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Mid-Engine Chassis
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spectre6000
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PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 1:30 pm    Post subject: Mid-Engine Chassis Reply with quote

I'm contemplating building mid-engine chassis from scratch. Does anyone have any detailed photos of your mid-engine car? Does anyone have any schematics for them? I'm in the information gathering phase, so any information is good information.
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baja72
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PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You might be able to find an old mid-engine rail and graft that in and go from there.
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drmiller100
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PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think an older mid engine formula ford would be a good thing to copy....
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ataim
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PostPosted: Wed May 05, 2010 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could start here: http://www.duneguide.com/ProductReview_mid_engine_shootout.htm
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spectre6000
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PostPosted: Wed May 05, 2010 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

None of the companies referenced seem to be in business any more. At least the websites are all dead. The project I have in mind will be along the vein of the Porsche 550, only with VW body parts (this is still a few years out). I just want to see how some of the established designs handle the engine/tranny cradle.
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Jason Hopper

-'57 German Market Karmann Ghia (DD)
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"Buy the best, cry once." -Gene Berg
"A cheap man will always buy the cheapest thing available, and then buys another one hoping for a better result, and then spends the rest of his life in misery complaining about it. A thrifty man will buy a good part once and never think about it again." -RockCrusher
"Don't feed the Shitty Parts Monster!" -Me
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spectre6000
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PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is there anyone currently making a mid-engine chassis? Or better yet, selling plans?
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Jason Hopper

-'57 German Market Karmann Ghia (DD)
-'58 German Market Deluxe Beetle (in progress)
"Buy the best, cry once." -Gene Berg
"A cheap man will always buy the cheapest thing available, and then buys another one hoping for a better result, and then spends the rest of his life in misery complaining about it. A thrifty man will buy a good part once and never think about it again." -RockCrusher
"Don't feed the Shitty Parts Monster!" -Me
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turboblue
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PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

XTC still offers one.
http://www.xtc-motorsports.com/vw.htm

I have an old Appletree mid engine chassis that I sand drag race.
Forerunner of the XTC.
First one they ever built.
Serial #001
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spectre6000
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PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you have any photos of the engine/tranny area?
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Jason Hopper

-'57 German Market Karmann Ghia (DD)
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"Buy the best, cry once." -Gene Berg
"A cheap man will always buy the cheapest thing available, and then buys another one hoping for a better result, and then spends the rest of his life in misery complaining about it. A thrifty man will buy a good part once and never think about it again." -RockCrusher
"Don't feed the Shitty Parts Monster!" -Me
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spize909
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PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2010 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would you like to get some close-ups of mine? I wasn't sure exactly what it was you were trying to do but I can snap whatever you want.
Here's what I have handy.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
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turboblue
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PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2010 7:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

spectre6000 wrote:
Do you have any photos of the engine/tranny area?


Don't have any close ups but my engine and tranny is mounted in 4 places.
Rear of tranny, bottom of bellhousing, top of engine at the bellhousing and front of engine.
My engine case is a universal version so there is tapped holes for the front mount.

I can pull engine out over the top side of the chassis and leave the tranny in or pull the tranny and leave the engine in.
I can take more pics but the engine is out at the moment.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
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spectre6000
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PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd like to see close ups and macros of the engine and chassis mounting areas as well as the suspension in relation. Thanks!
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-'57 German Market Karmann Ghia (DD)
-'58 German Market Deluxe Beetle (in progress)
"Buy the best, cry once." -Gene Berg
"A cheap man will always buy the cheapest thing available, and then buys another one hoping for a better result, and then spends the rest of his life in misery complaining about it. A thrifty man will buy a good part once and never think about it again." -RockCrusher
"Don't feed the Shitty Parts Monster!" -Me
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spize909
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PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spectre6000 wrote:
I'd like to see close ups and macros of the engine and chassis mounting areas as well as the suspension in relation. Thanks!


I'll try to get you some tomorrow.
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earthquake
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PostPosted: Tue May 11, 2010 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Has any body ever done a mid-engine with IRS before? I have never seen one but that not saying much. how about a front engine set up with porsche 924-944 drive train? you could stuff the motor out in the airstream and might not need any cooling gear, that would be different. Shocked

Casey
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spectre6000
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PostPosted: Tue May 11, 2010 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

VW based front-engined trike with the engine out in the air stream. It would look pretty good if it weren't a trike.
http://www.oakes.co.uk/
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Jason Hopper

-'57 German Market Karmann Ghia (DD)
-'58 German Market Deluxe Beetle (in progress)
"Buy the best, cry once." -Gene Berg
"A cheap man will always buy the cheapest thing available, and then buys another one hoping for a better result, and then spends the rest of his life in misery complaining about it. A thrifty man will buy a good part once and never think about it again." -RockCrusher
"Don't feed the Shitty Parts Monster!" -Me
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Wheel_Works
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PostPosted: Tue May 11, 2010 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My old Appletree Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Whitehill still makes a chassis like this http://whitehillsbuggyshop.net/
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spize909
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PostPosted: Tue May 11, 2010 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok, here's a few more.

Here's the mount at the trans/engine
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Here's the bottom mount at the front...well I guess in a traditional install it'd be the back.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Trans mount at the rear of the tranny
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

And a couple more angles
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
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DWP
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Take a look under a 914 porsche for ideas of mounting the engine trans.
Another idea would be formula Vee and Formula First
http://formulavee.org/interchange/
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=100
You can get ideas of mounting the trans and shift linkage
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joescoolcustoms Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 6:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Best I have on hand, mine is in the enclosed trailer right now.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

The rear trans mount picks up the lower 4 bolts on the trans gear carrier section with longer studs installed. The front trans mount is two solid mounts in the stock rubber mount location. The front engine mount picks up two bolt holes tapped into the case. The complete section sits in a cradle that drops out the bottom, (the rear cradle mounts can be seen in this photo).


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

The rear suspension is cheap and simple. A wish bone/hair pin style arm connected with a hiem joint at about the same spot the spring plate would attach and supported by a nitrogen shock. You can see a little of the front engine mount inthe second picture.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
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ataim
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 7:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

earthquake wrote:
Has any body ever done a mid-engine with IRS before?

Casey


My uneducated guess is that the trailing arm gets in the way with the engine mounting.
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wheel_Works wrote:
My old Appletree


Cool, didn't know Garth was back at it.

My sand drag buggy is the first mid-engine Appletree ever built.
Serial # AAME001
It's been stretched 12" right behind the seat.
Stock wheelbase wasn't enough for the speed it runs.

Joecool
My cradle is similar but it is flanged beneath the engine.
I can pull the tranny or the engine independently of one another.

spectre6000
I will try to remember to take home my digital camera and get some pics for you
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