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flame thrower coil? is this what im gonna have to expect?
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hurley209
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:06 am    Post subject: flame thrower coil? is this what im gonna have to expect? Reply with quote

hey guys, my flame thrower coil, i believe has just died. it wouldnt spark, then gave a tiny little yellow spark and now nothing. so im gonna get a new coil, but since it hasnt even been a year since i got the flame thrower, im wondering, is that the usual life expectancy of those things? should i just stick to a blue coil?
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Grifter
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What have you got going on with the rest of the engine.....stock, performance, racing?
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fastinradford
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You shouldn't get a performance increase from just using a different coil from stock. If there were a more efficient sparking coil, vw would have put it on. Genuine bosche blue coils have been knows to last 10, 20 years, and sometimes more.
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hurley209
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

1600dual carbs, elec.ignition, simple, nothing super fancy
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hurley209
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmmm. i just called aicooled.net customer service, and john mentioned the high performance coils are usualy a bit better than the blue?
maybe i should give the flame thrower another chance?
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Augiedoggy
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

from what I've read there are only two different types of coil technologies out there and a lot of the advertising is just snake oil to make extra$$....if you really want to see a difference ditching the points and going with a more modern ignition is a more productive way to spend the $$
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hurley209
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

im running an electronic ign. already.
just dont wana buy another flame thrower if its gonna die again soon, and i have heard alot of good things bout the blue
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dan macmillan
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blue, black it makes no difference on a basically stock engine. just buy a coil that meets the impedence requirements of your points replacement module. Pertronics Igniter II requires a different coil. Most of the others use a standard coil. Check your local FLAPS for any coil that does not require an external resistor.
Many older cars used a coil that required an external resistance wire or ballast resistor. This was used so that during startup the coil would get a full 12 volts but was reduced during running to extend the life of the coil. This does not apply to our VWs.
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Last edited by dan macmillan on Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:21 am; edited 1 time in total
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ampegboy1
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's worth reading this before buying a blue coil - apparently not all "Bosch blue coils" are created equal.

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hurley209
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

well i am going to try another flame thrower before i rule it out, i mean stuff happens, couldve been a blue coil that had died also.
and seein as how there are so many blue coils out there, i guess you cant be to sure.

plus ive been reading alot of good from th flame thrower.

you guys think the fact that i didnt have it exactly verticaly mounted couldve affected its life span?
i had it at a slight angle. and ive read they need to be completely vertical
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dan macmillan
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hurley209 wrote:
well i am going to try another flame thrower before i rule it out, i mean stuff happens, couldve been a blue coil that had died also.
and seein as how there are so many blue coils out there, i guess you cant be to sure.

plus ive been reading alot of good from th flame thrower.

you guys think the fact that i didnt have it exactly verticaly mounted couldve affected its life span?
i had it at a slight angle. and ive read they need to be completely vertical


Mounting angle has no bearing on coil life, unless, you have a cheaper one that is not properly filled with oil.
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hurley209
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmm, then maybe it was just the coil that was bad. im gonna try another and see what happens with that
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johneliot
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not an expert by any means but, if you have a pertronix module you can use the stock coil if the ohms are correct for the unit. If you want to go with a flame thrower it will create a hotter spark. You can then use a larger gap on your plugs. After all is said and done the only thing a pointless ignition will give you over stock points is the ability to not have to adjust points. I'd call Pertronix and tell them what happened. Maybe they'll replace the coil. Never hurts to ask.
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hurley209
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oh yeah, i had forgotten, if i downgrade coil, im goin to have to re-adjust all my plugs, and i hate messing with #3..lol.
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dan macmillan
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If they are gapped to stock specs, no.
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raygreenwood
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fastinradford wrote:
You shouldn't get a performance increase from just using a different coil from stock. If there were a more efficient sparking coil, vw would have put it on. Genuine bosche blue coils have been knows to last 10, 20 years, and sometimes more.


I don't know where you got this idea....no offense....but that is not even close to true. The coil on VW's all the way through the type 4 had not changed significantly since about 1939. What they put on it was adequate....barely. When you start running at rpms much over about 3,000 rpm...the stock 18,000 volt coil barely keeps up. Add higher compression...like say the 1500T had on the type 3 and the 1.7L had on the type 4....and these ignitions are hopelessly outclassed.
Adding a 40KV coil like the flamethrower or numerous others is an immediatly noticable improvement on most higher compression VW's. Get rid of the points while you are at it.

Vw put in what was cheap and worked. To believe they have been updating to keep up with other changes...is not supported by any evidence. Ther were no major improvements to the VW ignition system until the vanagon came along with electronic igniton and a 45-55,000 volt coil...and it was a LARGE improvement.

Heres the trick....if you are just bolting up a higher voltage coil with faster saturation...and then standing back expecting to see flames shooting out your ass.....you have to ask yourself ...why would anything be different? You set your fuel mixture on either carbs or injection based upon timing and available spark adavnce its all tied together.
Put in a better coil and ignition.....and it should require a slight adjustment to mixture....if it were necessary at all.
I ran a flamethrower for years with a pertronix module on my type 4. After bolting it in and retuning fuel mixture it was a noticable improvement in reliabilty, throttle response and smoothness of starting.....not to mention just slightly better gas milage.

The Bosch blue coil is good basic coil that is adequate for most bone stock VW engines...up to but not including type 4. Adequate...thats all. Ray
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