Basic Cylinder to case sealer question

modok · Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 10:09 pm Post subject:

have yall LOOKED at where the jugs go in the case?

how is the sealer going to escape out of there and get in the oil?
It's wedged in the gap between the cylinder skirt and the case.
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RockCrusher · Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 10:19 pm Post subject:

Lettuce · Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 1:51 am Post subject:

djkeev · Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:27 am Post subject:

Too funny RocKCrusher! You really only need to send that letter out to the current manufacturers of air cooled VW engines though. RTV has it's uses in many Other manufacturers applications.
Your engines, do as you wish, I'll dig out the silicone bits and fix them for you years down the road.

Anyone find that VW service bulletin yet?

Dave
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RockCrusher · Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:56 am Post subject:

Although I absolutely DO use RTV for the cylinder seals you will never need to pick out any bits from my work. As mentioned by someone else here.....proper use is the key. If someone just blobs the stuff on it is surely going to be a mess and potential disaster. One things for sure, we can agree to disagree. There is more than one way to do most things successfully and well. Glad you didn't take my reply the wrong way. Smile

RC
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ALB · Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:56 am Post subject:

Almost Alive · Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:07 am Post subject:

mark tucker · Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2011 2:42 pm Post subject:

hmm 3 bond, is that like yamaha bond2 or 3????

Almost Alive · Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2011 2:56 pm Post subject:

http://www.threebond.co.jp/en/product/series/sealants/1200list.html

1200 Series (Silicone-based liquid gasket and potting agents)
This silicone-based liquid gasket fills gaps on a flange surface and thus completely prevent leaks. When cured, it forms an excellent rubber-like elastic body offering excellent resistance to vibration and shock. Also it has an excellent resistance to heat, and effectively seals joints that are subjected to high temperature. Select the product that best meets the needs for a particular location or set of working conditions.

Features and uses
1211
Low viscosity, fluidic, and excellent workability.
Can be used with solid gaskets and it can be used for temporary fixing of O rings.
Corrodes copper and copper-based alloys. Can not be used for copper and copper-based alloys in tightly-sealed state.

You can see the break down for the 1211 a little lower on the page. Commonly about $20-$25 per tube.
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Mooosman · Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2011 4:01 pm Post subject:

flemcadiddlehopper · Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:46 pm Post subject:

"I tend to go with the theory that silicone ANYWHERE on an air cooled VW engine without an aftermarket full flow oil filter is a major major no no"

I tend to disagree with that statement too. One of the biggest down falls of america's best selling pickup engine is the filter itself. The lint off of the cheaper paper oil filters clogs up the screens for the variable valve control valves and an engine rebuild is the only real fix. Oh, they use RTV on their engines too.

RTV is fine for certain parts of an engine. I wouldn't use it to seal the case halves. The key, as mentioned earlier, is to us it correctly. Remember, if you see it squeezing out, that's how much is squeezing in.

I like ultra grey for use on aluminum, especially near coolant. Ultra Black for all other uses.

Gordo.

modok · Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:13 pm Post subject:

permatex "ultra grey" is reinforced, stronger, for filling larger gaps.
Like if you wanted to use it on the cylinders to form an "o-ring" between the cylinder skirt and case.
I do not think the grey would be needed anywhere else, there are very few larger gaps

Silicone is effective if you use the right kind for the application
But don't take my word for it, I sealed one of my engine cases together with ketchup, it's leaking a bit now, seems to be from under the cylinders, I used black silicone on the cylinders, maybe I shouda used ketchup there too?
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KopfenJager · Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:51 pm Post subject:

We have used aviation form a gasket (permatex) for years. Our old VW machinist, who retired would machine our cylinder spigots just right so the cylinders would slide in with a slite tap of the hand. Our new bozo opens em up to where you can almost rock the cylinders back and fourth Shocked

. He says thats not where the cylinders seal, they seal on the lip of the barrels and the sides of the case. Any hoo we have switched to Ultra black silicone for our barrels because the permatex wasn't sealing em. If new this I would have sent my case elswhere Evil or Very Mad

. Still permatex and silicone is what works for us.
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flemcadiddlehopper · Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2012 6:11 pm Post subject:

Modok wins ...Ultra grey for cylinders.

Like this. not too much.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

notice with spacer in place Ultra grey squeezes out, not into engine.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Another line of Ultra Grey on the spacer again and drop it into the case ready to be torqued down.

Gordo.

bugninva · Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2012 8:04 pm Post subject:

When its squeezing out that much, you've used too much.
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bartman · Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:32 pm Post subject:

Yeah, but the squeezeout is harmless. I think his point is that there is no silicone squeezing in.

I do it the same way and when I pull the jugs there is a very thin layer that extends about a quarter inch or so down the skirt due to the bit of clearance between the parts. It's never been enough for me to say, "whoa, this is a problem!"
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neil68 · Samba Member Joined: March 17, 2007 Posts: 2228

For years, I've used Permatex orange or blue silicone RTV for the cylinder base. Just enough to squeeze out of the shims...seals perfectly Smile

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udidwht · Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:18 am Post subject:

Kuril - K2 or Hylomar HP

bugninva · Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 5:59 am Post subject:

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Basic Cylinder to case sealer question
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