1977 CE1 Rebuild thread (barn find)

skills@eurocarsplus · Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 6:57 pm Post subject:

good deal (slacker! Razz

)

I noticed something I want you to address. p/m sent. good work and you are gaining headway for sure!
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Stuartzickefoose · Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 9:40 am Post subject:

still watching ya. keep up the work man, you got this! Very Happy

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Stuart Zickefoose

2011 Jetta Sportwagen TDi 6 speed manual

206-841-7324
[email protected]

webwalker · Posted: Sat Nov 01, 2014 10:11 am Post subject:

The most recent progress. Humping it to get the engine mated before it freezes here.

http://volksaru-incubator.blogspot.com/2014/11/what-are-your-intentions.html

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
"Consistent maintenance with quality products is the cheapest warranty you'll ever need."
1977 CE1 Transporter Deluxe, Subaru EJ22, Skills Cooling, Steedle HD 091 w/ GuardT .82 4th
Click to view image

webwalker · Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 9:36 pm Post subject:

Well, I haven't moved things forward much what with being at a dead run at work. I however finally get delivery on my new radiator.

All aluminum construction by Champion cooling in Lake Elsinore, CA and designed for a 1965 Chevrolet Bel Air, it is meant to cool about 400HP.

Here's the whole story of the next phase:

http://volksaru-incubator.blogspot.com/2014/11/ready-ready-ready-aim-aimaimfire.html
_________________
"Consistent maintenance with quality products is the cheapest warranty you'll ever need."
1977 CE1 Transporter Deluxe, Subaru EJ22, Skills Cooling, Steedle HD 091 w/ GuardT .82 4th
Click to view image

skills@eurocarsplus · Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:16 am Post subject:

I would send that radiator back. seems that there is a bunch of fingers and some hair stuck to it
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mack00 · Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 4:38 pm Post subject:

Following closely. I'll be onto this step soon. Please keep up with the details.
Skills have finalized your belly radiator yet?

skills@eurocarsplus · Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 5:34 pm Post subject:

no yet. the radiator is fine, just need to weld some elbows to it and clean up some plumbing.

seeing it's about 27* as I write this, I am in no huge rush. besides, I need to swap my transmission anyway, so I will get to it soon...I think Laughing

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webwalker · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 11:02 am Post subject:

So having gotten Thanksgiving out of the way, and having a spare hour and no heat in the garage, I spent some time with the radiator and while making some progress, had some lessons learned that I wanted to share.

Fins on radiators are incredibly fragile! When you're going to be handling them a lot, don't just promise yourself that you'll be careful. You'll make slips and maybe bash them up. Instead, cover them. I covered mine with sheets of styrofoam that came as part of the packing, and then taped over them to keep them all secure. This won't protect it if you drop it on your head, but for general handling, it will keep a lot of damage off of it.

I took the new EC281 (which is what I'll be referring to the radiator as, since that's the model number) out to the Bus, slid under and had that worry-some moment when you second guess whether you've gotten all of the measurements right. Then I lifted the EC281 into place.

The sucker fits like a glove. 1/2" clearance at each side to the inside of the frame rails, and the fins are held completely above the level of the frame rails. The welded on brackets spread out beyond the bottom edge of the frame rail and will provide a great mounting surface.

Of course, I'm holding it up into place with my arms, and even a very lightweight radiator will cause your arms to fatigue if held to long in a stress position. So I grabbed a set of wood clamps to act as primitive hangers so that I could get a good idea of how far forward/backward I could slide the EC281 and make best use of the brackets.

So that's where I'm at now. Next up, replacing the throw-out bearing and transmission shaft seal before mating the engine/adapter to the transmission and adding the support bar.

Somewhere, I'm going to need a heater! It's cold out there!

M
_________________
"Consistent maintenance with quality products is the cheapest warranty you'll ever need."
1977 CE1 Transporter Deluxe, Subaru EJ22, Skills Cooling, Steedle HD 091 w/ GuardT .82 4th
Click to view image

skills@eurocarsplus · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 11:56 am Post subject:

if that is how you are going to mount it, how much room do you suppose is on top of the radiator?

now you got me re-re-re thinking my plan of attack

remember, the shift rod tube is going to be the spot to measure off of, so from the bottom of the tube to the face of the radiator is the area I am wondering about
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Tcash · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 12:13 pm Post subject:

Some thick or doubled up pieces of cardboard over the Styrofoam would help in case of a drop.
Looking good.

webwalker · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 1:25 pm Post subject:

Sloride · Samba Member Joined: February 09, 2002 Posts: 926

I like the rad. I'm thinking of doing something different with my set up. Let's us know how this works out.

Thanks

Craig
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1972 Westfalia - 1.8 VW in-line h2o conversion
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada

Link to the engine swap:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=565304&highlight=

1964 Ruby Red Beetle

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=705757&highlight=ruby+red

skills@eurocarsplus · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2014 3:31 pm Post subject:

interesting....

I have a cooling fan I just got that could blow the virginity out of a nun. it is a pusher, which I know is not as efficient as a puller, but I am looking for clearance under the radiator. it fit's with room to spare, and is rated to cool way more than I can throw at it.

for ha ha's, I put power to it, and it LIFTED off the bench. the torque is comedy, so it will need a pretty secure mount.

I am thinking of tucking my radiator up a bit higher and tilting the nose down a hair to aid in scooping air. I would love to not run a scoop, but I am ok with it if I have to.

also got my programmable fan controller too. now THAT thing is killer!
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webwalker · Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:26 pm Post subject:

I burned my last vacation day today and finished the engine install in the Bus. (I get a # of vacation days per year. You'd think it would be easy to take all of them. What with making sure there's enough coverage and not taking breaks when major projects are due; it often means you come to the end of the year with more days still in your allotment than you're allowed to carry over. So you use them...or lose them. I'll be damned if I'm going to penalized for doing a good job, so I'm taking them.)

I had a long delay getting an outstanding NOS SACHS Throw Out bearing; silly not to replace it when it is so cheap, yet so difficult to replace. Press pause on project, wait ungodly amount of time for the TO bearing to come in, spend 4 minutes installing it, then today I got on the engine mate-up. Took me about 5 hours, because I'm stupid and slow and don't know how to use my tools, but its in:

I should add that I replaced the M10-1.50 nuts (for those of you who geek out on that kind of casual details) with pieces that have a wide flange on one side, spreading the load slightly across the face of the transmission body. They take a 15mm wrench instead of the 17mm wide nut on the starter D-bolt, but they cuddle in really nicely.

Tonight or tomorrow (or whenever it breaks freezing here) I'm going to try to get my Rocky Mountain Westy carrier bar bolted up so the engine will ne self supporting. Then lifts and cherry pickers and all of the other space-eaters in my garage can go elsewhere for the winter.

M
_________________
"Consistent maintenance with quality products is the cheapest warranty you'll ever need."
1977 CE1 Transporter Deluxe, Subaru EJ22, Skills Cooling, Steedle HD 091 w/ GuardT .82 4th
Click to view image

webwalker · Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:14 pm Post subject:

Well, I didn't quite get all of the bits aligned on the Rocky Mountain Westy carrier bar, so I'm not quite ready for pics yet for that (they're coming, really.) The build quality is beautiful and it just bolts together and is production ready, CNC & jig construction. Hell, it even comes with hardware. I can't wait to show that all together.

Some of you have asked about the change to the Champion Cooling EC281 Radiator. The saga of fitting it is here:

http://volksaru-incubator.blogspot.com/2014/12/the-cool-fool.html

If you've forgotten its shape, here's a reminder:

Most people just want diagrams for how it goes in place. I took a B&W photo of a Type2A and superimposed a scale drawing of the radiator in position along with an overlay of the Subaru engine in place. For more info on this, see posts in this thread after Feb 17,2015

The inlet (front) and outlet (rear) are shown, though not yet fabbed. You can see the relationship between the radiator frame flanges and the bottom edge of the major longitudinal frame rails.

Note that the radiator flanges have six stock drillings. I've gotten some engineering consulting and here's how the holes will be used: counting six holes left to right across the top of the image:

1) Nylon shear bolt attaching the scoop (not shown) to the radiator flange.
2) Steel bolt attaching the radiator to the frame rail.
3) Steel bolt attaching the radiator to the frame rail.
4) Steel bolt attaching the radiator to the frame rail.
5) Nylon shear bolt attaching the scoop (not shown) to the radiator flange.
6) Nylon shear bolt attaching the scoop (not shown) to the radiator flange.

I'm spreading the load across the bolt holes as intelligently as I can. The three upward traveling steel bolts through bottom of the frame rail suspend the radiator.

The scoop will be suspended below the radiator flanges via nylon shear bolts, which will let the scoop get sheared off in one piece if it meets an obstacle, rather than tear itself and radiator to shreds because the two are too well connected. The double shear bolts (#5 & #6) will support a reinforcing strap for the leading edge so that it doesn't want to bow down at the middle, by far the most vulnerable part of the installation.

So that's work in progress. I'll ho-ho-ho myself on Thursday, set the kiddies in front of their new toys, and then go out and wrench on the bus.

M
_________________
"Consistent maintenance with quality products is the cheapest warranty you'll ever need."
1977 CE1 Transporter Deluxe, Subaru EJ22, Skills Cooling, Steedle HD 091 w/ GuardT .82 4th
Click to view image

webwalker · Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2014 2:33 pm Post subject:

Vorwärts!

I had a productive weekend with the bus and discovered all sorts of fascinating idiocies. Most of the idiocies being my own fault. I'll get to the color commentary in a minute, but the essence is that the engine is fully installed, all bits and pieces aligned and the Rocky Mountain Westy carrier bar fully installed as well. The engine is now entirely self supporting and all of the lifts, jacks, cherry-pickers, etc. have returned to their regular storage spaces, e.g. not in the garage where space is limited and they are badly underfoot.

The fully installed transmission, adapter, engine and engine carrier assembly.

You can see how the whole affair bolts together, and I've included this second picture of how the main carrier bar not only bolts to the body of the bus, but also how it connects to trailing outriggers which extend to the rear of the engine compartment to bolt through the frame hole intended for the original carrier bar:

As per usual, I worked diligently to do everything the hard way. Razz

I previously mentioned replacing the the throw-out bearing before mating the engine and adapter to the transmission. I replaced the TO bearing with whistle-while-you-work unconcern, then spent an atrocious amount of time getting the engine mated up to the trans. Don't let anyone kid you: an EJ engine does not appreciate being supported from the bottom, and even if you have a cherry-picker style engine hoist, the center of mass of the EJ engine makes hanging it a challenge.

You'll just have to do what I did: Try, try again-- and don't ever give up.

Having got it all the way together, I bolted up the carrier bar and hung the engine from it. Some jiggling and the use of some 3mm aluminum shims from Rocky Mountain Westy to correct engines that were not aligning with the body and I looked all set.

Read over my Bentley manual that night which I had left open to the section on replacing the TO bearing just before I did the work. I reviewed it again....and discovered I'd really humped myself.

There is a sleeve that the TO bearing rides on: inside the sleeve is the transmission input shaft. This sleeve is bolted onto the transmission. There should be a light coating of new lubricant on the outside surface of the sleeve for the Inside Diameter of the TO bearing to ride on.

That sleeve was dry as a bone. Clean! But dry.

There's nothing that improves your speed of performing a procedure than practice. To my credit, it only took me 4 hours to take the whole thing apart completely (engine, carrier, transmission adapter) lightly lube the outside of that throw-out bearing sleeve and put the whole mess back together again. Along the way, I discovered that the transmission hanger bolts (at the top of the bell-housing) were to installed incorrectly, so I fixed that, too.

So the engine is in, complete.

Next up will be installation of the throttle valve reverser as shown here from earlier in the summer:

Once the TVR is in, that will put the throttle valve assembly within reach so I'll be grafting the stock throttle cable end together with the cable end that came out of the donor 97 Impreza. I've seen an installation trick I've wanted to try...

Until next time...
_________________
"Consistent maintenance with quality products is the cheapest warranty you'll ever need."
1977 CE1 Transporter Deluxe, Subaru EJ22, Skills Cooling, Steedle HD 091 w/ GuardT .82 4th
Click to view image

skills@eurocarsplus · Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2014 4:41 pm Post subject:

me and you, Rt 4 outside the fairgrounds. line 'em up. i'll find some lovely lady to drop the flag

congrats buddy! feels good to make some headway. while everyone is gathered 'round swapping aircooled story's about blowing oil cooler seals, have a generator grenade or dropping a valve we can clink beers and tell stories about how boring our ride was Laughing

well, i'm not out of the woods yet. I will still need to finish my fan set up
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webwalker · Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2014 9:48 pm Post subject:

webwalker · Posted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 10:14 pm Post subject:

I took the saw-z-all to the heater wye at the end of January. I did so because I'm now fully committed to the design that will keep the radiator high, as well as keeping the coolant tubing (1.5"OD 304 SS, 16 gauge ) wholly above the level of the frame. You'd have to lose everything from the tie-rods up to the drag link before you'd hit something with the radiator scoop and never with the radiator plumbing.

From the rear main cross member forward, the design is mine: EC281 radiator with inlet/outlets relocated on the tanks. From where it passes through the 4-1/4" x 3-3/4" heater wye hole, two mandrel bent pieces of 4-1/2" Radius tubing jog the hot coolant to the left where it makes a run forward inside of left hand frame rail, hemmed in by the side of the radiator body. When tubing exits this tunnel, the 3" Radius tubing causes it to do a 180* and connect at the front of the radiator to the new intake fitting.

The return to the heater wye hole is out the right rear of the radiator at the opposite side and through another jog: another two mandrel bent pieces of 4-1/2" Radius tubing back to the centerline and the wye hole where it first entered.

Cooling intake is from the bottom via a scoop (not shown) which extends 2-1/2" below the level of the frame. This is still *above* the level of the lower front torsion bar. This leaves the scoop vulnerable only to debris travelling in a vertical arc after it has passed the front torsion bars.

The Radiator exhaust is out the top of the radiator and then to the rear and sides which have a 4" clearance above the radiator core. For overtemp situations there are two SPAL fans: 12" 909 CFM S-blade pullers that scrunch into the space. At only 2" tall themselves, a lot of measuring and planning went into fan selection. Thermostatic control for the fans is via Subaru ECU control.

Where it gets interesting is behind the heater wye.

Rocky Mountain Westy and their fab shop have worked all of the kinks out of a mandrel bent solution to get the pipework down to the heater wye without swinging dangerously low like the Fellows Speedshop design. Instead, the coolant tubing is routed down inside the engine compartment, over the torsion tube and end just behind the heater wye hole. The value add is that there is an upper section of coolant tubing (clamped to the engine via brackets at various points) and after a transition to the lower tubing via coupling hose, the lower sections are bolted via brackets to the torsion housing. While you could use a couple of lengths of "Gates green stripe" hose, and maybe a tubing coupler, it is going to sag and will never be well supported. RMW has already done the engineering and CNC programming for their mandrel bender, and they've done the bracket fabrication and testing. This is in the 'buy it' category, rather than 'build it.'

The mandrel bent 304 SS is being provided by Columbia River Mandrel Bending of St. Helens, Oregon for one simple reason: To know that the parts would fit, I needed the specifications on how they were built: Radius, leg length from tangent, gauge, what type of Stainless Steel...etc. Just a spec sheet. They were the only vendor I could find who provided specifications on what they sold. Everyone else wanted me to guess and then buy what looked right from pictures, which is one of the differences between ghetto rigging and engineering.

Once all of those mandrel bent components show up, I'll start mocking up pieces together. I have a local fabricator I'm working with who will be doing the TIG welding for me. The important point is that when we're done, I'm going to publish the dimensions and details of the finished product. So anyone who wants to earn some extra bread making these can, anyone who can TIG themselves can scratch their own itch, and if you can't do either (like me) then at least you can buy the off-the-shelf parts, take them to a fabricator, unroll the plans and say: "take these, and make that."

Is there a cheaper way to do much of this? Sure. My intention isn't to produce the cheapest solution from what's lying around, it is to produce the most cost effective solution that will be the last component to fail in Death Valley...instead of the first.

Here's my rap on the value proposition of using high quality materials ONCE in a well thought out design: Ten Dollar Helmet

VolksarU is alive and well, and on revision 3 of the design. I've been hindered by cash flow and 70 hour work weeks, plus a 10°F garage. I'm still in the game, and I'm still moving forward with 'do it smart the first time, not the sixth time.' I'm spending my dough to do it right with COTS parts, so that when I'm done, you don't have to start your engineering at square 1.
_________________
"Consistent maintenance with quality products is the cheapest warranty you'll ever need."
1977 CE1 Transporter Deluxe, Subaru EJ22, Skills Cooling, Steedle HD 091 w/ GuardT .82 4th
Click to view image

TomWesty · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 9:25 am Post subject:

Well said. I like the ten dollar helmet blog. Wish everyone thought that way....
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If you haven't bled on them, you haven't worked on them.
Visit: www.tomcoryell.com and check out my music!


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