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marklee
Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2009
Posts: 821
Location: Flintshire, North Wales
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 Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 12:33 pm Post subject: |
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| beetlenut wrote: |
I'm not overthinking, just trying to understand. There is a difference. The passenger door front is hard up against the A-pillar, while the rear has about a 1/2 to 3/4 inch gap with the B-pillar. I'm willing to concede that the body being off the car is a big part of that. I'm just trying to get a feel for how much that procedure will move the door if I still have a sizeable gap once the body is back on, and the car has a chance to settle. Besides on the days I can't work on it, what else VW related do I have to do?  |
Ignore all door gaps until the body is bolted on the pan and the car is almost built up with seats,tank, glass and running gear in. Then and only then play with the door gaps as to do anything else is a waste of time. The Beetle body is quite flexible...
_________________
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Police Class 1 High performance, pursuit trained Advanced driver |
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theKbStockpiler
Samba Member
Joined: July 07, 2012
Posts: 2316
Location: Rust Belt
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| Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 8:19 pm Post subject: |
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I have a car with the exact problem. Previously someone backed up with the door open and the door stopped it The damage seems to be limited to the door it's self (you can see where the door is pushed in towards the hinges) and not the pillar but I have not remedied it yet so the issue could also include the pillar. I don't see how abusing the pillar would correct it. The heater channel would have to be bent along with where the pillar mounts at the top.
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My beetle is not competing with your beetle. I have the yellow beetle in my town. There is a red one, a green one ......
Use all safety devices including a mask. |
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runchman
Samba Member
Joined: October 03, 2012
Posts: 254
Location: Algonquin, Illinois
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flyboy161
Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2009
Posts: 2091
Location: Perry, GA
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beetlenut
Samba Member
Joined: May 27, 2009
Posts: 2983
Location: RI
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| Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2015 2:14 pm Post subject: |
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I used some cardboard from an old box. I folded-over several layers until I got the right thickness. While the body was still on the saw horses, with the "B" pillar directly on top of the front saw horse, I could see the bottom hinge was pushed forward, into the door jam. I was able to pull it back out before I painted that section. The door has a uniform gap between the B-pillar now. Once I put it back on the pan, I'll use that Hot VW article to get the final gaps. It really is surprising how much you can move things around to get the right gaps with just a little cardboard and bolting and unbolting different body-to-pan bolts.
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scrapyards are for quitters
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| Wetstuff wrote: |
| ... I spend more time shaking it than directing it?! I get a pretty decent blast for 8sec. then have to shake it again. |
- Words to live by right there!
My 74 Super rebuild thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6507104#6507104 |
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esde
Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2007
Posts: 5967
Location: central rust belt
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| Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm glad you're getting it, but really, the cardboard is the wrong material for the job. It's going to compress and degrade over time, and it can hold moisture in the joint. Cut some shims out of different thickness steel sheet, and when you know what works, slip it in with a little seam sealer. Paint them too. If you were close, I'd shear off a bunch of pieces for you to try, 16-18-20-22g, some combination of those will do it. |
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VWCOOL
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2006
Posts: 1821
Location: Down under
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| Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2015 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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I make and use these for body restorations:
https://www.facebook.com/GTBeetles/photos/a.737148...mp;theater
you can also 'jack-up' the front of a beam car with washers on the two upper beam mounts.
This will help tweak door gaps
Only do this with the BODY TORQUED TO CHASSIS AND ON ITS WHEELS |
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flyboy161
Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2009
Posts: 2091
Location: Perry, GA
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| Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2015 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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He's not using cardboard as shim material. The gap at the B pillar is caused by bent hinges. The door flies open and the check Rod can't stop the hinges from bending forward towards the front of the car. It's simple leverage at work. The cardboard is folded over into several layers (Bentley recommends hard wood wedges). Open the door, insert the cardboard between the hinge halves and then shut the door firmly. This will result in the door hinge bending back in the proper direction. You'll find this procedure in the Bentley manual around door replacement. In the 1200 manual it is on page 8c of section A16
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My father's 1970 Beetle-
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=603879
The 1964...Diamond in the rough
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=612776
My 1958 Morocco Bug-
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=611483 |
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beetlenut
Samba Member
Joined: May 27, 2009
Posts: 2983
Location: RI
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2015 9:25 am Post subject: |
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| flyboy161 wrote: |
| He's not using cardboard as shim material... |
Exactly, I just used the cardboard to pull the metal that the hinge attached to, back into place. Obviously I wasn't too clear in my description. I do plan on making some metal shims once I get the body bolted back on the car if the gaps are still off.
_________________
scrapyards are for quitters
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| Wetstuff wrote: |
| ... I spend more time shaking it than directing it?! I get a pretty decent blast for 8sec. then have to shake it again. |
- Words to live by right there!
My 74 Super rebuild thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6507104#6507104 |
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60ragtop
Bonneville Belt Bitch
Joined: March 13, 2006
Posts: 7800
Location: Big Wonderful WYO 82401
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2015 9:01 pm Post subject: |
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Do let us know how the gap is once you get it bolted back on the pan.
_________________
Rick
Certified Mechanic by the State of Michigan in 1977
ASA certified in 1987
Certified Hunter Wheel Alignment Master Technician 1986
| tasb wrote: |
I've restored a large number too, but I don't toot my horn quite as loud.
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| sb001 wrote: |
| maybe he just snapped cause his car sucked |
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Texasdoc
Samba Member
Joined: June 22, 2017
Posts: 77
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 10:17 pm Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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I know this is an old post, but I’m trying to get my door to line up. I am not understanding where to put the towel/shim/shop rag. Which metal is it pulling back into shape? Does anyone have a photo of what/where?
That hotvw article is link it no longer valid. |
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esde
Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2007
Posts: 5967
Location: central rust belt
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| Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 7:55 am Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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where does the door hit when you close it?
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modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that. |
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Texasdoc
Samba Member
Joined: June 22, 2017
Posts: 77
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 8:09 am Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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| The bottom of the door hits the car (heater channel?) near the back of the door (closest to the latch, away from the hinges). It does not hit the B-pillar. |
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VW_Jimbo 
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2016
Posts: 9954
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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| Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:18 am Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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| Texasdoc wrote: |
| The bottom of the door hits the car (heater channel?) near the back of the door (closest to the latch, away from the hinges). It does not hit the B-pillar. |
If the door does not hit the B pillar but hits the heater channel, the channel is set too high into the body. What is your measurement from the top of the channel to the inside top of the B pillar roof junction point?
My 54 build thread has some info on manipulating a door opening. The car started to buckle on me after it was lifted off the pan, due to a rusted out heater channel. It is a few pages in, but may be insightful. I had to weld in adjustable braces to push and pull the door openings back into the factory measurements.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=722610
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Jimbo
There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!
| TDCTDI wrote: |
| Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look. |
| 67rustavenger wrote: |
| GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
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Chickensoup
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2018
Posts: 5368
Location: Good Hope, GA
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| Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:26 am Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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Sorry about hijacking this thread.... but ive got a similar issue.
My '65 has what i think is an odd kinda gap problem.
At the base(window down), the gaps line up perfectly. However, towards the top, it sits closer towards the shell. As if its pulled super tight.
How do i fix this?
thanks
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-'85 c10 5.3 LS, 222 cam, long tubes, x pipe, 3 inch spin tech's
-'05 B5.5 TDI Wagon 17in sport rims ;EGR + BSM + ASV Delete, Stage-2 Tune, straight pipe
'65 Tourist Delivery Build
'66 RIP
'69 RIP
Hosea 4:6 "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" |
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Chad M
Samba Member
Joined: July 14, 2003
Posts: 723
Location: Alberta
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| Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:46 am Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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| Chickensoup wrote: |
Sorry about hijacking this thread.... but ive got a similar issue.
My '65 has what i think is an odd kinda gap problem.
At the base(window down), the gaps line up perfectly. However, towards the top, it sits closer towards the shell. As if its pulled super tight.
How do i fix this? |
Your door might be twisted. It's possible somebody pulled the top right corner at one point and then they just moved the top hinge to align the bottom half of the door.
I'd probably just close the door and see if I could pull out that top corner to create some gap. They're pretty flexible when you get pulling on them. |
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Texasdoc
Samba Member
Joined: June 22, 2017
Posts: 77
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:05 am Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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| VW_Jimbo wrote: |
| Texasdoc wrote: |
| The bottom of the door hits the car (heater channel?) near the back of the door (closest to the latch, away from the hinges). It does not hit the B-pillar. |
If the door does not hit the B pillar but hits the heater channel, the channel is set too high into the body. What is your measurement from the top of the channel to the inside top of the B pillar roof junction point?
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=722610 |
I’ll have to measure when I get home. The door fit fine. I took the door off when it went to paint, now the door doesn’t fit. The body never came off the frame. |
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viiking
Samba Member
Joined: May 10, 2013
Posts: 2667
Location: Sydney Australia
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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If you’ve ever dissected a door you’ll realise that hinges do not bend but rather the thin metal reinforcement that the hinges attach to. It’s only thin steel that is rivetted to the doo hinge. Very flimsy.
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1968 1500 RHD Lotus White Beetle since birth. In the hospital for major surgery
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Discharged: 1983 Vanagon, 1974 1800 Microbus,1968 Low Light,1968 Type 3
Last edited by viiking on Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:12 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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VW_Jimbo
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2016
Posts: 9954
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:09 pm Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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| Chickensoup wrote: |
Sorry about hijacking this thread.... but ive got a similar issue.
My '65 has what i think is an odd kinda gap problem.
At the base(window down), the gaps line up perfectly. However, towards the top, it sits closer towards the shell. As if its pulled super tight.
How do i fix this?
thanks
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Someone installed the heater channel too low on one side and too high on the other. Or, what is really happening, someone did not measure.
Get a tape measure and see what the numbers are.? Then post them back up. Betting the A pillar is too low or the B pillar is too high.
_________________
Jimbo
There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!
| TDCTDI wrote: |
| Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look. |
| 67rustavenger wrote: |
| GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
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Chickensoup
Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2018
Posts: 5368
Location: Good Hope, GA
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2022 5:34 am Post subject: Re: Door Shimming |
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Hi there, I hacvent done my channels yet. They are original. The drivers side is rust free.
_________________
-'85 c10 5.3 LS, 222 cam, long tubes, x pipe, 3 inch spin tech's
-'05 B5.5 TDI Wagon 17in sport rims ;EGR + BSM + ASV Delete, Stage-2 Tune, straight pipe
'65 Tourist Delivery Build
'66 RIP
'69 RIP
Hosea 4:6 "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" |
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