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BarryL 
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Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14258
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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 Posted: Fri May 31, 2013 11:23 am Post subject: New fuel pump 40hp-1500 upgrade |
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Airtex makes a copy of the VW-Pierburg fuel pump. The 1070 is the correct one for pipe attachment but I prefer the 1071 as it's easier to remove in place.
Several companies sell them; this is one.
Here's what it looks like.
These pumps come with too much pressure and even a stack of gaskets won't lower the pressure enough.
At my wit's end trying to solve the high pressure problem I found this in the Bentley. It tells how the spring, if too strong, will be a problem: ah ha!
The pumps come with bad pipe attachments and flashing chips inside so it's best to disassemble them. The bottom end has to come apart to get to the diaphragm and spring. The fulcrum pin just knocks out with a light tap and a 16 penny nail.
This is the culprit sring that is too strong. Take it off by starting the winding over the lip and spin it off.
Here's the diaphragm and spring separated. Now you need a correct spring.
Find a good used original German Pierburg.
Here's the spring you're after. Take it off like the other one.
You can see the bad longer spring in this pic. OG spring is shorter and less strong but correct.
Put on the German spring doing the opposite of removal and pry it on at the last turn. Easy to do.
Now it's time to make the pipes safe as they come not safe. Pull them out with careful twist of pliers near the body and sand the ends with fine sand paper.
Sand the holes with a rolled up little piece of sandpaper.
Mix epoxy and toothpick it onto and into the sanded areas. Make sure the outlet pipe is aiming up. When it's almost cured poke a pipe-cleaner in there to clear possible ooze.
Here's the pipes all safe and cured.
Now it's time to install the improved diaphragm back into the pump. The rocker lays on top of the nylon which you'll see when you install it. The pin holds it all in there.
Nothing is wrong with the Airtex pin but the VW pins are a perfect fit and safer as they have circlips: one less thing to worry about.
Almost done but the diaphragm need to be preloaded to keep it from stretching at the holes and tearing. I use a block of wood set in a vise that will push up the lever 12 to 13mm. The book says 14mm but I've found these thick diaphragms don't like it.
Here it shows how much the diaphram gets pulled down prior to tightening the top chamber on.
Clamp the pump to the vise over the wood block if you don't have someone to hold it for you while you tighten the screws.
Fill the cavity with a strong blast of good grease. Not lithium grease.
There's your safer, correct pressure, new pump ready to install. I like to bench test them but that's up to you.
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Culito
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Joined: December 07, 2006
Posts: 5865
Location: Columbia Missourah
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2013 11:33 am Post subject: |
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Very nice writeup!! I might see if I can find one locally just to mess with it.
If you don't have a spare pump, can you cut down the spring it comes with, or maybe find one at a hardware store?
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2Pack
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Joined: September 20, 2005
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Location: Virginia
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2013 11:52 am Post subject: |
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Great info. Thanks. I never knew the spring could affect fuel pressure.
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chiroracer
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Joined: August 03, 2006
Posts: 332
Location: long beach
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2013 11:53 am Post subject: |
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I admire your attention to detail but for all that trouble, how about rebuilding the german unit?
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Erik G
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Joined: October 16, 2002
Posts: 13271
Location: Tejas!
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2013 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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| yeah, I was going to ask about that. Who has rebuild kits for a decent price that ships? I used to get them from WW, but they are out of stock. Might actually be cheaper to buy one of these locally and use the parts to fix the german one |
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Big Bill
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Joined: June 21, 2005
Posts: 1782
Location: Santa Rosa, Ca
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2013 12:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Nice write up BarryL, as was stated your attenion to detail is Awesome. |
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TinCanFab
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Joined: April 04, 2006
Posts: 2743
Location: Waterford, California
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EverettB
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Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69812
Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2013 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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Nice write up, I added it to the Bus FAQ.
| 2Pack wrote: |
| Great info. Thanks. I never knew the spring could affect fuel pressure. |
Little piece of trivia - the Type 3s used a pump with basically the same parts as a 1500cc pump but with a stronger spring. The spring is the same length as far as I know but is a thicker diameter wire.
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BarryL
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Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14258
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2013 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Culito wrote: |
| can you cut down the spring it comes with, or maybe find one at a hardware store? |
Personally, I wouldn't.
| chiroracer wrote: |
| how about rebuilding the german unit? |
The German ones can be interchanged anywhere with the Airtex. I'd put the Airtex top on the German bottom as it has nice valves.
| Erik G wrote: |
| Who has rebuild kits for a decent price that ships? I used to get them from WW |
The WW ones were junk. There's a guy on TheSamba that makes the diaphragms.
| EverettB wrote: |
| the Type 3s used a pump with basically the same parts as a 1500cc pump but with a stronger spring. |
I was going to post that these pumps are good for dual-carbed type 3s as is as they put out the required PSI but since it was in the type 2 threads I didn't. |
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EverettB
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Joined: April 11, 2000
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Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Fri May 31, 2013 11:08 pm Post subject: |
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| BarryL wrote: |
| Erik G wrote: |
| Who has rebuild kits for a decent price that ships? I used to get them from WW |
The WW ones were junk. There's a guy on TheSamba that makes the diaphragms. |
I've only used one kit personally and one in a pump someone rebuilt for me.
The main diaphragm worked fine in those.
I think you mean Ed Fall sells them? I haven't bought one but I would trust whatever he makes as better.
Some of the other WW kit parts were unusable:
At least these 2:
The valve on the bottom that the push rod presses against was totally different from my original and unusable.
The circular top seal... didn't, it's too small. I first grabbed a decent used one off another junk pump then bought some NOS ones off the site that a guy was selling.
If they are out of stock maybe they are making the right stuff now themselves... they have done that in past when things go out of stock.
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BarryL
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Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14258
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:45 am Post subject: |
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| EverettB wrote: |
I've only used one [Wolfsburg West (BL)]kit personally and one in a pump someone rebuilt for me.
The main diaphragm worked fine in those. |
Maybe "junk" was too harsh. All the Wolfsburg West parts are installable and almost do work. I bought six kits and only one was usable as safe. Should I post pictures?
I'd use the kit in a display vehicle that only needed to start once in a while but not in any cruiser.
| EverettB wrote: |
| I think you mean Ed Fall sells them? I haven't bought one but I would trust whatever he makes as better. |
From Ed Fall's website. I don't know if he'd do an individual diaphragm.
"The original diaphragm is restored by grinding off the rivet which secures the old gasket material, drilling and tapping a hole for a machine screw to install a new gasket. New diaphragm gaskets precisely cut to original dimensions from material of similar weight and performance characteristics are then fitted to the diaphragm post."
| EverettB wrote: |
| If they are out of stock maybe they are making the right stuff now themselves... they have done that in past when things go out of stock. |
That ^^^^^ is what I hope.
One more thing about the Airtex pumps is they have a bulletproof system to keep fuel from entering the crankcase in the event of a diaphragm leak. |
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Culito
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Joined: December 07, 2006
Posts: 5865
Location: Columbia Missourah
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| Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:22 am Post subject: |
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I bought one WW kit for a Pierburg and it was pretty much useless.
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Copyright CJ Industries, Inc.
'64 standard w/2.0L type 4
'62 bug
| johnnypan wrote: |
| ...dont pay no attention to Culito,he's a cornhole.. |
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EverettB
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Joined: April 11, 2000
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Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 5:02 pm Post subject: |
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| BarryL wrote: |
| EverettB wrote: |
I've only used one [Wolfsburg West (BL)]kit personally and one in a pump someone rebuilt for me.
The main diaphragm worked fine in those. |
Maybe "junk" was too harsh. All the Wolfsburg West parts are installable and almost do work. I bought six kits and only one was usable as safe. Should I post pictures? |
Photos would be fine but I'm mostly interested in what was not safe since you say that, for others to reference.
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BarryL
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Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14258
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 9:48 am Post subject: |
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| EverettB wrote: |
| Photos would be fine but I'm mostly interested in what was not safe since you say that, for others to reference. |
I want to take Wolfsburg West out of the equation as they may merely be distributing the same kit as other sites are selling so who knows where the kits originate. I like WW and all they do.
The fulcrum pin has a plating on it that is hiding the parent material which I have no idea the hardness but they do wear-in rapidly. They are well machined but the plating makes it a smidge oversize.
The fulcrum lever has a rough final face that could potentially destroy the pull-down contact although that remains to be seen.
The fulcrum lever's pin holes have shards from the forming that could fall off and enter the crankcase but it would be rare.
The diaphragms are so nice that it's a shame the rest is so shoddy. I even thought about removing the rubber and installing on a VW rod.
This is the most disconcerting area I believe. The diaphragm rod has this keeper formed on the top disc that has punched into the disc. If this fails in service then no more fuel will be pumped. Out of 6 kits this one was the best but still I wouldn't trust it. Perhaps all these concerns are just in my imagination.
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EverettB
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Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the heads up.
I agree on the fulcrum lever. I seriously was like WTF - this is garbage.
It also sits in a different spot when installed than an original, which I was concerned would affect the push rod and/or fuel pressure.
I agree that I don't think it's the "Wolfsburg West" kit - I think it's same kit every place is selling.
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FritzCP
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Joined: October 23, 2005
Posts: 463
Location: Wisconsin
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| Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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Very nice write up and tutorial, thank you BarryL. A couple more questions...
What is the height of the Airtex spring giving incorrect pressure, vs height of the pierburg VW pump spring giving correct pressure?
I just tore apart an airtex fuel pump as I had 4.5 lbs of fuel pressure. I also tore apart a vw one and the springs look identical. Perhaps the OG was rebuilt incorrectly in the past, I dont know if they are both right or both wrong.
Bentley says the stock fuel pressure should be about 1.5lbs, is this correct for the 28 PICT -1 carb? And about How much will each added gasket lower the fuel psi?
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BarryL
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Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14258
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 7:02 pm Post subject: |
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| volksheime wrote: |
| What is the height of the Airtex spring giving incorrect pressure |
Airtex on my wrong ones is 40mm or 1 5/8".
| volksheime wrote: |
| height of the pierburg VW pump spring giving correct pressure |
I don't have one out to measure right now but you can extrapolate from the photo?
If your wrong one is not 40mm then maybe Airtex fixed them?
| volksheime wrote: |
| Bentley says the stock fuel pressure should be about 1.5lbs, is this correct for the 28 PICT -1 carb? |
I go anywhere from 1-3psi. It doesn't take much to run a stock setup. Too high is where you run into flooding of the needle and seat.
| volksheime wrote: |
| And about How much will each added gasket lower the fuel psi? |
Depends. For me stack of 4 fat gaskets will take it down about 2 or 3psi depending on thickness and spring inside. Make sure your rod travel is within specs or it will all go gaflooey. |
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FritzCP
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Location: Wisconsin
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| Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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I just measured my airtex pump 1070 spring bought in 2010 and its 27mm (1 1/8") high as is the Vw pump spring. 1 thin gasket gave 4.5psi. I will put the push rod in spec and stack a few fat gaskets to see where it gets me. Thanks for the response, it helps a lot to trouble shoot and get it set up correctly.
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2Pack
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| Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:10 am Post subject: |
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Check the wire thickness too. That has a big effect on spring stiffness.
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BarryL
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Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14258
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 8:42 am Post subject: |
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| 2Pack wrote: |
| Check the wire thickness too. That has a big effect on spring stiffness. |
What he ^^^ said plus push on it and make a value judgment.
If the German spring is good I'd still put on that one. |
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