CA DMV and SPCNS (Specially Constructed Vehicle)

[DavidB]

Hi, I deal with proper registration on buggies all the time, I get asked at least once a week if it is OK to use a bug vin on one of the chassis I build for them. The answer is pretty easy, do it the legal way, proper SB100, because to register your buggy as a 61 bug or some convenient title you happen to have, is only a felony in California. To misrepresent your vehicle to the DMV is a felony in CA. Three of those in a row for your three buggies and you go to prison forever in Ca.
Print out what the DMV website tells you about registering it, and start at the DMV. They will send you to the CHP. then to the smog Ref, and they might want a brake and light check....some ask for it at the dmv, others don
't. Back to the DMV with all the papers and you are done.
One time the paper work was withheld because they Sacramento said there were now 2 VIN numbers on the car, and yes there were, take a file of grinder to the CHP and remove the original VIN and have him note that.
As for insurance, I was told by my insurance agent not to insure it as a VW bug, even though the title said it was......fifteen years ago..... He said is you are in an accident the company would NOT pay up since you were not driving a VW bug. That could cost you your house.
do it legal, for your own sake
David Barrett
manxchassis.com
And very contrary to what some other buggy builder posted on thesamba at one time, yes You can get my chassis legal in California. To register one of his buggies in Calfornia as a VW, because they are built on a VW pan, can get you charged with a felony, try to explain that to your next employer.
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work hard

[sturgeongeneral]

In 2012 there were over 150 certificates left over AND NOT issued. In 2011 over 100 were left unissued.
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Street legal fiberglass rocket ship
2005 Lotus Elise supercharged
1974 Chevy Corvette
My fiberglass car collection!

In honor of bowtie56jw:Another victim of the nasty "C" Praying for ya Jeff!

My exwife said if I towed home one more bug she would leave me. You know, every once in a while I miss her

[MANXXMAN]

Every manx I have ever owned (at least 10) has been registered as a VW, and insured as a vw. My insurance company told me that they wouldn't insure a specialty constructed vehicle because they dont have anything to reference from for replacement parts (it's not in there system). I had a hard time even finding an insurance company that would insure my buggys for true face value (most 69 vw's don't cost $20 to $40k). I think there is allot of mis-information about it. The only spcns titled cars I have had were regitstered back in the 70's and there was no problem because everyone just assumed it was an old car. I could find insurance, but it was very expensive compared to being registered as a vw. I have never had an accident or claim, so I couldn't tell you if they would have paid, but i also never had a problem with any officers when I had to show them paperwork either. as long as everything was legal, i went on my way. (only been pulled over once though) My insurance agent even had me send pictures of the cars before they issued the policy. The only thing I do recommend is, never tell the insurance company that they are built to go off road, that is an instant no from most insurance companys that i have delt with.

[BL3Manx]

I only ever insure dune buggies for liability. The same goes for every other vehicle I own that's over 15 years old. If somebody hits me I'll go after them/their insurance. If I wreck my own buggy it'll be on my own nickel, plus I can probably fix anything that gets busted myself.

[jgreen61]

It is a cold hard fact that it is illegal in the state of California to convert your VW Beetle into fiberglass Dune Buggy and not regiester it as a SPCNS vehicle PERIOD ! .. I dont get it when people respond that they are getting away with it so dont worry and then saying to lie to your insurance or they wont insure you, This is horrible advise.

If you have had a buggy for years and its registered as a VW Beetle then I too would probably just take my chances and keep it as is and just play stupid if the day came I got called on it, But when you have clear directions on how to get it properly registered its not really a lot if expence and trouble. If you have a $20K+ dune buggy it would be insane not to have it properly registered.

[OB Bus]

In the description of a SPCNS vehicle the California DMV says:
"Example: A Volkswagen "Beetle" with modified fenders, engine compartment lid, and front end, but still recognizable as a Volkswagen is not considered a specially constructed vehicle."
So does anyone have experience in titling a bug/truck like this:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/pix/5448083.jpg

I called DMV yesterday and got 2 answers of "maybe yes/no" and one of "no" (since VW never built a flatbed bug).
Thoughts?
_________________
Larry in OB
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
69 Westfalia and 2002 Eurovan Camper.

[BL3Manx]

No experience but I'd say yours is the rolling definition of the law, modified but still recognizable as a VW bug body. Yours is definitely not a special construction. VW never built flip front end Bajas but that's precisely what the law allows.

[grinNbarritt]

Im in kinda same situation as Jgreen, but a lil diff. My buggy was titled as spcns, yr first sold 61, yr 67. Its in my name but outta system. wanting to get her back on road so I'm wondering what hoops I will have to jump thru? JGreen whatever happend with the smog ref? I have a complete 55 or 56 engine if I need it to get past that hoop....as long as it dont have to run. Jim

[BL3Manx]

Do you have a title for it which is already in your name? If so it should just be a matter of clearing the back fees owed. If it already has a 67 Special Construction title, try like hell to keep that one instead of getting a new one.

If you give them a statement of fact that it was never operational and that its a special interest collector car and that you are a collector, You should be able to avoid the back fees. This is the section which applies (certification = PNO)

Vehicle code 4604
(a) Except as otherwise provided in subdivision (d), prior to
the expiration of the registration of a vehicle, if that
registration is not to be renewed prior to its expiration, the owner
of the vehicle shall file, under penalty of perjury, a certification
that the vehicle will not be operated, moved, or left standing upon a
highway without first making an application for registration of the
vehicle, including full payment of all fees. The certification is
valid until the vehicle's registration is renewed pursuant to
subdivision (c).
(b) Each certification filed pursuant to subdivision (a) shall be
accompanied by a filing fee of fifteen dollars ($15).
(c) (1) An application for renewal of registration, except when
accompanied by an application for transfer of title to, or an
interest in, the vehicle, shall be submitted to the department with
payment of the required fees for the current registration year and
without penalty for delinquent payment of fees imposed under this
code or under Part 5 (commencing with Section 10701) of Division 2 of
the Revenue and Taxation Code if the department receives the
application prior to or on the date the vehicle is first operated,
moved, or left standing upon a highway during the current
registration year and the certification required pursuant to
subdivision (a) was timely filed with the department.
(2) If an application for renewal of registration is accompanied
by an application for transfer of title, that application may be made
without incurring a penalty for delinquent payment of fees not later
than 20 days after the date the vehicle is first operated, moved, or
left standing on a highway if a certification pursuant to
subdivision (a) was timely filed with the department.
(d) A certification is not required to be filed pursuant to
subdivision (a) for one or more of the following:
(1) A vehicle on which the registration expires while being held
as inventory by a dealer or lessor-retailer or while being held
pending a lien sale by the keeper of a garage or operator of a towing
service.
(2) A vehicle registered pursuant to Article 4 (commencing with
Section 8050) of Chapter 4 of Division 3.
(3) A vehicle described in Section 5004, 5004.5, or 5051, as
provided in Section 4604.2. However, the registered owner may file a
certificate of nonoperation in lieu of the certification specified in
subdivision (a).
(4) A vehicle registered pursuant to Article 5 (commencing with
Section 9700) of Chapter 6 if the registered owner has complied with
subdivision (c) of Section 9706.
(e) Notwithstanding Section 670, for purposes of this section, a
"vehicle" is a device by which a person or property may be propelled,
moved, or driven upon a highway having intact and assembled its
major component parts including, but not limited to, the frame or
chassis, cowl, and floor pan or, in the case of a trailer, the frame
and wheels or, in the case of a motorcycle, the frame, front fork,
and engine. For purposes of this section, "vehicle" does not include
a device moved exclusively by human power, a device used exclusively
upon stationary rails or tracks, or a motorized wheelchair.

[b]5051 collector

(a) “Collector” is the owner of one or more vehicles described in Section 5004 or of one or more special interest vehicles, as defined in this article, who collects, purchases, acquires, trades, or disposes of the vehicle, or parts thereof, for his or her own use, in order to preserve, restore, and maintain the vehicle for hobby or historical purposes.

[grinNbarritt]

The title is in my name, but it hasnt been reg for way over 10 yrs, and I was a dummy n didnt non op it. My dad n I built it in the 70,s when I was just a kid. It was my only car for a couple of yrs and I had to drive it rain or shine....so when insurance company said they quit insuring cars like these, I got disgusted and just parked it. But after lurkin here for couple yrs n seeing all the manx's at buellton last yr kinda wanna bring her back to life.

[grinNbarritt]

gonna try n post pic....first attempt at this...

[Dale M.]

[grinNbarritt]

Dont cars after 6 yrs or something fall outta the computer? Its been unregistered for at least 13 yrs, stopped driving it about a yr after that pic...and my daughter is 19 now.... Sure hope your not right, the 69 bug i just got legal was 2 yrs behind and it was $600

[BL3Manx]

If you have an original title or registration in your name, they can put it back into the computer, but they may want to check the numbers themselves. The question will be the back fees.

There is no guarantee and they could tell you you're SOL, but I have personal experience avoiding back fees by politely telling the DMV worker that I am a collector and I want to register my collector vehicle and by mentioning the reference above.

You may have been able to beat the $600 fee on the bug if you had mentioned 5051 (b).

5051. As used in this article, unless the context otherwise requires:

(b) “Special interest vehicle” is a vehicle of an age that is unaltered from the manufacturer’s original specifications and, because of its significance, including, but not limited to, an out-of-production vehicle or a model of less than 2,000 sold in California in a model-year, is collected, preserved, restored, or maintained by a hobbyist as a leisure pursuit.

[Dale M.]

What I have done in past if its not going well (idiot drone behind counter) I say "have not got that much cash with me today, will have to come back some other time".... Different day, different clerk (drone), different attitude, different interpretation of rules....

There is also supposed to be a phone number in Sacramento for DMV help... People on end of phone line are pretty good, I'll see if I can find the help line number...

http://apps.dmv.ca.gov/contacts/contacts.htm

http://gethuman.com/phone-number/DMV-California/

Dale
_________________
“Fear The Government That Wants To Take Your Guns" - Thomas Jefferson.

"Kellison Sand Piper Roadster" For Street & Show.
"Joe Pody Sandrover" Buggy with 2180 for Autocross (Sold)
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All suggestions and advice are purely my own opinion. You are free to ignore them if you wish ...

[Iguana]

I did several the other day and the lady at the DMV said that anything over 25 years was considered a collectors car and the fees where caped at $80 odd dollars.

So she just over rules the calculated back fees and away we went.

[grinNbarritt]

Thanks everybody for the advice and help!! When I did the bug, I went to a friends wife who has a DMV service, so she prob dont have the power to overule back fees.... seemed like it would be easy thru her and it was just,costly My dad told me never let the reg expire, cuz all the problems he had getting it, but i was broke n the X got cancer about this time, so it just kinda got pushed way back on my to do list. Lesson for today kids....always do the non op!!!! lol

[jgreen61]

Not much of a update but I do have the very official looking embosed one of 500 certificates.. My problem is too much work and no time, I am hoping to get the wire harness installed this week end and with luck I will post the ending of my registration story in a month or two.... I will make one more attempt at a differant DMV and if that doesnt work I will put the 1962 1200cc engine in my buggy and head to the smog referee.
I wish all I had to do was pay out $600 in back fees but that is not possible when you have a vehicle that is no longer in the DMV data base, you are screwed as there is no record of anything... I am hoping a differant DMV may see the original CA pink slip I have and just punch the right keyboard keys to get me a new old title,, the num skulls I have been dealing with tried to get their DMV system to accept it and after sevreral trys by several DMV drones including the manager , they told me that I had to go new speacial construction... my brain hurts just reliving my time spent with those DMV idiots.

[grinNbarritt]

I talked to the lady that reg my bug, she seemed to think it was gonna be no prob to put my car back in system. Seems way to easy..... so my next step drag it outta the weeds its in and get it to her to verify vin. Thats gonna be a pain now cuz I did go look at the buggy for first time in awhile, n sum scumbag stole my tow bar.....at least my copper hurst shifter still there.

[Manx102]