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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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 Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 4:55 pm Post subject: Checking my Eber |
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First off, Hello  first post and all that. 
i have to be honest.... i dont own a THING, but this seemed the best place to ask about ebers.
i've been through the sticky and have a wiring diagram infront of me...
i've just acquired a BN4 to fit in my beetle.
the wires poking out look like this
theres a long brown with these two also (ground?)
i've got a car battery, admitantly it wasnt holding charge so its been sat for a while, but put it on charged and that topped it up, tried my tests both connected and not connected to the charger.
i tried just testing the pump first, go a click with every touch of the POS with the other terminal on the NEG side of the battery so that works.
first i left that off.
connected the BROWN to the NEG side of the battery.
and connected the thick RED to the positive along with the GREEN as i ashumed thats how it would be with the switch turned on (i dont have a switch)
NOTHING......
tried it without the GREEN..... nothing.
hooked up my pump to the BROWN/WHITE and GREY wire, then tried the same two test again... nothing.
i check the white fuse, and cleaned the contacts for that. nothing.
what i find odd is that when i tested the pump, i got a spark each time i touched the POS cable to the terminal, as you would....
yet when i connected the heater to the terminal i got no sparks, not even a little crack, or tick.
one thing to note from the pictures in the blue wire going to the the choc block is just connected to its self, i guess they deleted the.... thing that sits on the hot air end of the assembley... i really dont know its name sorry....
just wondering what i'm doing wrong here?
Thanks
Andy |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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so with the brown connected to the neg battery terminal,
when i connect the white to positive i get a click from the silver box (relay?) and again each time i connect it, or flick the reset lever.....? |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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ok, with the brown on the NEG terminal, and the POS terminal attached to the thermal cut out switch on the terminal with the two wires, YELLOW and BLACK the fan works.......
i'm confused? |
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Captain Spalding
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Joined: February 19, 2005
Posts: 2519
Location: . . . in denial.
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| Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 6:15 pm Post subject: |
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Okay,
Top photo:
Green and brown/white wires go to the fuel pump.
As for the brown wire: there are three brown wires coming off the relay. One of them disappears into the heater. One goes to a ground screw on the overheating switch (the part with the white fuse on it.) The third grounds to the vehicle chassis, or for the purposes of your test, the battery negative.
The green does not go to the battery.
Second photo, red and gray wires. (Old gray wires can sometimes look white.) Red gets connected to battery positive. This shouldn't turn anything on. The gray wire (white one in your photo) is what would get power from the timer switch. With the red wire already connected to the battery positive, touch your white wire to the battery positive, and the fan should turn. This assumes that the two blue wires which would normally go to the missing temperature regulating switch are shorted.)
Let us know what happens. |
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Captain Spalding
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Joined: February 19, 2005
Posts: 2519
Location: . . . in denial.
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| Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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| andy198712 wrote: |
ok, with the brown on the NEG terminal, and the POS terminal attached to the thermal cut out switch on the terminal with the two wires, YELLOW and BLACK the fan works.......
i'm confused? |
The BLACK of the yellow black pair is what powers the fan. You're just bypassing all the safety features to make it spin.
Do you have this wiring diagram?
Oh, and isn't it past your bed time? |
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andy198712
Samba Member
Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Spalding wrote: |
| andy198712 wrote: |
ok, with the brown on the NEG terminal, and the POS terminal attached to the thermal cut out switch on the terminal with the two wires, YELLOW and BLACK the fan works.......
i'm confused? |
The BLACK of the yellow black pair is what powers the fan. You're just bypassing all the safety features to make it spin.
Do you have this wiring diagram?
Oh, and isn't it past your bed time? |
i'd read something ages ago that said about testing if the fan works by doing that... and it sort of gave me hope!
my bed time? indeed! its just gone 1:30AM but having just done two night shifts i'm a little out of sync 
this is the diagram i've been using
which shows the green going to the switch..... thus i connected it to the pos aswell.....
i though it was odd as the GREY and BROWN/WHITE have the same insulators and same length implying they go to the same place....ie the pump!
i'll try this in the morning.
but pretty sure i tried touching the grey to the POS aswell and nothing happened..... but will try it again and see how i get one
yeah my two BLUE wires that in your diagram go to E are connected together by passing the temp reg switch, is this OK for a bit?
also i dont have a an eber switch, can i just use a normal one rated to 30amps?
Thanks for your help its been very helpful! |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Mon Dec 06, 2010 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Spalding wrote: |
Okay,
Top photo:
Green and brown/white wires go to the fuel pump.
As for the brown wire: there are three brown wires coming off the relay. One of them disappears into the heater. One goes to a ground screw on the overheating switch (the part with the white fuse on it.) The third grounds to the vehicle chassis, or for the purposes of your test, the battery negative.
The green does not go to the battery.
Second photo, red and gray wires. (Old gray wires can sometimes look white.) Red gets connected to battery positive. This shouldn't turn anything on. The gray wire (white one in your photo) is what would get power from the timer switch. With the red wire already connected to the battery positive, touch your white wire to the battery positive, and the fan should turn. This assumes that the two blue wires which would normally go to the missing temperature regulating switch are shorted.)
Let us know what happens. |
it works!!!
whats next? i dont hear the pump clicking away though.... and after a while it cuts out, guessing thats the safety as the red reset switch started it again.....
where to next?
thank you!! |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Mon Dec 06, 2010 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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| just sat the tip of the pump inlet in carb cleaner and then tapped a POS from the battery on one terminal with the other on neg and after a about..... 20-40 clicks it started shooting out the tip.... so the diaframe is OK |
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Captain Spalding
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Joined: February 19, 2005
Posts: 2519
Location: . . . in denial.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 06, 2010 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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| andy198712 wrote: |
| where to next? |
To make a worthwhile job of it, you really need a proper timer switch and the temperature regulating switch (E16 and E13 respectively, on the diagram I referenced.)
The timer switch has two modes of operation. When the key is in the car and switched on, one can twist the knob slightly to the right until a click is heard. The heater will turn on and run normally. When the key is switched off, so will be the heater. Or, without the key, one can twist the knob to the right well beyond that first click, whereupon a mechanical clockwork timer will begin to tick down. The heater will come on as normal, and turn off by itself when the time runs out. The convenience of this is that one can turn on the heater in the morning and have the car be warm before setting off. The purpose of the timer is to prevent the car from running out of fuel with the heater left on, and to prevent the home of someone with an attached garage from filling up with poisonous carbon monoxide.
The temperature regulating switch will switch the burner on and off in approximate accordance with a predetermined setting, while leaving the fan running. This is a much more convenient way to regulate the cabin temperature that having to constantly turn the heater on and off manually. As you probably know the temperature regulating switch sits on top of the heater, and is controlled by way of a cable routed through the firewall to the dash.
So, in my opinion, you really should have these parts, and any attempt do do without them on a permanent basis would constitute corner-cutting and amateurish conduct. They are rather rare and pricey however.
If I were in your situation, before investing in rare and pricey parts and drilling holes in my Beetle, I would want to do a more thorough test of the heater to make sure it actually makes heat. All you would need that you might not have is a length of fuel line and a gas can.
I'm not sure what other bits and pieces you have. There is an exhaust pipe, with a clamp and a high temp gasket to go through the body, as well as the intake and heat ducting. No doubt you will be improvising the heater ducting, but the exhaust is something you will probably need. |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 12:54 am Post subject: |
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yeah thats fair enough,
i've got the exhaust pipe and clamp, and a nozzle almost for the ht end and intake for the cool end (will get a picture to explain better 
but the switches i dont have, i've seen a timer for sale now and again but the thermo switch.....
i agree as you say, best to make sure everything works properly first, is it just a case of connecting up the pump to a fuel supply, bleeding it and testing then?
Thanks |
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CarlIseminger
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Joined: May 12, 2008
Posts: 833
Location: Grand Forks, ND
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| Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 11:03 am Post subject: |
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| If you don't mind my asking, I was wondering if one could retrofit the timer switch to a South Wind Heater? This would be a great addition to my bug. |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 10:16 am Post subject: |
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dont mind at all
the Eber lives!
conected up some stubby bits of fuel pipe to ovoid bleeding it for the test and she kicked in after about 15seconds
got nice and toasty and did the correct cool down after i removed the GREY wire
i did notice it was a little smokey, not sure if this is just burning off old soot as its probably been sat for a while...? and was only once it got hot, not when it just started, so may just need a burn off? or is it rich...
and when i looked down the hot end i could see the inners glowing and could see what looked like a small blow tourch like amber flame, is this normal? or was it just the air being blown over it? here's a picture, doesnt show the glowing part so good but you get the idea. couldnt smell anything bad in the hot air either, smelt clear.
here's some pics
the testing setup was a touch ghetto i gotta say!
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Captain Spalding
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Joined: February 19, 2005
Posts: 2519
Location: . . . in denial.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 10:40 am Post subject: |
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| Excellent! I love how you clustered cans of flammable liquids around it to shield the rest of the house from damage should anything go awry. |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Spalding wrote: |
| Excellent! I love how you clustered cans of flammable liquids around it to shield the rest of the house from damage should anything go awry. |
the little open tub of petrol was my personal favorite! what you cant see is the "oh shit" fire extinguisher just out of frame encase i had a fire ball! and i had some little glowing bits or carbon come out the exhaust also which raised an eyebrow as to where they landed!
so, on my lis is the thermo switch (might be on my list for a while!)
i'm planning on ducting it into the 3 windscreen vents, one worry is, will it crack the windscreen on a cold day? although i guess as it heats up over a min or two it should be ok? will also save cutting the shell, barring the exhaust.
and what amp switch will i need till i sort the timer switch? i'm thinking 30amp, as thats the max draw i think, and better safe then sorry, it will be hidden anyway till i source the VW item at a sensible price, but 30's are harder to find then 16amp switches.....
Thank you Captain Spalding, your help has been amazing!! |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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so what amp cable should i run from the battery (fused and what fuse) to my eber??
Thanks just gona start sanding it down to paint it |
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Captain Spalding
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Joined: February 19, 2005
Posts: 2519
Location: . . . in denial.
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| Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2010 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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| andy198712 wrote: |
so what amp cable should i run from the battery (fused and what fuse) to my eber??
Thanks just gona start sanding it down to paint it |
I'm not sure how you measure wire size over there in the U.K.. The drawing says that the wire should have a cross section of 1.5mm˛. That's somewhere between 14 and 16 gauge here. The circuit in the Thing that the heater is on has a 16 amp fuse.
Cheers. |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 5:18 am Post subject: |
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| Captain Spalding wrote: |
| andy198712 wrote: |
so what amp cable should i run from the battery (fused and what fuse) to my eber??
Thanks just gona start sanding it down to paint it |
I'm not sure how you measure wire size over there in the U.K.. The drawing says that the wire should have a cross section of 1.5mm˛. That's somewhere between 14 and 16 gauge here. The circuit in the Thing that the heater is on has a 16 amp fuse.
Cheers. |
once again, thanks very much!!
http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.eu/VWP-onlinestore/cable/standardcable.php
second one down should do?, rated to 17.5 amps |
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Captain Spalding
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Joined: February 19, 2005
Posts: 2519
Location: . . . in denial.
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| Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 9:42 am Post subject: |
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| andy198712 wrote: |
| . . . second one down should do?, rated to 17.5 amps |
More than adequate. |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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so.....
got it all painted up in a nice blue to match my beetle.
wired the RED to the battery positive.
put the BROWN to a chassis earth.
then when i touched the GREY wire on an earth.... nothing happens
tried connecting the pump.... nothing still....
the engine was off for the test, and no change with ignition on, but the POwer is coming direct from the battery should shouldn't matter? should i connect the BROWN earth the battery negative then?
cheers |
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andy198712
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Joined: December 05, 2010
Posts: 1209
Location: Cornwall - UK
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| Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 6:37 am Post subject: |
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| any ideas? i'll check it over with the multi meter later and see where i get |
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