'll be effective.
I've thought of doing the same thing with my city lights, but I think a 20 watt or so bulb would be better, if they come in that wattage at that size. |
I am not actually sure. I guess that I will try it out and, if they’re not visible, look into a higher wattage bulb. Good point!
_________________
Cheers!
Jérôme
’79 Cali Westy 2.0 F.I.
'74 Honda CB 350 Four
'78 Honda CB 750 K
'12 Golf GTI
'11 Ural Patrol |
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Herbst '71
Samba Member
Joined: April 14, 2004
Posts: 245
Location: Augusta, GA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:57 am Post subject: |
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If you use the 4w bulbs, you will only be able to see them at a distance of three inches. Don't get me wrong, I want to hook mine up again and I think the relay idea is perfect, but I don't think they will function as visible day time running lights.
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Rik
'71 Deluxe/1600 DP
"Fortunately my mistakes are serving as a warning for others." |
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dcdubs
Samba Member
Joined: January 29, 2003
Posts: 860
Location: the Great Northwest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:05 am Post subject: |
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if you want bright city lights there is a small halogen bulb that newer mercedes take. there are a couple diff watteges......the highest we've had in our store is 20w the # for that one is an osram 64115
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dcdubs/glcustoms
AllRightGarageDoorsNW.com |
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JMazier
Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2006
Posts: 900
Location: In my garage, Georgetown, Ontario, Canada...
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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| dcdubs wrote: |
| if you want bright city lights there is a small halogen bulb that newer mercedes take. there are a couple diff watteges......the highest we've had in our store is 20w the # for that one is an osram 64115 |
Will it fit into the city light bulb socket?
_________________
Cheers!
Jérôme
’79 Cali Westy 2.0 F.I.
'74 Honda CB 350 Four
'78 Honda CB 750 K
'12 Golf GTI
'11 Ural Patrol |
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dcdubs
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Joined: January 29, 2003
Posts: 860
Location: the Great Northwest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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yes, thats what it is......a small bayonet style bulb....just google the osram # 64115 and you'll see
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dcdubs/glcustoms
AllRightGarageDoorsNW.com
Last edited by dcdubs on Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:28 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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JMazier
Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2006
Posts: 900
Location: In my garage, Georgetown, Ontario, Canada...
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:17 pm Post subject: |
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| dcdubs wrote: |
| yes, thats what it is......a small bayonet style bulb |
Thanks! I will pick up the bulbs and the relay this weekend. Hoping that the local Napa Auto Parts has these items...
_________________
Cheers!
Jérôme
’79 Cali Westy 2.0 F.I.
'74 Honda CB 350 Four
'78 Honda CB 750 K
'12 Golf GTI
'11 Ural Patrol |
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dcdubs
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Joined: January 29, 2003
Posts: 860
Location: the Great Northwest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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from my experience napa might not have it but since you have the number they could probably order it
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dcdubs/glcustoms
AllRightGarageDoorsNW.com |
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JMazier
Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2006
Posts: 900
Location: In my garage, Georgetown, Ontario, Canada...
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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| dcdubs wrote: |
| from my experience napa might not have it but since you have the number they could probably order it |
Thanks! If any of you reading this in the Toronto area have a recomendation for a good autoparts store please let me know...
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Cheers!
Jérôme
’79 Cali Westy 2.0 F.I.
'74 Honda CB 350 Four
'78 Honda CB 750 K
'12 Golf GTI
'11 Ural Patrol |
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germansupplyscott
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Joined: May 22, 2004
Posts: 7093
Location: toronto
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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jerome,
i can get you most any auto light bulb made by osram. get me a bulb number. it might be 64113, 12v 10W halogen.
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SL |
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JMazier
Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2006
Posts: 900
Location: In my garage, Georgetown, Ontario, Canada...
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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PM sent
_________________
Cheers!
Jérôme
’79 Cali Westy 2.0 F.I.
'74 Honda CB 350 Four
'78 Honda CB 750 K
'12 Golf GTI
'11 Ural Patrol |
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Hippie
Samba Tinner
Joined: August 16, 2004
Posts: 1781
Location: Iowa: The Mud State
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 6:58 pm Post subject: Re: City Lights |
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| CJMazier wrote: |
| This is exactly what I was looking for. I will pick up a relay on Saturday and hook them up. Thanks Rob! |
You're welcome.
You could also skip the little lamps and use relays to run your headlights in series like many newer cars do for daytime runners.
That gives 6V per lamp but still uses the main headlights at 1/4 power. Just a thought.
Rob |
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Herbst '71
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Joined: April 14, 2004
Posts: 245
Location: Augusta, GA
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| Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:50 am Post subject: |
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Rob,
How would you set that up?
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Rik
'71 Deluxe/1600 DP
"Fortunately my mistakes are serving as a warning for others." |
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Hippie
Samba Tinner
Joined: August 16, 2004
Posts: 1781
Location: Iowa: The Mud State
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| Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Herbst '71 wrote: |
Rob,
How would you set that up? |
It depends on the wiring of the vehicle and I haven't drawn up a wiring plan, but it should be pretty easy.
I think you'd need a relay that opens the circuit to each headlight when the "daytime" switch was on. One of the contacts of that relay (a normally open contact) could close and send power to another relay's coil.
The second relay could send 12 volts to one headlight, open contacts to unground that lamp and send it's "leftover" power to the second headlight.
I'd have to draw up a plan and look for any unforseen design problems before had had a firm idea though.
Rob |
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dcdubs
Samba Member
Joined: January 29, 2003
Posts: 860
Location: the Great Northwest
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| Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 4:14 pm Post subject: |
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city lights were stock in europe why not just wire them as if its a stock european aplication and its more period correct than having partial wattage to your headlights.....and what if one of those relays dies while your on a trip then you gotta do a quick bypass surgery just to get your lights back........with city lights if one of the little bulbs dies big deal you can find them anywhere and they're cheap or carry a couple in your spare bulb kit in your glove box. simple is better
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AllRightGarageDoorsNW.com |
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