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64vdub
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Joined: August 05, 2008
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Location: Sunny So. Cal
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 Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 1:06 am Post subject: Case saver pulled out :( What are my options?? |
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Hello everyone. So, I had a stripped plug thread and I quickly took care of it. I pulled the head off, took the head down to RIMCO, they put in a time-sert and away I went. Awesome! Almost...
When I went to re-assemble everything I noticed that one of the top case studs was longer than the rest. Upon closer inspection, I realized that case saver is hanging out. It looks like the treads of the case-saver insert itself are gone. It seems like the stud is holding steady in the case, but the stud itself seems stripped at the end where the nut tightens down the head. Now what  SEE PICS BELOW
The car runs really great and has about 30,000 on the last re-build, so I am reluctanant for a full tear-down. The PO had a very crappy mechanic doing maintanace after the re-build and I believe this is can be directly attributed to that yahoo.
What are my options? Could I install a new case saver using the existing thread in the case without pulling the engine apart? Obviously I need a new stud to start. All the rest of the studs seem to hold the tight at full torque setting. I am thankfull in advance for any suggestions. Thanks! |
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Greezy Joe
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:23 am Post subject: |
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I don't think that is a case saver, it lools more like a head stud pulling from the case. this was typical of the older cases. there is a self tapping head bolt that can be screwed in without pulling the heads.
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dugsgms
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Joined: August 19, 2010
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Location: Cherry Valley, CA
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:33 am Post subject: |
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| So I assume that when you go to torque that stud it just keeps pulling the case saver out of the case? |
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 6:59 am Post subject: |
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Well you are already part way there, the engine is out, the tin is off. The next step is sadly obvious, pull the heads and cylinders and identify if it is a case save or not. If you got 10mm studs, which it looks like you do, it's time for a full set of case savers and installation of 8mm studs.
This is best done by cracking the case and doing it right though some do it without opening it. You do run the risk of chips falling inside the case and potentially causing problems.
Work carefully, wreck nothing and you can use all of the parts currently in the engine with no issues.
Or get a single stud that cuts it's own threads and install it. Problem is, if one goes they can be followed shortly by others and you may be repeating this task every few thousand miles.
Dave
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61SNRF
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:23 am Post subject: |
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Like dj said, if one is pulling others will likely follow. It's a little risky putting it all back together like that. The nut at the head is stripped because it has run out of threads.
Once upon a time I had seen some custom head studs that someone had made. It was a step stud that was 10mm but at the case side it was stepped up to 12mm. The shop i worked at had a 12mm tap that was extended to 12" so you could tap the case w/o taking the head or cylinders off. Once the case was tapped you threaded the stud all the way thru the head, cylinder and finally into the case. It was shortcut to say the least, but it worked temporarily.
Any other fix with the engine assembled would be temporary as well.
You know where Rimco is, right?
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Eric&Barb
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Joined: September 19, 2004
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Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 10:22 am Post subject: |
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Looks like you might have an oversize self tapping stud already in there.
If so you need to install a larger case saver.
If it was already case savered, you need a bigger OD case saver.
Biggest problem that causes pulled studs is overheating the engine which softens the case alloy metal. Keep it cooler and have less problems!
You should measure up the cooling fan width (between the discs) and count fins in it to make sure you have the correct size or bigger is better. Never smaller for your size/year of engine.
Also do take a good look at the transporter 1963-67 workshop manual on how to drill the 40 HP heads for much better cooling.
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64vdub
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Location: Sunny So. Cal
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Greezy Joe wrote: |
| I don't think that is a case saver, it lools more like a head stud pulling from the case. this was typical of the older cases. there is a self tapping head bolt that can be screwed in without pulling the heads. |
If I'm not mistaken I beleive it is a case saver as it appears it is a seperate sleeve, not just threads from the motor.
I have no problem taking head and cylinders off, as I just had the heads off, but I would rather not split the case since the car runs great with not too many miles since the last re-build, by PO.
As far as temp goes, I monitor it often. Never more than 180, even after a 30 minute drive at 65mph going up hills. I was sure to change my fan to the one with more fins, keep good belt tension and have full engine rubber ands tins in place. I think I can write high temp off....
All of the other studs keep full torque as seen in the pictures at 22.5 pounds, I just have a problem with the one 
I know exactly where rimco is and am now contemplating having them do all the work as they now build engines. |
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64vdub
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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Case saver correct??
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Eric&Barb
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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Case saver!
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djkeev
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Lettuce
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Since there is not much material there, you might have to find someone who can weld it closed and start over. |
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shano63 
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Eric&Barb wrote: |
Also do take a good look at the transporter 1963-67 workshop manual on how to drill the 40 HP heads for much better cooling. |
| glutamodo wrote: |
It's in the Bug manual too....
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gt1953
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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That happened to me many years ago..had to put a giant case save in it. Fixed the problem.
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64vdub
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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Just measured the stud and it is 8mm.
I am sure this is not a overheating issue. Like I said earlier I'm very aware of the temps my engione gets to, and I check it often cause I drive this car; I am not a sissy-foot. I believe that it was simply over-torqued at sometime in the past. The PO had a total yahoo doing the work on this car. I've been uncovering crap for three years.
Looks like I'm going to just have it torn-down and re-built. I drive my 64' as a daily and put 300 miles on it a week. I need to know everything is legit in the powertrain. I just saw on the RIMCO website that they now build engines. gas anyone had any complete engine building experiences with RIMCO? Thanks again.
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64' Pearl White beetle, type 113 sedan. Purchased in Hamburg Germany, driven for a year via vw tourist program, shipped to CA in 1965.
Founding member of Derkaferklub, Southern Cal. since 2008
Q: Would you consider a trade? What do you collect?
A: I collect money
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61SNRF
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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That style case saver is blind, that is it has a bottom and is not drilled through. What might have happened is the stud got bottomed out and locked into the end of it when the studs were first installed. Then when you took the heads off, the nut had more resistance to come off than the case saver, so it may have only threaded itself out a little and not truly "pulled" a case saver.
What you want to do is clean the hole in the case with some cleaner and blow it out with air and see if there are still good threads in there. Did you take any aluminum bits out of the case saver itself? Is there any sign that the threads have really "pulled"? If they had you would have a ring of aluminum in the threads of the case saver.
If all looks good then you might just be able to re-install the case saver with red Loctite following the instructions on the tube.
Loctite also has a new product that supposedly restores stripped threads. Never tried it, but here it is...
http://www.henkelna.com/cps/rde/xchg/henkel_us/hs....0000000I5Y
Might find it here...
http://www.amazon.com/Loctite-236382-Thread-Stripped-Thread/dp/B002KGEOFY/ref=pd_sbs_indust_1
BTW the case savers in your engine look like the 12mm style. I think there may be one more oversize for a small stock engine. The case savers I always used and installed were a little larger and had a coarse thread I think (excuse me it's been 25 yrs ago), and were drilled through so that when you installed the studs it actually expanded the case saver in the case somewhat when the stud reached the end, locking them in like a molly bolt or concrete anchor.
Best of luck and results.
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An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. |
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64vdub
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks SNRF, well it's really strange. It llooks like there only a few threads of aluminum stuck to the case-saver, BUT the weird part is the threads of the case saver itself look smashed Only the ones at the end (the ones closest to the outside of the block if that makes sense.) Now in my mind this is my reasoning....There are 12 threads on the case-saver, if I have only three that are messed up, with the loctite stuff it should still work right?? Does anybody know where I could get these style case savers? The case-saver measures 12mm, just like SNRF said. As always, thanks!
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64' Pearl White beetle, type 113 sedan. Purchased in Hamburg Germany, driven for a year via vw tourist program, shipped to CA in 1965.
Founding member of Derkaferklub, Southern Cal. since 2008
Q: Would you consider a trade? What do you collect?
A: I collect money
GO SF GIANTS! |
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64vdub
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Posts: 614
Location: Sunny So. Cal
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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SO, I just checked out the remaining threads in the case. They're just about non-exisistent. Now plan-B...not exactly what that is yet. I think I kmow the inevitable.
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64' Pearl White beetle, type 113 sedan. Purchased in Hamburg Germany, driven for a year via vw tourist program, shipped to CA in 1965.
Founding member of Derkaferklub, Southern Cal. since 2008
Q: Would you consider a trade? What do you collect?
A: I collect money
GO SF GIANTS! |
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djkeev
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Snort
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| Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 9:45 am Post subject: |
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| First you have a stripped plug thread. Next you have a stripped case thread. I see a pattern here. Perhaps it's time to look a bit deeper into this motor. |
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Joey
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| Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 11:30 am Post subject: |
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| Snort wrote: |
| First you have a stripped plug thread. Next you have a stripped case thread. I see a pattern here. Perhaps it's time to look a bit deeper into this motor. |
...or start using a torque wrench.
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