| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 10631
Location: Kimball, Mi
|
 Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 5:13 pm Post subject: Re: Timing? |
 |
|
| supersuk wrote: | Ok, I feel like a real dufus...I've searched around the forums looking for a how-to or something along those lines to set timing. This is my first type 3, but I have had many type 1's in the past and those are easy to set timing. How do you do it for these pancake motors? I see a hole in the fan shroud and can see the pulley, but I haven't seen any type of markings to indicate what degree i'm at. I connected it to the number 1 cylinder and can't see anything! I really hope this is the cause of my "no power"... Also, i'm assuming you have to line up the timing mark with the little arm protruding from the block?
Boy...I feel really dumb. |
There should be 4 marks on the big pulley. The 1st is TDC or ")" degrees, the next ro the right is 7.5*, then 10*, then finally 12*. The problem is you have an 009, and for that, you set it at 28* at 3000rpms, and there's no mark for 28*. You can make your own, it'll be 50mm (about 2 inches)to the right of TDC. This mark can be used for a non-adjustable timing light. IF you have an adjustable timing light, then you just need the TDC line whited out so you can see it. I hope this helps.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here; http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=240540 -tear down
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120 |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 3:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
So I hope someone can help me...Does this look correct? This is as-is how I bought it.
First picture shows the spark plug wire orientation on the distributor cap.
Second picture shows the 7.5* mark on the pulley and the notch in the distributor in relation to the rotor, which is about 20* off.
From what I read, the notch in the 009 distributor should be in the 7 position at TDC for cyl 1. BTW, I found an EMPI electronic ignitor in there.
_________________
68 Fastback Build: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5396323#5396323
Type 3 MegaSquirt Trigger Wheel: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5502150#5502150 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mike Fisher
Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006
Posts: 12434
Location: Eugene, OR
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 3:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I don't like that fuel hose/filter rubbing on the hex bar linkage. Run it underneath the hex bar. Russ Wolfe R.I.P. told us to Always put the fuel filter down next to the transmission to help prevent engine fires!
_________________
http://s169.photobucket.com/albums/u236/mr_bojangles500/
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,71,71,71 AT,72,72 AT Parts
56 & 57 oval ragtop $2,500 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mike Fisher
Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006
Posts: 12434
Location: Eugene, OR
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 5:23 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I don't even worry about the notch in the distributor if it starts/runs good as is!
_________________
http://s169.photobucket.com/albums/u236/mr_bojangles500/
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,71,71,71 AT,72,72 AT Parts
56 & 57 oval ragtop $2,500 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tram 
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 16870
Location: The human race, AKA 'God's Edsel'
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 6:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Mike Fisher wrote: | | I don't even worry about the notch in the distributor if it starts/runs good as is! |
Yer killin' me here... 
_________________
Give A Pal a Hand!
www.happytrailsfarm.org
May 4, 1970... Never Forget.
RIPRW
"Hell is- other people."- Jean- Paul Sartre |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mike Fisher
Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006
Posts: 12434
Location: Eugene, OR
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 10631
Location: Kimball, Mi
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
| Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 1:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Ok, got a cheap Equus tach from Orielly's last night. This is my plan for today. I'll change the oil and adjust the valves. While doing that i'll verify that cyl one is at TDC and set the 009 distributer at the recommended 7.5* before TDC. After I find that I will arrange the spark plug wires to their appropriate positions. Then using the tach, timing light, and the newly made mark in the pulley I'll set the 28* timing. Hopefully this will cure the "no power".
Thanks for the awesome tips. I'll post back later today or tomorrow.
_________________
68 Fastback Build: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5396323#5396323
Type 3 MegaSquirt Trigger Wheel: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5502150#5502150 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 3:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
Alright, got the oil changed, valves adjusted and found out that the distributor is about 180* off. The TDC for cylinder 1 is in the position where cylinder 3 would normally be. Is this because the distributor gear is installed about 180* off? I guess it wouldn't matter since I have a 009 distributor...
However, the funny thing is that the spark plug wire for cylinder 4 is where the TDC for cylinder 1 is. This is the only way it will start up. Am I missing something here? Maybe the empi electronic point system was installed incorrectly? I'm a little baffled here...Any help?
_________________
68 Fastback Build: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5396323#5396323
Type 3 MegaSquirt Trigger Wheel: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5502150#5502150 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 5:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Ok, I really am a dufus. Found out the distributor drive gear in type 3's are set almost 180* off from the type 1 motors, which I based everything on. This explains why the 009 is in the wrong position. I also found out that the empi electronic point system magnetic plate thingie was very loose and had a lot of play. Changed it to points and condensor, set the timing and she runs great!
One shitty thing though, I was changing the spark plugs and the one on cylinder two fell into the cylinder tin. While trying to retrieve it, somehow it lodged itself into the air inlet area from the fan shroud and I can't remove it. Is it easy to remove the cylinder tin with the engine still mounted to the car?
_________________
68 Fastback Build: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5396323#5396323
Type 3 MegaSquirt Trigger Wheel: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5502150#5502150 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 10631
Location: Kimball, Mi
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| supersuk wrote: |
One shitty thing though, I was changing the spark plugs and the one on cylinder two fell into the cylinder tin. While trying to retrieve it, somehow it lodged itself into the air inlet area from the fan shroud and I can't remove it. Is it easy to remove the cylinder tin with the engine still mounted to the car? |
You'll have to pull the carb and intake manifold on that side (put some towels or something in the ports on the head before doing anything else after removing them). Then it's just a matter of removing the 7 screws that hold the tin in place.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here; http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=240540 -tear down
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 3972
Location: houston
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I'm using a Megasquirt 2 for the ECU. It just arrived and I'll start putting that together soon. The innovate wideband came in not to long ago too.
This system probably won't be going into the car until the car goes to the body shop. I want to enjoy it for a while before I do all that. Once I have the body at the body shop, I'll have the pan at home. At that time i'll have the pan powder coated, clean up the tranny and then work on the FI system for the motor. I'm going to start with fuel first since I have to figure out a way to install a 36-1 wheel on the fan pulley or somewhere else. I'll come up with something...
I'm thinking the dual 45mm throttle bodies should be ok since I did have 44mm webers on a 1776 engine in my bug before. That thing ran awesome. Hopefully it'll work out.
I was following your build and it looks awesome! Wish I could have things fabricated like yours, but I lack the skills nor have the proper tools. For now i'll just have to use ready made components and match them to fit.
_________________
68 Fastback Build: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5396323#5396323
Type 3 MegaSquirt Trigger Wheel: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5502150#5502150 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 3972
Location: houston
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 9:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
44 IDF's have 32 to 36mm, or there abouts, venturi's and all that crap in the middle. My 38's probably flow as much air as a set of IDA's, I know they sound like them when I'm on it. 
Eric Anderson did an awesome job on making the mani's for my setup, all I did was to come up with the ideas (actually it was Soul who planted the sead about using the end castings for mani's).
If you get stuck on the FI, holla and I'll help.
Ninja edit number 2, hehe, I got a complete section for the rear hanger on my parts notch if you still need it.
_________________
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/chucky1974/ninja.gif
Nick
Megasquirted Type 4 powered Notch http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=427890&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Blog of Doom http://supaninjanick.wordpress.com/
Last edited by supaninja on Thu Jun 30, 2011 7:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supersuk
Samba Member
Joined: December 20, 2010
Posts: 465
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
supaninja
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2010
Posts: 3972
Location: houston
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
