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HUMZUKI
Samba Member
Joined: March 20, 2013
Posts: 9
Location: United States
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 Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:27 am Post subject: Whats the trick to getting the distributor out of these? |
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Hi, Im a new owner of a 71 Squareback. Iv always wanted an aircooled VW but Iv never spent any time wrenching on one. Whats the deal with taking the distributor out?
I can see theres a rod that crosses the whole engine there at the top thats in the way of part of the distributor that has a nut on the end of it. I cant lift it high enough to get the hold down arm off of the stud on the engine so that I can rotate it enough to get past that rod and pull it out.
I took a clip off of that rod and tried to pull it out through the passenger side of the car bc it looks like it would perfectly get clear of the distributor but that things attached to something. I sanded the end down so it would fit through but if I tap it with a hammer it pops back out of the 3-4mm it moves.
I had it set at TDC the (left mark on the pully) and the valves were both closed on number 1 cylinder when I was trying to get it out bc I read that might be an issue with one of the engines.
I have pics but I havent figured out how to post to this specific post yet bc Im a nube to the site. I searched and searched but I cant find anything about the type 3 asfar as engine work.....just tons of type 2 info.
I originally wanted to pull it to replace the condensor but its working but when I went to set the static timing nothing seemed to line up right. So Now I wanted to pull it out and set everything up from scratch. |
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Mike Fisher
Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006
Posts: 17970
Location: Eugene, OR
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:42 am Post subject: |
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Yours has carburetor rods in the way? Take the nut off the vertical bolt that holds down the distributor clamp. You can then remove the distributor with the clamp still on it, while not changing the timing.  Mine is a '69 FI/AT square though.
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69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey |
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ataraxia
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2010
Posts: 4504
Location: Illinois
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 11:07 am Post subject: |
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| Mike Fisher wrote: |
| Yours has carburetor rods in the way? Take the nut off the vertical bolt that holds down the distributor clamp. You can then remove the distributor with the clamp still on it, while not changing the timing. Mine is a '69 FI/AT square though. |
Sounds more like the thermostat flap rod...
The distributor clamp usually sits under the thermostat flap rod. If you use either a long extension socket and a long handled wrench, you can hold one side and loosen the other. |
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KTPhil 
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 34009
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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This picture might help you understand what's going on:
The TOP of the photo is toward the REAR of the car, backwards from how you probably are looking. But you can see the thermostat flap control rod, and also the funny shape of the clamp that is causing your problem. You need to loosen the 10mm clamp nut, and then pull the distributor up and out. The clamp can be tight on the distributor body and you may catch the lip of the groove for the o-ring (which may also get cut in the process).
Make life easier-- put the motor at TDC for #1 before you remove it. |
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Mark Shutt
Samba Member
Joined: February 10, 2012
Posts: 482
Location: Doncaster UK.
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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I always struggle to pull my distributor to work on it or change condenser, last time I had to pull the pump as well, just seem like a really silly design but then again on a type 1 it just comes off in seconds so think VW was reluctant to reinvent the ball just to make pulling the distributor easy for us!
is there a better clamp available that is not such a struggle to adjust or remove? maybe I have the wrong clamp! is there more than 1 clamp out there?
Mark.
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1968 1600TL Auto build thread, have a look!
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6007222#6007222 |
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HUMZUKI
Samba Member
Joined: March 20, 2013
Posts: 9
Location: United States
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 7:38 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the info!! I should have mentioned its Fuel injected. That thermostat flap rod is what its getting hung up on. I didnt know what it was called. Theres no way to slide that out?
Ill try to loosen that 10mm clamp bolt but Im not sure if I will be able to get anything on the head of the bolt to hold it. |
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KTPhil
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 34009
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 7:53 am Post subject: |
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In the photo I posted (thanks to the Samba galleries), you can see one "curl" surrounding the bolt was brazed closed, which adds a lot of strength to the clamp. The problem is the curl can distort, which requires you to overtighten the clamp to hold timing, which starts a spiral of overtightening and slipping until the thing won't hold and it a bear to tighten or adjust. I suggest you do ike this guy did (I'd do both curls) and then make sure it is straight and square-faced. It will make removal and adjustments both a lot easier with a better feel as you tighten.
A pair of 10mm combo wrenches should do it. Oh, and a magnet to retrieve the nut when it falls down on top of the motor down in a crevase! |
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HUMZUKI
Samba Member
Joined: March 20, 2013
Posts: 9
Location: United States
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:02 am Post subject: |
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| KTPhil wrote: |
In the photo I posted (thanks to the Samba galleries), you can see one "curl" surrounding the bolt was brazed closed, which adds a lot of strength to the clamp. The problem is the curl can distort, which requires you to overtighten the clamp to hold timing, which starts a spiral of overtightening and slipping until the thing won't hold and it a bear to tighten or adjust. I suggest you do ike this guy did (I'd do both curls) and then make sure it is straight and square-faced. It will make removal and adjustments both a lot easier with a better feel as you tighten.
A pair of 10mm combo wrenches should do it. Oh, and a magnet to retrieve the nut when it falls down on top of the motor down in a crevase! |
It doesn't hold timing right now. I didnt realize that clamp was what was holding it tight and I thought it came off with the distributer. I thought I just had to take that larger "hold down" nut off then just pulled it out like every other distributor Iv ever messed with.
Ill go try to lossen that clamp up and see whats up. Thanks! Iv been searching trying to figure this out for a few days now. Type 3s arnt very easy to get build info on other than lowering them. Guess it would help if I had a repair manuel on it  |
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D/A/N
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Joined: August 13, 2010
Posts: 2227
Location: 11222
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:25 am Post subject: |
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| HUMZUKI wrote: |
Thanks for the info!! I should have mentioned its Fuel injected. That thermostat flap rod is what its getting hung up on. I didnt know what it was called. Theres no way to slide that out?
Ill try to loosen that 10mm clamp bolt but Im not sure if I will be able to get anything on the head of the bolt to hold it. |
Not for nothing, but it's not really a good idea to go pulling clips off and sanding down and hammering rods on an engine you haven't learned about yet. Your thermostat rod is VITAL and not something you want to eff up.
I'm having a little bit of a hard time picturing what you're saying, but I've had to remove the distributor several times on my FI engine and have never had the slightest problem. Maybe I have a slimmer than average 10mm wrench but I doubt it. It's a tiny bit awkward with the thermostat rod (which doesn't just slide out BTW) but if you peer down in there, the 10mm nut should extend past the rod and leave you enough room to get the wrench on. You can't really do big turns of the wrench and you have to hold it upright but it should be a cinch even with the rod.
Finally, if the dist. isn't loose enough to get out, loosen the 13mm nut that holds the clamp to the case and you should be able to get it out easily. You don't have to remove the distributor clamp at all. The most you'll have to do is loosen it. |
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HUMZUKI
Samba Member
Joined: March 20, 2013
Posts: 9
Location: United States
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:42 am Post subject: |
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| D/A/N wrote: |
| HUMZUKI wrote: |
Thanks for the info!! I should have mentioned its Fuel injected. That thermostat flap rod is what its getting hung up on. I didnt know what it was called. Theres no way to slide that out?
Ill try to loosen that 10mm clamp bolt but Im not sure if I will be able to get anything on the head of the bolt to hold it. |
Not for nothing, but it's not really a good idea to go pulling clips off and sanding down and hammering rods on an engine you haven't learned about yet. Your thermostat rod is VITAL and not something you want to eff up.
I'm having a little bit of a hard time picturing what you're saying, but I've had to remove the distributor several times on my FI engine and have never had the slightest problem. Maybe I have a slimmer than average 10mm wrench but I doubt it. It's a tiny bit awkward with the thermostat rod (which doesn't just slide out BTW) but if you peer down in there, the 10mm nut should extend past the rod and leave you enough room to get the wrench on. You can't really do big turns of the wrench and you have to hold it upright but it should be a cinch even with the rod.
Finally, if the dist. isn't loose enough to get out, loosen the 13mm nut that holds the clamp to the case and you should be able to get it out easily. You don't have to remove the distributor clamp at all. The most you'll have to do is loosen it. |
I know my way around an engine bay of just about every other car other than a Aircooled VW out there. I actually worked as a mechanic at a VW dealer back in high school 96 but the only aircooled vehicle to ever come in there in2-3 years I worked there was a Thing once. With just about every other vehicle out there you would simply loosen the hold down bolt (witch is exactly what that 13mm bolt looks exactly like) and take the distributor out. IF it was a bug the clamps right there all obvious bc thats what it was obviously designed for they just clocked it 180 deg so the vacuum advance fits with the generator right there. |
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D/A/N
Samba Member
Joined: August 13, 2010
Posts: 2227
Location: 11222
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:03 am Post subject: |
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| HUMZUKI wrote: |
| D/A/N wrote: |
| HUMZUKI wrote: |
Thanks for the info!! I should have mentioned its Fuel injected. That thermostat flap rod is what its getting hung up on. I didnt know what it was called. Theres no way to slide that out?
Ill try to loosen that 10mm clamp bolt but Im not sure if I will be able to get anything on the head of the bolt to hold it. |
Not for nothing, but it's not really a good idea to go pulling clips off and sanding down and hammering rods on an engine you haven't learned about yet. Your thermostat rod is VITAL and not something you want to eff up.
I'm having a little bit of a hard time picturing what you're saying, but I've had to remove the distributor several times on my FI engine and have never had the slightest problem. Maybe I have a slimmer than average 10mm wrench but I doubt it. It's a tiny bit awkward with the thermostat rod (which doesn't just slide out BTW) but if you peer down in there, the 10mm nut should extend past the rod and leave you enough room to get the wrench on. You can't really do big turns of the wrench and you have to hold it upright but it should be a cinch even with the rod.
Finally, if the dist. isn't loose enough to get out, loosen the 13mm nut that holds the clamp to the case and you should be able to get it out easily. You don't have to remove the distributor clamp at all. The most you'll have to do is loosen it. |
I know my way around an engine bay of just about every other car other than a Aircooled VW out there. I actually worked as a mechanic at a VW dealer back in high school 96 but the only aircooled vehicle to ever come in there in2-3 years I worked there was a Thing once. With just about every other vehicle out there you would simply loosen the hold down bolt (witch is exactly what that 13mm bolt looks exactly like) and take the distributor out. IF it was a bug the clamps right there all obvious bc thats what it was obviously designed for they just clocked it 180 deg so the vacuum advance fits with the generator right there. |
I wasn't trying to cut on your skills. Just trying to point out that the operation might be easier than you were making it out to be. I know I've made simple things gratuitously complicated at times by thinking something simply "must" be one way when it's actually the other way. 
And this'll help enormously.....and it's from a good seller
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1274622 |
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HUMZUKI
Samba Member
Joined: March 20, 2013
Posts: 9
Location: United States
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:47 am Post subject: |
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That was a snap knowing that thats what was holding the distributor in not the 13mm nut  I only needed to loosen the nut and didnt even have to hold the bolt rotate it clockwise and it came right out. Thanks everyone! |
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Bobnotch
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Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22422
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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| HUMZUKI wrote: |
| That was a snap knowing that thats what was holding the distributor in not the 13mm nut I only needed to loosen the nut and didnt even have to hold the bolt rotate it clockwise and it came right out. Thanks everyone! |
As it should be. Sometimes the hardest jobs are actually pretty easy once you know how to do it. 
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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blues90
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2009
Posts: 1912
Location: Hollywood ,CA
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| Posted: Tue May 19, 2015 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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I never had a problem getting my 73 FI distributor out . I can't get it out removing the 13mm nut tried that once .
I have an older clamp that came off a 72 FI and used to one of the 73 because the one from the 72 has the curl on the brazed side shown in the photo open and bent at the top so the metal barrel only hits the bottom side of the curl what this does is flare the end of the barrel from over tightening . If you look real close when it's over tightened you will also see that the open part that fits around the dist body where the curls are and the gap the edges of that gap are bent up about .010" which would not allow the dist to fully seat. |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21518
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Wed May 20, 2015 2:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Bobnotch wrote: |
| HUMZUKI wrote: |
| That was a snap knowing that thats what was holding the distributor in not the 13mm nut I only needed to loosen the nut and didnt even have to hold the bolt rotate it clockwise and it came right out. Thanks everyone! |
As it should be. Sometimes the hardest jobs are actually pretty easy once you know how to do it. |
Thats a fact....imagine how many years I lived through the terror of sucking my oil out through the dipstick hole every time I changed it....before i realized there was a drain plug on the bottom.....
On to more on thread musings.... ....yes...I can weld my distributor clamp...and have not had any problem with mine but can see where its flexing. One day I will have issues.
To that point....Has anyone found or tried any useful billet style aftermarket clamps that actually fit right for type 3 or 4?
Ray |
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cjustinjones
Samba Member
Joined: March 17, 2010
Posts: 36
Location: Memphis TN
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| Posted: Sat May 30, 2015 8:16 am Post subject: distributor in backwards? |
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I wanted to adjust the valves on a new to me type 3. I thought I was at TDC and had the brass end of the roter pointed at number 1 cylinder.
I was worried that something was really wrong when trying to adjust the outtake valve on number 1. I then traced the number 1 spark plug wire and it was connected to number 4 cylinder.
I started looking at the 009 distributor and noticed that the part number was on the back? It looks like at some point someone installed the distributor backwards?
My question is, can I just pull the distributor and turn it around like it should be? Or is there more to it? Did someone install something wrong in the engine and thats why its like this?
Thanks in advance |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22422
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sun May 31, 2015 12:47 pm Post subject: Re: distributor in backwards? |
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| cjustinjones wrote: |
I wanted to adjust the valves on a new to me type 3. I thought I was at TDC and had the brass end of the roter pointed at number 1 cylinder.
I was worried that something was really wrong when trying to adjust the outtake valve on number 1. I then traced the number 1 spark plug wire and it was connected to number 4 cylinder.
I started looking at the 009 distributor and noticed that the part number was on the back? It looks like at some point someone installed the distributor backwards?
My question is, can I just pull the distributor and turn it around like it should be? Or is there more to it? Did someone install something wrong in the engine and thats why its like this?
Thanks in advance |
More than likely, when the engine was built (rebuilt), the distributor drive was installed like a bug uses. This means the distributor drive is off. To fix it, you have to pull the distributor drive shaft out, and re-index it to the correct location for a type 3. Or, you can flip the position of the drive dog on the end of the distributor (not many here like doing that though).
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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blues90
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2009
Posts: 1912
Location: Hollywood ,CA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2015 10:43 am Post subject: |
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| I can tell you one thing . I put a new O ring seal on my dist last week the old one was sealing it was like hard plastic . In order not to damage the new O ring I had to remove the clamp , even though I had the clamp open I found I needed to take the nut off the clamp and spread the clamp open more and close down one of the curls the put the new O ring on after the clamp then even with a good O ring that I smeared a bit of oil on it was still a battle to get the dist back in with a new O ring it will not pull out of go in so easy . I tried an O ring that came with my engine rebuilt kit from 97 and there was no way it would go in so it must have been a cheapo O ring. I just say this because the O ring is a seal and should not be collapsed and rock hard . |
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