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'73 Super Beetle - Fixing The Little (Possibly Major) Things
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mattegan
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 19, 2013 12:41 pm    Post subject: '73 Super Beetle - Fixing The Little (Possibly Major) Things Reply with quote

Okay. So, I thought I'd combine all of this into one huge topic.

I just bought a '73 Super Beetle for 4500 from a guy in Little Five Points, Atlanta. His house is conveniently located about 5 minutes from my campus apartment, so if I find anything unexpected I can easily go nag him about it (just kidding). She's a beauty, some minor hail damage, little dents on the flat surfaces, but as far as the exterior goes, that's about it. The interior is pretty darn excellent, with very new carpets, new soundproofing, clean headliner, updated seatbelt latches. Everything's amazing. -- Except for some little things.

Here she is in my driveway!
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


(I'll upload a few more later)

I've got a list of things to do which I'll be covering in this topic.

Necessary


    - Figure out where the oil pressure sensor went (it's just missing, I'm ordering a new one) and where the wire is that went to it.
    - Order a temperature sensor dipstick as an added precaution and wire it in series with the oil pressure sensor.
    - Install the license plate light.
    - Install missing parts of the engine tin, there are some holes on either side of the pulley that need to be filled, anyone know where to get the plates that screw on? I can't find them on jbugs or Wolfsberg.
    - Order/install a new oil pressure and oil temperature gauge (to replace old, mismatched faded ones), preferably one of these, along with their sensors. (I've seen it mentioned that a head-temp gauge is almost better than an oil temp gauge, any opinions on that?)
    - Fix a gap between the floor pan and the body in the rear right of the car. -- Hopefully it's just tightening some bolts. I drove in the rain the other day and the backseat filled up with a puddle of water. The rubber seal is there, it's just not meshing with anything.
    - Change the oil, do an engine checkup, normal stuff.
    - Bleed the brakes, possibly add more fluid, there's a lot of play in the brake pedal, and keeping still on hills requires an overextension of my leg.
    - Fix the horn or horn button.
    - Fix the fresh air fan.
    - Figure out why the side windows are sucking the window rubber seals down into the door when rolling down the window, makes it almost impossible to roll the window down.
    - Fix, or replace, the electric window washer fluid pump.
    - Does the 1973 Super have a VW emblem on the hood? I can't find any pictures of one....
    - Figure out what the loose wires under the back seat do, and the stray connector under the passenger seat does.


Unnecessary


    - Stereo, the car is missing a radio, so I'd like to modify an original to act as a volume knob and on/off switch for an preamp/amp, and then have a simple audio jack in the side of the glove compartment, with a bluetooth audio receiver plugged into the jack.
    - Front (and maybe rear) disc brakes.
    - Whitewalled tires would be the coolest thing ever.
    - Order/install a tach? Probably not necessary, but it would be nice.
    - AC, Georgia summers are hell, I have acquired a massive disdain for stoplights, and god help me if I want to take a girl on a date before sunset.
    - A jbugs chrome/blonde or chrome/cherry roof rack would be rad.
    - A wood-trimmed steering wheel to replace the tennis racquet grip taped plastic wheel, which is held together by electrical tape.
    - Double barrel carbs would be really neato.
    - A nicer exhaust system?
    - Some chrome housings for the engine bay?



Anyway. I think the "necessary" list sounds long, but it's probably mostly things I can get figured out in a day or two if I have the parts.

I'm really excited. The car is a total head-turner, but mainly it's just a really relaxing car to drive. I love it, and I'm looking forward to many years with my Beetle Smile


Last edited by mattegan on Mon Jul 22, 2013 7:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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type1guy
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 19, 2013 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would first buy a Bentley manual before anything. First on my list would be to adjust the brake shoes before anything. Then go through your list and prioritize the items. Good luck, nice super.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 19, 2013 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks pretty nice. Sounds like you have some cosmetic issues to deal with and that will take some time.
Your number one priority must be your braking system. Take no shortcuts in this area.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

very nice....i'm with wayne and type1 i'd defiantley go thru the brakes and branch out from there....good luck with the to do list... Smile
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

72 was the last year of the hood VW badge, after that they just had a longer chrome strip.


VWs never had oil temp or pressure gauges.
Remember in your other thread how I mentioed that is the flare nut fitting on the engine for a mechanical oil pressure gauge?

that is why your engine has no oil pressure light switch.
If you want to keep an oil pressure gauge (a good idea) as well as the stock idiot light you'll need a Tee piece, or a sender that has both built in.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 5:06 pm    Post subject: Re: '73 Super Beetle - Fixing The Little Things Reply with quote

mattegan wrote:
.................

    - Figure out where the oil pressure sensor went (it's just missing, I'm ordering a new one) and where the wire is that went to it.
    **********Covered in previous thread..........

    - Order a temperature sensor dipstick as an added precaution and wire it in series with the oil pressure sensor.
    ********** last I heard these were basically out of production?

    - Install the license plate light.

    - Install missing parts of the engine tin, there are some holes on either side of the pulley that need to be filled, anyone know where to get the plates that screw on? I can't find them on jbugs or Wolfsberg.
    ********** the holes are for heater hoses forcing hot air into the passenger area. If you haven't any heater boxes, plug the two large holes and the two discharge ports on the fan shroud. Doing this is VERY IMPORTANT!!!!
    Also......There should be a 3rd large hole for the air cleaners warm air intake on the right side.

    - Order/install a new oil pressure and oil temperature gauge (to replace old, mismatched faded ones), preferably one of these, along with their sensors. (I've seen it mentioned that a head-temp gauge is almost better than an oil temp gauge, any opinions on that?)

    - Fix a gap between the floor pan and the body in the rear right of the car. -- Hopefully it's just tightening some bolts. I drove in the rain the other day and the backseat filled up with a puddle of water. The rubber seal is there, it's just not meshing with anything.
    ********** hmmmmmm..... This could be problematic and a sign of serious unseen rust issues! Rare is it simply an old dry gasket on the Eastern Seaboard.......

    - Change the oil, do an engine checkup, normal stuff.

    - Bleed the brakes, possibly add more fluid, there's a lot of play in the brake pedal, and keeping still on hills requires an overextension of my leg.

    - Fix the horn or horn button.
    ********* understand that the horn has a constant 12 volts to it. The horn button provides a ground for the horn.

    - Fix the fresh air fan.
    ********** ummmm have fun, motor is seized and/or blade shaft mount is cracked and broken

    - Figure out why the side windows are sucking the window rubber seals down into the door when rolling down the window, makes it almost impossible to roll the window down.
    *********soak the rubber with silicone. They are most likely old, stiff and dry.

    - Fix, or replace, the electric window washer fluid pump.
    *********nope, never had an electric pump.......though a PO may have added one. The washers operated on spare tire air pressure.

    - Does the 1973 Super have a VW emblem on the hood? I can't find any pictures of one....
    ***** already answered......

    - Figure out what the loose wires under the back seat do, and the stray connector under the passenger seat does.
    ******* post photos of the wires..... Could be PO speakers..... Could be an old hard start relay...... Could be a in duct heater fan.......???


Unnecessary


    - Stereo, the car is missing a radio, so I'd like to modify an original to act as a volume knob and on/off switch for an preamp/amp, and then have a simple audio jack in the side of the glove compartment, with a bluetooth audio receiver plugged into the jack.
    ********yep, been done. Or..... See my thread, I simply used a block off plate and added Bluetooth enabled music to a hidden amp.

    - Front (and maybe rear) disc brakes.

    - Whitewalled tires would be the coolest thing ever.
    *******$$$$$$$ could be ugly too......

    - Order/install a tach? Probably not necessary, but it would be nice.

    - AC, Georgia summers are hell, I have acquired a massive disdain for stoplights, and god help me if I want to take a girl on a date before sunset.
    *******readily available aftermarket. There is an outfit in Florida .......Gilmore? And one in California, make sure you get the in dash kit, not the hang below the dash kit.

    - A jbugs chrome/blonde or chrome/cherry roof rack would be rad.

    - A wood-trimmed steering wheel to replace the tennis racquet grip taped plastic wheel, which is held together by electrical tape.

    - Double barrel carbs would be really neato.

    - A nicer exhaust system?

    - Some chrome housings for the engine bay?
    ******** search......chrome items are most often garbage!!..........you will find that........... "Chrome doesn't get you home"




Anyway. I think the "necessary" list sounds long, but it's probably mostly things I can get figured out in a day or two if I have the parts.

I'm really excited. The car is a total head-turner, but mainly it's just a really relaxing car to drive. I love it, and I'm looking forward to many years with my Beetle Smile


Enjoy! I'll also emphasize..... GET THE BENTLEY! Wink

Dave
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joel wrote:
72 was the last year of the hood VW badge, after that they just had a longer chrome strip................


I was just reading Garwoods Car of the Century.........yes, I know there are mistakes in the volumes but.......

It is interesting to note on page 955 he points out that very early 1973 year models did indeed have the VW emblem on the hood, but it was quickly dropped during production.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 5:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah I've seen factory photos showing a 73 super with a hood badge but if any made it out with them it wasnt many.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 5:54 am    Post subject: Re: '73 Super Beetle - Fixing The Little Things Reply with quote

Looks like a sweet ride!

[quote="djkeev"][quote="mattegan"].................


    - Install the license plate light. If you get this working, please post pics! Have tried a couple things with ours and can't get it to light up.

    - Fix the horn or horn button.
    ********* understand that the horn has a constant 12 volts to it. The horn button provides a ground for the horn. It could also be a busted horn. Our '73 came with a bad one, the new one is plug and play. Wiring this is pretty easy, if you do it wrong it will most likely be grounded and the horn will sound as soon as you turn the key. Ours did this, we found a loose connection behind the horn button and it fixed it right up.

    - Fix the fresh air fan.
    ********** ummmm have fun, motor is seized and/or blade shaft mount is cracked and broken Let me know if you can find one! Ours is probably seized, but no dice on finding a working one that anyone is willing to part with Smile

    - Figure out why the side windows are sucking the window rubber seals down into the door when rolling down the window, makes it almost impossible to roll the window down.
    *********soak the rubber with silicone. They are most likely old, stiff and dry. If the scrapers are new, you'll have the same problem, with the same solution. It gunks up the windows for a little while, but ours sorted themselves out after a couple weeks. In the meantime, we just had to remember to gently lift the seal away from the glass, just slid a finger between the rubber and the glass, otherwise it pulled the seal off of the door.

    - Fix, or replace, the electric window washer fluid pump.
    *********nope, never had an electric pump.......though a PO may have added one. The washers operated on spare tire air pressure. Have one in the box that we need to install, will post pics once we get it done. If you beat me to it, post pics as well, could use some ideas on how to best mount/wire this thing!

    - Figure out what the loose wires under the back seat do, and the stray connector under the passenger seat does.
    ******* post photos of the wires..... Could be PO speakers..... Could be an old hard start relay...... Could be a in duct heater fan.......??? Is it a brown wire? We had the same thing. Ours originally hooked up to a sensor in the seats which set off the door buzzer if you didn't have your seatbelt on. There were sensors in the old seatbelt latches as well, so if you have new seatbelts, the PO probably just unplugged the sensors but didn't remove the wiring. Sorry, I don't have a pic of where ours used to be, but the connector you mention was on the left of the passenger side pan just behind where the seat adjuster latches to the pan. The wires ran from the front of the front seat back, across the center, and then up to the front of the other seat.



- Some chrome housings for the engine bay?
******** search......chrome items are most often garbage!!..........you will find that........... "Chrome doesn't get you home" We used the original tins and spray painted ours white with appliance enamel - looks nice, easy to clean, and holds up to the heat.


And yes, definitely the Bentley manual! We bought one after puzzling over the Haynes and Chiltons for months. Slightly pricer, but well worth the investment!

Hope some of this helps you out - good luck with your baby!
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Posting on this website is hard. I keep looking at what everybody else is doing and after I know it an hour has gone by!

Okay. First thing's first. A non-cellphone picture is in order.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


It actually took me a while longer to write this because I was staring at the picture. Anyway.

Okay, so of course, brakes are priority. I think it probably goes, brakes, oil temperature, water leak, license plate light. Everything else is probably low priority.

I adjusted the rear brakes today, and bled the rear brake lines. It started to rain, so, I'm about to go out and do the front brakes. I took it for a spin around the block and the improvement was impressive. I can stop now. I can keep myself from rolling backwards on a hill without having to overextend my leg. I can't wait to see how it acts after I adjust/bleed the front. I don't even think discs are that big of a deal now. The drums work way better than I thought.

I took off the right side runner (what do you call it?) to inspect the gap on the right side some more. And I can't really understand what's gone wrong. It appears as though there's a slight dent in the body panel, and that the runner is kind of dinged up, causing the seal to not be completely perfect between it and the pan (I think that's what the seal presses up against). Here's a picture or two, see what you guys can make of it. I really bumped up the exposure on these to give you a chance to see what is what.

Should the metal just stop like that?
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Closeup. I shined a light under the back seat, the protruding light can be seen in the red square.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here's the runner off the car, so you can see how it's not straight at all.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


And here's a picture of another hole that's under the seat. I don't think this is where most of the water is getting in though. Should it be here?
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Not really sure if this is a problem with the runner being dented and not creating the seal it should, or the shape of the parts on the car, or a lack of metal on the car.

Okay, next question. I'm going to order some quality VDO gauges, or I was looking at some nifty LED ones, but I think I'll go with the non-techno look. I'd like to keep everything as stock possible, or stock looking. Here's what they've got in there now, I kind of want to fix the dash up (possibly get a new plate without the unused holes?).

These just kinda suck.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


So I know I need to get a T-fitting for the pressure sender (stock) and the pressure sensor for the gauge, and I know where those go, but where does the oil temperature gauge go? I've seen some photos from a fitting under the car?

Also, I've been told that these holes need to be plugged up with plates. I don't imagine that's a bad idea. I've been told it can interfere with the proper cooling of the engine. (Oh, which by the way, I've been scanning with a IR temperature gauge, the heads run around 207. Oil dipstick is a tad cooler, I think that's about right from what I've read in other threads).

Here's the holes.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Okay. Here's my next problem, the wires under the back seat. I haven't even looked at a wiring diagram yet, but any suggestions would be welcome, I see the relay and what looks like a Motorola voltage regulator?

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Lastly, I think something is actually wrong with my fan motor, I drove around today and my brother asked me what the fan switch was, so I turned it on and left it on, and I smelled something, and white smoke was coming up from these grates on the hood.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I think it was my fan motor smoking. Smells like a burnt motor too, so that's what I'm going with. Oh, also, this is where I think my emblem goes. I can't think of what else goes there... am I right?

And a perk picture. I love this shift knob that came with the car. Gorgeous.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Thanks for all your help guys. I've got a while to go before the car is perfect, but I don't think it's going to be a long journey. I want to get the important stuff out of the way so I can install a stereo system. I'm a total music guy, and I'm missing my tunes! I haven't listened to the Beatles in my Beetle yet!
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well....... Remember my comment about the water and younthinking you that you needed a new pan seal? I replied that it may be a sign of unseen rust?

Yep........ So sorry but here is major project #1
Heater channels or at best, heater channel repair......

These photos show major amounts of rusted away metal behind the RUNNING BOARDS..............it is most likely the same on both sides and there is a lot more heinous rust to discover....... So sorry........
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here is what my 74 looked like........ And yes, mine LOOKED solid initially! (Mine is a Convertible and has an extra support rail you can see under the rocker channel that Sedans do NOT have)
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



That hole by the front grille? That's for a windshield washer nozzle........
http://www.chucksconvertibleparts.com/products/windshields-washer-squirter
.............
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Dave
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's terrible news. I'll snap a few pictures tomorrow.... A lot of the rusty-loooking parts in those photos are dirt. I'll clean it off tomorrow and see if I can get a better picture with more light. To be honest though, I can't find any actual rust. If anything it's just rusted away metal that somebody didn't replace.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattegan wrote:
That's terrible news. I'll snap a few pictures tomorrow.... A lot of the rusty-loooking parts in those photos are dirt. I'll clean it off tomorrow and see if I can get a better picture with more light. To be honest though, I can't find any actual rust. If anything it's just rusted away metal that somebody didn't replace.


One of the first steps in handling this type of discovery is denial! Laughing ..... OK........... Check!

I didn't want to admit I purchased a rusty Beetle! I KNOW Beetles and I failed to look properly, my emotions and excitement clouded my vision!
Nothing wrong with this solid Super Vert! ....... Or is there?......
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


You've got rust, believe me........ You wouldn't have those gaping holes behind the running board if you didn't have rust. In your photo...... Those odd holes just forward of the big rectangular opening?.............Rust.
Take an ice pick and start stabbing various parts of the heater channel, inside the car as well through the carpet.
Probe the inner splash panel behind the front wheels.......
Probe the inner fender area in front of the rear torsion bars......
Check your body to pan bolts...... Try to loosen them and see if you get heart wrenching crunching noises and they don't loosen........
Bumper mounting areas as well, try to lift your car up using the bumpers.......

Sadly, A PO has covered and hidden your rust from you using paint and under coating spray.

Dave
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay. I'll start looking tomorrow. There's a lot of stuff under the seat that doesn't have anti-rust paint on it, and I still can't see rust.

How difficult is it to replace heater channels? Can I do it without taking the body off, or messing up any of the paint? Or disturbing too much?

I go back to school in a few weeks, and I'd like to have the car fixed up by then.....

I'm going to go cry now.

Brick wall
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heater channel and floor pan replacement involve a good deal of effort, time and money. I would consider it pretty major. I will refer you to this thread. It details some of the challenges involved.http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=547653
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does it require having the body off the frame?
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 7:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, here's my ideal scenario. Fix the leak well enough for it to last me two semesters at school, and overhaul it with my time I have next summer.

Next summer I can start at the beginning of the thing. I'm young, but I've worked on things since I can remember even having memories. My dad's a repair guy too (he's an engineer, I'm studying engineering), and he really loves buying tools. -- I've looked through all of the steps in the thread that wayne1230cars listed, and I think I have all the tools I need to do it. -- I'm just not sure if I have the time before I go back to school to do the repair. (Semester starts the 19th of August.)

Any ideas on stopping the leak for a few months?
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could always pop rivet in some patches and use aluminum foil tape to seal it up on a temporary basis. I'd shy away from doing any unnecessary work to the car and enjoy it for what it is for a while. If no other major problems pop up then you can attack the rust problem down the road,when it gets so bad you can't drive it or it fails inspection or you have time and money to do it.

You need to buy the Bug Me Video heater channel replacement DVD. This will give you more of an idea what is involved in a proper repair. It is serious work, and if you aren't a welder, don't try it without professional help. Many of the major suppliers stock their videos.

This car is a good example of why it helps to have someone familiar with the cars along when you are considering one for purchase. In many states that car would not be considered safe for the road and it would fail inspection. A little paint, a few cans of undercoating, and some Bondo, and it would be hidden again, like it probably was when the last guy bought it. As you can see that sort of repair is not very long lasting.

It is a hard lesson to learn and expensive.
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djkeev
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your holes in the engine tin...........
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The round one is for the air cleaner preheat tube.

The other openings are because the tin behind the pulley is from an earlier model year engine. Newer tin has a more shallow incline towards the pulley resulting in a longer tin extending towards the left, thus not leaving those gaps.
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Dave
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Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
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djkeev
Samba Moderator


Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32432
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
djkeev is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gauges........
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After market and very poorly installed.
The rectangle is actually for a clock.......

Dave
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Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos

Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
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