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firing order 1600
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pat schnitzler
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:02 pm    Post subject: firing order 1600 Reply with quote

motor does not start and will only backfire with proper firing order
1432, clockwise facing top of dist.
when i change the #2 wire and #4 wire, making the order 1234 or 1432 in a counter clockwise rotation, the motor will start and run with no power.
what is up?

please help
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KTPhil Premium Member
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You do know VW cylinders are not numbered inline, right? They are (viewed from the top):

3=|    |
    |    |=1
4=|    |
    |    |=2
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pat schnitzler
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i don't understand what you are trying to tell me?
i know the cylinder order and firing order from the manual.

any more help would be appreciated. anything?

thanks pat s
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KTPhil Premium Member
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just checking. A common mistake for new VW owners.

Maybe your distributor gear is off a cog or two?

A little more info, please:
How long have you had the car?
What did you change last since it was running right?
What manual are you using?
A few details about your mtor would help... carb, distributor?
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pat schnitzler
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1971 duel port with mechanical advance dist.
just installed empi duel carbs.
stalk with single carb the motor was running fine.
since i installed the the new carbs this has been the problem.
i first installed an electronic ignition,new wires and coil to the dist. as well as the new carbs.
i thought that the ignition was set up wrong becouse the instructions asked for a 1.5mm gap between the disk and the electode thing. the distance was significantly greater.
so i tore the new system out and put back the old points and condenser. still no luck just the odd backfire.
so i tried to change wire #2 and #4 wire, the motor then fired.
added gas to car and i got the engine running.
i took it for a drive. it ran, but had little power.
tried to hook up wires as per the idiot book and another manual i have. still no luck ,just backfire.
still runs but no power. that's my story.

thanks pat s
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mintonman
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you say you swapped 2 & 4 did you swap 1 & 3 aswell?? If not try it and see how she runs
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pat schnitzler
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks. i'll try it tomorrow.
going to bed. wish me luck.

thanks for all your replies .
i appreciate it

thanks pat s
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mintonman
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good luck!
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Emeritusx
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just pop the cap and look... Put the pulley at TDC it better point to #1 or #3

Make it go to TDC #1 by turning the pulley

Now at #1 - turn pulley 180 degrees, now it points at #4, 180 more #3, 180 more (BDC) #2, back around to the top #1

Its pretty simple... Remember engine cylinder numbers with 3/4 and 1/2 - common fractions

edit: turn pulley clockwise..
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pat schnitzler
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks guys.
tried to start engine today ,in what i thought was the correct firing order,with no luck just backfire.
i switched #2 and #4 wires and got it to run,like yesterday.
i tried what mintonman suggested to switch #1 and #3 wires.
i pulled both wires off, and guess what?
engine kept running with no difference.
i then switched them.engine smoothed out and runs with power.
i know that the engine was running on only 2 cylinders.
firing order is now 1432 but according to the dist. mark and rotor pointing at #1 , the #3 wire is connected there. so the dist. wires are rotated 2 spots on the cap.
i hope i have made some sense so someone can tell me what is going on.
why is are the wires not hooked up like in the manuals?
is my dist not hooked up right?

thanks
any advice is appreciated.
thanks samba and those who visit the sites

pat s
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mintonman
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mine runs the same way LOL!! What kind of dizzy are you running? Is it one of the new 009 distibutors? It is possible that the loeb on the bottom of the distributor was put on wrong. There is a roll pin holding it on, if you're sure the distributor is in correct you can pull the distributor back out and push that roll pin out to spin the loeb 180 degrees and reinstall distributor.
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mintonman
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

P.S. You should put that electronic ignition back in and see how she runs!
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Daddybus
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Put the motor on top dead center (pull #1 spark plug and confirm by putting a screwdriver down the spark plug hole). Pull the distributor and look down into the motor at the distributor drive. The channel/slot across the face of the distributor drive is offset. The bigger half moon should be towards the front of the bus. If the big moon side is towards the rear of the bus, then the drive is installed 180 degrees out and needs to be pulled, rotated 180 degrees and re-installed.

At TDC the rotor should be pointed roughly between four and six o'clock for cyl. #1.

Check your timing.
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Da TOW'D
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

put the crank pully on TDC #1 cylinder
align the V with the case seam
rotor should point to #1
pop off #1 & 2 valve cover and see if #1 cylinder(front right side) rockers are loose
if the are loose then you have #1 if not then you have #3
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pyrOman
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 6:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pat schnitzler wrote:
i then switched them.engine smoothed out and runs with power.
i know that the engine was running on only 2 cylinders.


Your engine firing order is 180 degrees off. No biggie, live with it. I just bought an engine with the same condition but I happened to have a distributor which I had refurbished before but installed the offset drive piece backwards. Used it in this engine and now it "sits" in the "correct" spot! Laughing

I've heard that dual carbs often idle on just 2 cylinders and that this is okay so long as it runs good while driving. Confused
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pat schnitzler
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks to everyone who responded.
lots of good help and insight.

thanks
pat s
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