73 SB stuck in 4th gear

[docwagner]

Greetings: First time posting on this forum. Need some input. Recently bought 73 SB in solid shape, rebuit motor, good body. I test drove it and it shifted well. Brakes were a bit soft so I sent it over to my mechanic to straighten a couple of things out. I'm hoping this car will be a daily driver. Brakes got fixed, we drove it home. I took it around the block to check out the brakes and it shifted fine. I then started giving my daughter a lesson in driving a stick shift and we moved the shifter through the gears engine off, clutch in. Then it wouldn't shift. I think it is in 4th gear and I can't get it out. I pulled out the shifter and reinstalled it to see if anything was jammed up, I checked the rear coupling and there are no obvious problems although there is some play in the connection. Not sure how much is acceptable. I don't want to force anything, but I would like to get this car moving again. I am ready to order a replacement coupling which I guess is a wear item anyway, but it will take a week to show up.

Any ideas would be appreciated. I am also looking for a source for parts on the East Coast. I have been using Jbugs.com and they have done well for me, but it takes a week to get anything. I have a 74 SB I am working on and with two VW's I will need a source for parts closer to home.
Thanks,

[Greezy Joe]

This has happened 1000"s of times on these cars. Some folks have had luck by moving the gears around through the filler plug hole. I could never do it that way, and would have to pull the trany, remove the nose and align the shift forks and re assemble. However be advised, There is wear in the tranny and it could happen again. The ultimate cure is a rebuilt tranny.
_________________
Current:74 Ghia Coupe w/ 2276
71 Ghia Vert w/ 1835
07 GMC Truck
12 Jeep Wrangler
73 Harley FLH 93 cid
89 Harley 883 Sportster (1200)


Owned before: 58, 69 Ghia Coupes, 64 Canvas Sunroof, 68, 72, 73, & 74 Bugs, 63 Single Cab, 65 Bus, 66 & 70 Camper
" Duct tape can't fix stupid, but it'll muffle the sound".

[docwagner]

Yikes! That sounds expensive!

[docwagner]

Is there a simple way to get this car out of 4th gear??

[docwagner]

Let me put it another way. Is there anything I might try that could make the situation worse??

[docwagner]

I have done some reading and I am hoping my problem is a Hockey stick issue and maybe some warn out parts in the linkage rather than a FUBAR transmission. I'm going to find the best VW mechanic I can in town and if I can't get the car out of 4th gear I will tow it there. I will ask him to rebuilt the shifter mechanism and replace the hockey stick device. If that doesn't work I will buy a rebuilt transmission. Although with three kids in college it might have to wait. So my next question to the group. What parts do I need to order to supply to my mechanic to get this job done (project 1)? Second question, when I am ready to replace the transmission where should I get one? I want a reputable rebuilder. I have seen some posts steering me away from one such operation. I would rather pay a few extra dollars and have the job done right.

Thanks,

[Tim Donahoe]

You need a new shift-rod bushing and a new shift-rod coupler. Both are cheap--like $15.00 total.

As far as the transmission is concerned, why not take it to a local transmission shop for fixing. Maybe you only have a problem just inside the nosecone. Maybe a slider, or two.

Tim

[docwagner]

Thanks for the reply. I probably will need to find a transmission guy. My mechanic isn't so well versed in VW's, more of a BMW/Mercedes kind of guy. I will need to ask around. Unfortunately I am pressed for time and dollars. I was hoping to be driving this car by now. Clearly I am far away from that.
So those are the only parts you think I need? How about this hockey stick part I keep hearing about? Should I find one of those as well?

[Rex lucy]

Just maybe the new shift rod bushing will fix the problem. a bugger to get in but i would do that before spending money on rebuild. also you might work problem out from under rear seat in the tunnel.

[Multi69s]

When this problem occurred, you said that you were doing dead engine shifting. This is not very healthy for the transmission. In most cases, the operating sleeves, syncros, gears and shift forks are not aligned 100% (even with the clutch in), so that if too much force is applied to the shifter, bad things can happen.

You have one of two things happening.
1) Its is stuck in 4th gear like you said.
2) You managed to shift it into two gears at once.

How can you tell the difference? By pushing the car.

Grab a couple of people to push the car (you are in the driver seat), put in the clutch and have THEM push the car SLOWLY a very short distance. Slowly let out the clutch and one of two things will happen. If it is just stuck in one gear, the motor will turn over. If the rear wheels lock up, it is stuck in two gears. You could use the motor to test this, but if it is stuck in two gears, you need to let out the clutch very slow, or risk damaging the transmission.

I am just guessing, but I think that you got it in two gears at once. It is extremely rare to have a transmission shift into gear, then not be able to get it out (I guess it could happen though).

If you have found that it is stuck in two gears, that means that you have too much play between the hockey stick and the nose cone. The shift coupler may play a small part in this occurrence, but most of the problem is in nose cone wear. in that case most of the parts that you need can be found here.

http://www2.cip1.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=nose+cone&sort=7&Search1=Search

If someone can pull the engine and trans, they would have the skills to change out the nose cone with the help of any manual (I recommend a Bentley)

If it is just stuck in one gear, you might try to get your pushers to rock the car back and forth while you put light pressure on the gear shifter. Hopefully you can get it to pop out this way. Then at a minimum, replace the shift bushing and coupler, then no more dead engine shifting.
_________________
69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
My builds
T4 into Squareback http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458944&highlight=
Auto Trans Rebuild http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516066&highlight=
AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[docwagner]

Thanks for the useful info. I have learned my lesson. I have already ordered the parts I might need to fix this mess. I will find a couple of strong backs to help me roll the bug. If that doesn't work I have talked with my mechanic who says he can do the nose cone work. He hopes we don't need to rebuild the transmission.

[desertrefugee]

With three kids in college and a 30 year old Beetle, you might want to consider going after a few things in the driveway rather than dragging it to the mechanic for everything that pops up - otherwise it could get expensive and frustrating.

These are just about the simplest automobiles to work on ever built.
_________________
- 83.5 Westfalia - 2.2 GoWesty "power"
- a bunch of vintage motorcycles
- Numerous telescopes of various size and function

"For I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night." - Sarah Williams

[docwagner]

You are so right and that is why I bought this bug and the 74 I have in the garage as well. My hope was that I could do a lot of the routine maintenance. Brakes, tune ups, oil change many repairs, upgrades would be fine. I was a bit of a motor-head growing up, but pulling motors and transmissions is a little more than my old back wants to tackle. I don't have a big garage and that is shared by other things. I had hoped this 73 was going to be a driver from the start. My 74 I bought with a blown motor and I have struggled getting that together. Meanwhile my wife is bugging me for a car my daughter can drive to school and I don't have a lot of evening/weekend time. So that is my life. I have a good honest mechanic who does good work and doesn't cheat me into unnecessary repairs. Besides I can work one Saturday doing what I do and make more money than it would cost my mechanic to fix my car. Hopefully we can get this car and my 74 settled down so that the work becomes more routine and I can take over. Thanks again for your helpful suggestions.

[docwagner]

Just an update, I got my son and wife to push the car first backwards while I let the clutch out slowly, didn't work. Then they pushed it forward while I let the clutch out slowly, didn't work. Then I tried jsut revving the engine and seeing if i could move the car under its own power and that did the trick. I now have a functional transmission again. Took the VW for a test drive and it sifted OK. I took it easy and shifted slowly although deliberately. No problems so far. I looked at the linkage components and there doesn't seem to be much play there. Now if I could just get the wiring problems squared away she'd be 100%. Thanks to all who offered suggestions.
Pete

[volksworld]

you just did what I was about to suggest...just make her aware that this could happen again and to make a conscious effort not to shut the car off in 4th gear...this is an internal problem,not a hockey stick issue...keep an eye out for another trans

[Multi69s]

IMHO I do not believe that there is anything wrong internally in your trans. The design of the VW transmission is actually pretty robust for its intended job. After all, how many modern transmissions will last for 40 years? Not many. About the only thing that may cause your problem internally would be loose bores in the intermediate housing, and this is very rare.

You may have a combination of a couple of semi loose items that caused your problem (along with the dead engine shifting). If it was my car I would change the shift coupler and the shift bushing (just so your daughter doesn't get stranded). If any more problems after that, look at the nose cone.
_________________
69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
My builds
T4 into Squareback http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458944&highlight=
Auto Trans Rebuild http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516066&highlight=
AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[docwagner]

You are probably right. I have the new shifter parts might as well put them in. I drove the car around a bit and it shifts fine if you just take it easy. Unfortunately she is new to manual transmissions and I have a feeling I will be getting a phone call. Fortunately we have AAA.