Rear brake cable (better angle re-route bracket)

[Sodo]

I have the Smallcar rear disc brakes. The rear brakes work great, much stronger than the drums. But they make this sound at about 1 mph.
-------->this is a singalong<--------.

------> "...hooooop...hooooop...hooooop....hoooop..." <---------

So I concluded that my parking brake was dragging because the spring on my new disc brakes was not sufficient to return a permanently bent cable core thru the horrific angle in the brake cable routing.

This angle, is a LAME design. (It's a VW design, not smallcar). These are new brake cables, that were bent upon the first use. I bent the core back to straight then went about changing the angle to point the cables in the direction the cable wants to go.

The photo shows what happens when you pull the emergency brake, tightening the cable. It makes the shortest path which is too sharp of an angle for a cable.

The smell of a project wafting about..... Here are the new bracket dimensions.

Here it is installed. The flanges bolt thru the original brake cable holes, using large washers. (oops, image error) If you have other larger holesaw sizes you can cut thick washers to cover the hole.

So back ti the question,,,, did this modification solve the "hooooop....hoooop" problem?

Well, the song has a couple less "oo's" now and more "......" ,
"hooooop....hooooop....hooooop....hooooop....hooooop...."
now it's
"hooop........hooop........hooop.......hooop.......hooop.........".

So not a complete success.....but
- the emergency brake cable now has a proper route
- it 'feels' noticeably better (less friction)
- it's not bending a permanent kink in the cable core.
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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb

[Raynor Shine]

Sodo- cool solution, I will pass it on to my friend who is going to do his syncro. Does this bend only happen on one side?

[Sodo]

Yes one of the angles is 'worse' than the other. As it is, the brake action is noticeable improvement in the clicks and ease of use of the e-brake, it sounds more like a normal car e-brake.

But I can't say whether my angles are the "best", just certainly better. A guy who has a LIFT could do a better job, and get better pictures too. I did it on wheel ramps, and there's not really enough room between the car and the ground to see the angles properly, and end up with the best angles for "tension and loose".

Here is another rear disc brake problem I ran across recently. Not a big problem, but one that ANYONE in the midst of a rear disc install can solve easily during the project.

OK who can spot the problem? (no cheating!!!!)

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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb

[MarkWard]

Looks like you had to notch the shock brackets for the cable to align with the caliper?
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☮️

[hiram6]

Loos to me like the caliper blocks removal of the shock bolt? If you turned it around so the nut is on the open side, it might work.

Picture could be deceptive though, that may not be the mystery problem.
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1985 Westy, 1.9L automatic (Daisy)
1996 Mazda Miata
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9 Limited

You can't lie around on the beach and drink rum all day.................unless you start first thing in the morning.

[Sodo]

Yup ---> can't get the shock bolt out dangit.
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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb

[Franklinstower]

Tom,
I get a similar brake grabing issue and noise too with my rear discs. They are not the small car version, rather the jeff (A914622) Ford Taurus Version.

The hand brake cable had to be modified too, but like you say, I think the angle of the cable completly sucks. I will try your mod and see if that gives some relief.

Do you use the stock VW cable with that Small Car Rear Disc ?

Thanks for the post!

paul
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'89 Westy - EJ25/22 Frank 4.44 5mt
'75 Miami Blue Sunroof FI Standard Bug

[?Waldo?]

[iceracer]

I like your rust free undercarriage.
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86 Syncro Wolfsburg edition
63 Beetle (The Iceracer)

[Sodo]

My brakes have since healed 100% ( no more hooop......hoooop......hoooop )

They are Vanagon brake cables, modified a little by Smallcar, who used a 2WD cable on one side. Their 'modification' is to add length to the housing, they used a very hard, thick-wall plastic tube to extend the housing a little, maybe an inch or two.

When you make the new bracket, make it strong. It has to withstand as hard as you pull on the brake lever. I would consider a brace forward to counteract the cable tension. Mine has no brace, and it feels stout....but if I had the thing up on a lift ( ) I would do it stouter......... because I think the brake would then feel more positive.

When a handbrake has a solid, positive 'feel', I just feel better about parking on a hill for example. The vanagon drum brake does NOT have that feel, and I was hoping to get a more positive e-brake adding the rear discs. They are better, but did not provide the 'positive' feel I was hoping for. The new bracket helped a lot, but possibly a brace (and optimum angles) could help even more.

Smallcar, Van Cafe, any of these crafty folks (with their lift, and their skillz) could make this part easily and get all the angles right, and could probably sell one with every disc brake kit.
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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb

[Sodo]

[Franklinstower]

[Sodo]

Six years later,,, a mod to the mod.

This has been a good mod, it really cleans up the routing of the long and somewhat troublesome cables. The Disc brakes return spring is barely strong enough to return the Vanagon's long cable contraption. Add poor routing,, tight bends, friction and the weight of the cables it just couldn't do it. With proper routing the springs are OK!

This item is a bolt-on mod, anybody could make this kit. I used riv-nuts for the brace. But the brace could simply be CLAMPED to the frame rail (no drilling).

I have my tranny out and decided to brace up my cable re-route bracket. The relocation created a much better cable route, which firmed up the brake action a lot. Buts since the bracket itself could flex on its mounting, even in better "feel" at the handbrake is available by eliminating more flex.

It DID firm up the handbrake - a little more than 1 inch reduction and it feels TIGHT!

Un-bolting the brace, then pull handbrake, you can see it moved about 4mm under tension.

Here's what the braces look like.

Construction details

Driver side (plastic moved for welding)

Passenger side (plastic moved for welding)

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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb

[Signalocity]

You really shouldn't have to do all of this to get the parking break to operate correctly with the rear disk conversion or otherwise. If your factory plastic routing guides are popping loose, It is likely that your tubing spacers are not the correct length or following the correct routing curve. I had that same issue until I dialed everything in. If your caliper springs are not strong enough to return the cable, you probably need new ones. One of mine was hanging up for that very same reason, on a fresh rebuilt caliper.

[Sodo]

[insyncro]

Custom cables that adjust at both ends is a very simple solution, no spacers needed and allow for two clicks to fully engage the parking brake.

[Sodo]

How much do custom cables cost? I looked into it, and recall that it wasn't really that simple. Pretty much had to order a cable for a couple hundred $$ and "see if it fits" which was too much risk for me. This was 6 years ago and my foggy memory suggests that I asked on the forum and "nobody" replied or was willing to share a cable spec. So custom cables remained a phantom solution (or perhaps a proprietary solution).

"Two clicks" sounds phantom to me.

Heres one adjustable cable that might work for $125 http://amzn.com/B000CONKC4

Looking back on it I wonder why I didn't just make my own adjustable cable ends for the VW cables, it would be just "easy". And especially useful if they could be disassembled and lubed. There's 20/20 hindsight for ya! Custom cables don't improve upon the cable route. But with active lube, the original route is probably OK.

I suppose a commercially produced re-route adapter might cost $150? The adapter could accommodate disc brake kit spacers for various caliper choices, allowing use of off-the shelf cables. Its a viable product.

It takes time to post this stuff, probably more time than the project. Understood very few will undertake a project like this, even how simple it is but hope my pics and description will help someone, someday.
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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb

[insyncro]

I make my own cables now after buying pre-made a few times.
IIRC, about $75 per cable when buying pre-made.
About half that when you make them.

The cable linked above is featured in a thread here...along with its matching lever.

[Sodo]

[Sodo]

A rear pic showing the re-route.

Driver side.

Passenger side. Notice the cable is aimed to pass straight thru the gap between the cooling system tubes and the frame.

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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb