CB Performance black box

[Dale M.]

[trbugman]

[E4ODnut]

Nicely done!

[stan_tichomirov]

Got my Black Box last week and installed it promptly. I got the vacuum reference kit with it, too. It was pretty straight-forward.

I kept vacuum lines from each carb equal length, they connect to the tee fitting in the middle of the shroud then from there a line runs through the firewall and connects to the Black Box mounted inside the car.

On the 1/2 side carb, I ran into an issue of throttle arm hitting the shroud, so I had to file it a bit to clear:

I ran a cable from the coil so if I ever needed to bypass the Black Box and run on the distributor alone, I just move the distributor wire (green wire) from lead that goes to the Black Box to this cable:

My 009 distributor was easy to lock out using the provided washer. Everything was pretty straight-forward IMO, only step I'd stress is make sure you check timing with a timing light after you start the car to make sure your pulley reading matches the Black Box reading.

Here is my map I'm tinkering with now. Need to pull back timing in the 96 kpa / 2,000 RPM area due to some knock:

Awesome product so far, works just like advertized, easy to set up and figure out. Way to go, CB Performance -- thank you.

Stan
_________________
Aircooled.net
Jansen Enterprise
My 1835cc build
My budget 2276 build

[kikkegek]

I am experiencing some strange stuff I wanna share with you guys.

I have a Autogauge vacuum gauge in my dashboard and it read different values as the BB.

this one:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

BB Gauge
-2,2 VAC 0 inch
-12,2 VAC 15 inch
-9 VAC 12 inch
-15 VAC 18 inch
-17 VAC 22 inch

I have asked Mark from CBP about it and the manufacturer of the MAP sensor says that it is wel within the range of accuracy of the 5 BAR MAP sensor.

I was wondering if any of you guys have compared these values?



another thing is I found a bug in the timing table. During WOT runs the timing would jump from the right of the table to the left of the table, causing hesitation during acceleration. this was because the reading would go off the chart and therefor jump to the other side. it is solved by making sure you choose bounderies you will not reach during operation. I found out together with Mark, maybe there is a update by now that fixed it?


my last problem I am having is rough idle and hesitation during take off when the engine is warm. Iĺl start loosing connection to the black box and idle quality will become pretty bad. when I take of the first few feet are rough, then it smoothens out and runs fine....I have absolutely no clue what maybe causing it.

Do you guys have any tips?


What are you guys using for signal input for the Black Box?

[Dauz]

What'd you all use for the grounding points? Block? Body? Actually, if you could describe all your connections, that'd be excellent.

[bugeyesprite]

I am running the CB Black Box with the generic 10psi boosted map included with the software. The car runs quite well but I wish to modify it. I'm finding the instructions rather vague. I have never seen a spark map before so my questions may seem stupid to someone with experience.

Can some one tell me what all the buttons in the "edit spark map" area are for? They are labeled "Add", "Subtract", "Multiply", "Divide", "Fill", "Blend", "Undo" and "Send".

Also what is VR input delay?

I'm also wondering what the "cranking" button does in the main dashboard panel.

I did set my rev limit to 6000 rpm. That seemed pretty simple. The 2 step rev limiter is completely baffling to me.

I'm guessing that now I have set the ignition timing to match what it said in the generic spark table that I don't ever adjust the distributor again manually? But I'm only guessing. Is it all done from the laptop even if I develop my own spark table?

How do I make a spark table without having to be sitting in my running car?

[Porsche60]

[Porsche60]

[bugeyesprite]

Thanks Porsche60. That clears up a few of the items.

So now I'm faced with Setup> Main Setup and filling in one row of "MAP boundaries" and one row of "RPM boundaries" or clicking Edit>Spark Table and filling out 441 little boxes?

I'm not getting it.

[theDrew]

[bugeyesprite]

Sort of defeats the purpose of buying the thing for me Drew. I didn't see anything in the brochure about already knowing how to work the software. Just looking for a little help to figure it out.

[clonebug]

I have found that an engine will run on almost any ignition map.

Driving it will bring out the good and bad and it's up to you to play with it to find out what the engine likes best.

Start out with an idle of 8-12 degrees advance and 30 degrees at 3000 rpm and up and then play with it from there.

You just blend all the boxes in between.

On my MS-2 I just bump the boxes up and down in cruise and WOT and make it run the smoothest.

Without putting it on a dyno that can vary load which would simulate driving conditions you are just guessing.

All you can do is go for a drive and have a passenger play with the advance. You will be able to feel it in the throttle pedal and with MAP changes.

The only way you can get it optimized is if you can adjust fuel and spark at the same time since they affect each other.
More advance can require less fuel.

I know my advance map isn't perfect but it drives pretty nice for what it is.
_________________

[bugeyesprite]

Thanks clonebug. I have modified my distributor as far as I could with springs and weights and I just couldn't get much more out of it. I run 9 pounds boost and I was able to get pretty decent running but I wanted to incorporate boost retard so I bought the Black Box. I understand how timing works... I'm just struggling with the instructions that came with the Black Box.
You're right about getting the thing on a dyno to establish max torque/ timing. My fueling is pretty good. The A/F meter makes that pretty easy.

[clonebug]

Since you are turbo like me you will want to make sure you stay away from detonation.
The best way is to keep your inlet temps down with an intercooler or water injection and also retard advance with boost or a combo of the three.
I have a home made water injection system and it keeps my IAT's down to 125 degrees at 18 lbs boost.
I just checked my logs from yesterday.
I plan on bumping up the timing at full boost to see if I get a little more power.
_________________

[Porsche60]

[bugeyesprite]

Thanks Guys. I'm running a supercharger so boost happens very low in the rpm range. Makes timing very critical. I also run water/meth injection. It comes on at 4 psi or so.

I'm slowly getting a handle on this software.

I did get an explanation of VR delay. It is used to sync the Black Box timing to the engine. If the BB timing map says the timing is 32 degrees but your timing light says it is 30 degrees you use the VR delay value to make them agree.

Also "multiply" and "Divide" are not used... they are leftovers from a different application of the software. No word on what "cranking" is for.

I'm not sure why this info is not included in the instructions.

I will use actual vacuum/pressure data to set up the MAP row.

I'm a little concerned at the instructions warning to not change the lowest rpm value from 400 on the main map but the rpm/ MAP page starts at 550.

I love how we are adjusting MAP to make our map. Nothing confusing about that.(to the novice anyway)

[bugeyesprite]

"Caution:
you should have max MAP margin, more than your actual boost.
if boost exceeds the right side of the timing table,
it may read the left side of the table!"

I don't know what this means but I thank you for your helpfulness.

[bugeyesprite]

Have you guys figured out how to use the histogram? There is no mention of it in the instruction that I can find.

[Porsche60]