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Tcash Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011 Posts: 12844 Location: San Jose, California, USA
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Globespotter Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2012 Posts: 1765 Location: Newmarket, ON
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lil-jinx Samba Member
Joined: August 14, 2013 Posts: 1109 Location: New Brunswick,Canada
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Globespotter Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2012 Posts: 1765 Location: Newmarket, ON
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DrKamikazi Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2013 Posts: 316 Location: Across North America
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Posted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:10 pm Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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Alright stupid question time, could the alternator blow the power to the whole bus? I just got Layla back from the shop and she has been running great, but needed a new alternator. I bought one from the shop and decided to put it in myself. I get everything pulled out and switched over just fine and as I am hooking the battery back up the red wire sparks quite a bit and I thought I saw a small puff of smoke from that side of the engine (I was crammed in there with the battery connecting the cable and it was cold so not sure on that). When I went to go and start it to test the new alternator, nothing. I've checked my fuses, wires, grounds. I know everything is clean as it was running great an hour beforehand. I tried checking both batteries but my digital multimeter seems damaged and I have been waiting for it to die honestly, I have a volt setting on my dwell/tachometer so I tried that and it also read zero on the battery...could it have killed the battery? I am going to buy a new multimeter and have both batteries tested and charged first thing in the morning.
Is there anything else I should check? Could the sparking have destroyed something in the wiring harness? If something happened to the alternator during the ordeal could that shut down all the power in the bus? Thanks for any help guys!
EDIT: Also just read up that these rebuilt alternators have too long of studs, I did not check for this and could have been that possible puff of smoke, still raises the question could this cut the buses power totally? _________________ SOLD-Layla - 1978 Riviera, 2.0L, FI
1971 hightop, 1776 dp, dual Weber 34 ict |
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Tcash Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011 Posts: 12844 Location: San Jose, California, USA
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Posted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:31 pm Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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The red/white wire on Terminal 30 on B the starter supplies power to the ignition switch. Make sure it is not fried.
Note the red wire that goes from terminal 30 on B starter to B+ on C the Alt. is usually what fries.
click on pic
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/baybus_77-78_key.jpg
Good luck
Tcash |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50255
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Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 1:04 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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DrKamikazi wrote: |
Alright stupid question time, could the alternator blow the power to the whole bus? I just got Layla back from the shop and she has been running great, but needed a new alternator. I bought one from the shop and decided to put it in myself. I get everything pulled out and switched over just fine and as I am hooking the battery back up the red wire sparks quite a bit and I thought I saw a small puff of smoke from that side of the engine (I was crammed in there with the battery connecting the cable and it was cold so not sure on that). When I went to go and start it to test the new alternator, nothing. I've checked my fuses, wires, grounds. I know everything is clean as it was running great an hour beforehand. I tried checking both batteries but my digital multimeter seems damaged and I have been waiting for it to die honestly, I have a volt setting on my dwell/tachometer so I tried that and it also read zero on the battery...could it have killed the battery? I am going to buy a new multimeter and have both batteries tested and charged first thing in the morning.
Is there anything else I should check? Could the sparking have destroyed something in the wiring harness? If something happened to the alternator during the ordeal could that shut down all the power in the bus? Thanks for any help guys!
EDIT: Also just read up that these rebuilt alternators have too long of studs, I did not check for this and could have been that possible puff of smoke, still raises the question could this cut the buses power totally? |
It is possible you just left the #30 wire to the fuse box off the stud on the starter solenoid when you were putting things back together, pretty common error to make. Yes you need to address the overly long studs on the alternator. Hopefully you have not damaged your new alternator yet. |
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Tcash Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011 Posts: 12844 Location: San Jose, California, USA
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Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 5:25 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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Take a look at this
Alternator Type IV (4) |
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DrKamikazi Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2013 Posts: 316 Location: Across North America
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Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 8:32 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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Thanks guys! I am for sure going to pull the alternator out and fix the posts/check all the wires regardless of the batteries situation. Going to get the batteries tested and get a new mulitmeter now. Whats the best way to check for fried wires besides obvious visual indicators?
Also Wildthings I didn't take any of the connections for the starter off. All I did was pull the sheet metal around the alternator and swap the alternators out. Should I have been disconnecting the starter? I have changed/pulled the alternator in this thing a couple times before and never messed with the starter connections. _________________ SOLD-Layla - 1978 Riviera, 2.0L, FI
1971 hightop, 1776 dp, dual Weber 34 ict |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50255
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Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 11:24 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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DrKamikazi wrote: |
Thanks guys! I am for sure going to pull the alternator out and fix the posts/check all the wires regardless of the batteries situation. Going to get the batteries tested and get a new mulitmeter now. Whats the best way to check for fried wires besides obvious visual indicators?
Also Wildthings I didn't take any of the connections for the starter off. All I did was pull the sheet metal around the alternator and swap the alternators out. Should I have been disconnecting the starter? I have changed/pulled the alternator in this thing a couple times before and never messed with the starter connections. |
No you don't need to pull the wires from the starter, but that is how some people do it.
You may well have a corroded connection on your battery or elsewhere in the system |
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DrKamikazi Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2013 Posts: 316 Location: Across North America
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Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 11:37 pm Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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Ok so both batteries tested good! Got the alternator out and cut the studs down. The B+ wires were burned just right at the connection so I cut them off behind the cover and am in the process of wiring new ones in (tons of fun crimping 8 gauge in that little space). All the wires going to the plug and starter and voltage regulator look good to go, also the alternator looks ok. Anything else I can check or test? My only plan now is to plug the alternator in with the new wires and hope it works... _________________ SOLD-Layla - 1978 Riviera, 2.0L, FI
1971 hightop, 1776 dp, dual Weber 34 ict |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50255
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Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 11:54 pm Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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I melted down a wiring harness and burnt up a brand new alternator because of this problem 10ish years ago now, yet Bosch still hasn't corrected the problem. I wonder how many people have had their vehicles damaged over this in the intervening years. Sad that the management at Bosch just doesn't seem to care about their reputation any more. |
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Tcash Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011 Posts: 12844 Location: San Jose, California, USA
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 9:12 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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DrKamikazi wrote: |
Ok so both batteries tested good! Got the alternator out and cut the studs down. The B+ wires were burned just right at the connection so I cut them off behind the cover and am in the process of wiring new ones in (tons of fun crimping 8 gauge in that little space). All the wires going to the plug and starter and voltage regulator look good to go, also the alternator looks ok. Anything else I can check or test? My only plan now is to plug the alternator in with the new wires and hope it works... |
Exchange it where you bought it. I would say it is a manufacturing defect.
Or take the alternator to a parts store or Automotive electric shop and have it tested before you put it back in.
Good luck
Tcash |
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DrKamikazi Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2013 Posts: 316 Location: Across North America
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 12:13 pm Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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Got the alternator wired up and shes charging!! Thanks so much for all the help guys! Hopefully Layla is ready for many more miles of adventure!! _________________ SOLD-Layla - 1978 Riviera, 2.0L, FI
1971 hightop, 1776 dp, dual Weber 34 ict |
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Tcash Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011 Posts: 12844 Location: San Jose, California, USA
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:28 pm Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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DrKamikazi wrote: |
Got the alternator wired up and shes charging!! Thanks so much for all the help guys! Hopefully Layla is ready for many more miles of adventure!! |
That is great glad to hear it.
Here is info.
Alternator Type IV (4) |
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SixStringMadMan Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2011 Posts: 263 Location: Roseville, CA
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 7:34 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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Last weekend while bleeding the brakes, I noticed the pedal making some pretty awful squeaking noises. I have the day off, and after taking care of a few errands I'm planning on removing the splash guard and taking a look at the pedal assembly. Any tips or gotcha's I should watch out for before I get under there? _________________ 1978 Kombi
http://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate-10020.htm |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50255
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 8:47 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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SixStringMadMan wrote: |
Last weekend while bleeding the brakes, I noticed the pedal making some pretty awful squeaking noises. I have the day off, and after taking care of a few errands I'm planning on removing the splash guard and taking a look at the pedal assembly. Any tips or gotcha's I should watch out for before I get under there? |
The old dried out seal where the arm for the pedal passes through the floor can create a grating noise. |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 8:58 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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Wildthings wrote: |
SixStringMadMan wrote: |
Last weekend while bleeding the brakes, I noticed the pedal making some pretty awful squeaking noises. I have the day off, and after taking care of a few errands I'm planning on removing the splash guard and taking a look at the pedal assembly. Any tips or gotcha's I should watch out for before I get under there? |
The old dried out seal where the arm for the pedal passes through the floor can create a grating noise. |
Or worn pivot bushings, or a dry worn clevis pin, if you've never done it now's the time to dismantle/clean/lube all the mechanisms. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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SixStringMadMan Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2011 Posts: 263 Location: Roseville, CA
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 9:13 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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busdaddy wrote: |
Wildthings wrote: |
SixStringMadMan wrote: |
Last weekend while bleeding the brakes, I noticed the pedal making some pretty awful squeaking noises. I have the day off, and after taking care of a few errands I'm planning on removing the splash guard and taking a look at the pedal assembly. Any tips or gotcha's I should watch out for before I get under there? |
The old dried out seal where the arm for the pedal passes through the floor can create a grating noise. |
Or worn pivot bushings, or a dry worn clevis pin, if you've never done it now's the time to dismantle/clean/lube all the mechanisms. |
Never done it, and that's the plan. Is there a tutorial anywhere? Or is it pretty straight forward using the Bentley? _________________ 1978 Kombi
http://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate-10020.htm |
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airschooled Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012 Posts: 12686 Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 9:54 am Post subject: Re: The Stupid Question Thread |
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SixStringMadMan wrote: |
busdaddy wrote: |
Wildthings wrote: |
SixStringMadMan wrote: |
Last weekend while bleeding the brakes, I noticed the pedal making some pretty awful squeaking noises. I have the day off, and after taking care of a few errands I'm planning on removing the splash guard and taking a look at the pedal assembly. Any tips or gotcha's I should watch out for before I get under there? |
The old dried out seal where the arm for the pedal passes through the floor can create a grating noise. |
Or worn pivot bushings, or a dry worn clevis pin, if you've never done it now's the time to dismantle/clean/lube all the mechanisms. |
Never done it, and that's the plan. Is there a tutorial anywhere? Or is it pretty straight forward using the Bentley? |
The Bentley has an exploded parts diagram but nothing else useful. Be aware of the rubber o-rings that seal the pedal shaft; don't ruin them, but clean them and everything else before reinstalling. When you're taking it apart, note the order of assembly, because once the pedal spring sproings, you're going to have parts everywhere. If your shit is dirty, wear safely glasses because it can fling crap in your face. Good luck getting the spring assembly back in; I found a quiet and uninterrupted work atmosphere to be better than a helper. You'll need a few good size screwdrivers or brake spoons to find one that lets you preload the spring enough. Have some medium to fine sandpaper hand too, so you can lightly cross-hatch the pivot pin after cleaning it, then clean it again. There are one or two nylon spacer/running blocks in the assembly. I flipped mine so I'll get fresh wear surfaces for the next 47 years.
Robbie _________________ Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
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