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1978 Type 4 Problems, Need Help!
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c.mitchell
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:24 pm    Post subject: 1978 Type 4 Problems, Need Help! Reply with quote

HI everyone, I am new to thesamba, new to VW world. I knew what I was getting into when I bought my 1978 Bus, but did not think I would only get as far as my driveway before it didnt start again.

Figured out that the ignition switch was bad, cutting power to the coil once engine starting turning over, replaced ignition switch and now I have spark at the plugs again. Fuel pump is working, but I do not know if the injectors are working.

I do notice that the mass airflow sensor's top is off and could have been tampered with, I have read that these are a pain if they are.

I even shot fuel, brake fluid, in the intake to ensure I was getting fuel, but nothing.

Any ideas where I should go next? I have spark and fuel but she wont start. Any experience ripping out fuel injection system and converting to duel carbs? I need all the help i can get.

Thanks!
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Red Fau Veh
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hold the flap open with a screwdriver in the air intake. See if it starts.
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aopisa
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 5:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hold off on ripping out the FI a little until you can get some help here in diagnosing the problem. Sometimes the fix is ridiculously simple.
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Randy in Maine
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it were me, I would first invest in a volt ohm meter and a $30 fuel pressure gauge. Hopefully you already have a Bentley manual.

Got this?

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/fuelinjection.php

While you are waiting for that stuff to arrive, confirm that you have a correct dwell angle if you are still using points. Then have a look at the igniton wires and the spark plugs to make sure everything is OK. Then look around for a major vacuum leak.

Keep in mind that you also have to have pretty close to 12 volts in the battery and 26 psi in the fuel rail for this thing to start. Clean and retighten the battery to starter cables and the grounds at the battery and the chassis ground (on the forward side of the transmission on the drivers side).

Report back what you find.
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Volkemon
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:10 am    Post subject: Re: 1978 Type 4 Problems, Need Help! Reply with quote

c.mitchell wrote:

I even shot fuel, brake fluid, in the intake to ensure I was getting fuel, but nothing.

....I have spark and fuel but she wont start...




If you indeed dumped brake fluid in the intake... may foul out plugs. Thats a new one to me.
You say 'shot' - maybe brake CLEANER was the 'fuel'. Some of the low VOC cleaners do not work well as starting fluid. Maybe invest in a small can of ether. (aka Starting Fluid)

and "" I have spark and fuel but she wont start "" - Compression is the other 'need' here also. It ran to get there, so we will HOPE it has not had some sudden mechanical failure. Smile

1) pull the plugs, or at least the easy to get ones. They look OK? not black and nasty, or dripping wet?

2) while the plugs are out, have someone crank the motor while you check for spark at the connector to the plug. You may have good spark off the coil wire, but make sure its getting to the end of the line.

3) Got a compression checker? Screw it in and check to see if you have compression. anything over 80 and it should start, though thats a low reading. No Comp Checker? if there is one local, Autozone/Advance Discount et al often let you use one if you leave a deposit, and you get it ALL back when you return the tool.

4) Ok... got plugs that look good, spark at the end of the wire, and compression? Spray a bit of Ether (or brake/carb cleaner if thats ALL you got...) into the intake manifold. the part right on top of the motor. Pulling off the Vacuum 'tee' by #4 cylinder is a great place to introduce the starting fluid. Just spraying it into the end of the snorkel often doesnt work, as the air filter takes a lot out. No more than a 2 sec spray. We just want to see if the engine 'poots' , not run it for long. Spray, replace the vacuum line, and try to start. You should be rewarded with a sputter/short run.

Runs? You now can concern yourself with the FI system. No sputter at all? Well... more diagnostics are needed.

Hope this gets you started (both the engine and in the VW world).


Do NOT be in a hurry to ditch the fuel injection. ANY question you may have on it has been covered here.
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aeromech
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you pulled a spark plug to see if it's flooded? You say you have spark now and have shot fuel into the intake but still don't get it to pop. Something should be happening.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clean or replace the plugs, and as others have suggested check for spark at the plug end of the wires. A couple of teaspoons of gasoline into the S boot should momentarily cough her to life if you have spark.
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c.mitchell
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the responses. Very helpful.

I tested the plugs again and they were fouled after all the attempts to start her up and all the brake cleaner shot in multiple times. Replaced the plugs and it started right up!

Now, when I tested the compressions it was all across the board. No. 1 tested at 120, no. 3 at 90, and no. 4 at 60. (no.2 was a pain to get to and my battery was going out). The battery was on its last leg which may explain the across the board readings?? I am going to adjust the valves and do another compression test.

Any help on at what compression point the motor is salvageable, and what compression point I should start looking for a replacement? I would like to eventually rebuild the motor in it, or is their a better conversion out there? I have a feeling this ones on its last leg. Burning crazy amts of oil.

Thanks!
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aeromech
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm pretty sure you have hydraulic lifters. So run the engine to pump them up good and then do the valve adjustment. Do your compression check with a fully charged battery and count to 10 while cranking for each check. Good compression would be 120 psi on all cylinders. What you're looking for is something out of that range like below 90. If you found 120, 120, 115, and 90 I would keep driving. If you found one much lower than 90 it would be tear down time.
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