Ghia Air Conditioning Install

[Mark33563]

The reason I inquired is that many people overlook that important tid bit: clearance between tires and equipment.

You do not want to go cruising and have the tire cut the line. Gets expensive to fix, recharge, etc.

[NOVA Airhead]

I routed my hose a bit differently to try to avoid the wheel if you can see it in these photos:

I also rerouted the driver's side air tube a bit:

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Ghia Owner Emeritus

[JuanLoman]

Can you please supply the wiring connections please? I have an A/C bpd and I need the connection diagram so I can hook it up, I would really appreciated if someone can provide, Thanks in advance

[22manybugs]

[22manybugs]

[22manybugs]

I thought my next post would be after charging the A/C system, but haven't got there yet. I did have something happen yesterday that I want to bring up so others can avoid the same problem:

Yesterday (Saturday 3/8/14) was the first day I could drive the car after mostly recovering from hurting my back (WooHoo, finally ! it was too painful to push in the clutch pedal the last two weeks), so I was driving it to do some errands. It was really warm yesterday, in the upper 80's deg-F. After leaving a store and pulling onto the road, the car suddenly stumbled - stumbled - then died. I'll try to keep it short - there was no gas in the carb bowl but the gas tank was 1/2 full. I disconnected the fuel line at the carb and ran it overboard, but no gas came out while cranking the starter. After adding some gas to the carb bowl, the car started back up and I drove home with no issues. Since the car ran fine afterward, the fuel pump seems to be okay. I think it was vapor-lock.

Good vapor-lock article in Wikipedia here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vapor_lock . From Wikipedia:
A vapor lock can also develop when the engine is stopped while hot and the vehicle is parked for a short period. The fuel in the line near the engine does not move and can thus heat up sufficiently to form a vapor lock. The problem is more likely in hot weather or high altitude in either case.

That sounds like exactly what happened to me.

I've never had a problem with vapor-lock on the car before, so started looking for something that had changed. The metal fuel line where it bends around the fan housing was resting directly on the intake manifold. I used to have it mounted in the fan housing clip where it's supposed to go, but could not fit it there with the A/C compressor. I think that's the cause of the problem. I moved the metal fuel line above the battery ground wire, wrapped that portion in rubber fuel line slit lengthwise for insulation, then in aluminum tape. I also wrapped the portion of the ground wire in aluminum tape, then supported both with a zip-tie to keep everything away from the intake manifold:

I tested it today (another hot day), got the engine good and hot, then let it heat-soak awhile, then drove it some more. The problem didn't repeat, so I hope that solved it. I really think the important item was keeping the fuel line from contacting the intake manifold; the rest might be unnecessary, but I'll take the extra steps if it lessens the chance of being stuck on the side of the road again.

I wanted to mention this so anyone else installing an A/C system can avoid the problem by keeping the fuel line away from the intake manifold.
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Lon

1969 Karmann Ghia convertible
1971 Westfalia camper

[22manybugs]

Answering some other topics that I've been meaning to get to:

Here's a picture from directly underneath showing the space between the A/C hose and tire on the front-right side. This is looking up along the tire into the wheel well. The tire is turned as close to the hose as I can get it. There's a fair amount of space and I don't see that the tire will ever rub against the hose.

Here's the knee space of the driver. I have more difficulty getting around the steering wheel, don't have any problem bumping the A/C blower housing. (I'm 6'0" tall.)

Here's the passenger side. Again, no problem; I would really have to slouch in the seat to bump into the housing.

In the passenger side, people with larger feet can get a foot behind the hoses in the right corner of the footwell. That's the only area that may have any interference with passengers.

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Lon

1969 Karmann Ghia convertible
1971 Westfalia camper

[22manybugs]

I forgot to add this update:

If you remember, the air conditioner pulley has one hex-head bolt that sits in one of the holes of the aluminum generator pulley so that the pulley doesn't slip. Well, that didn't last too long; the bolt broke after a few weeks without ever even turning on the compressor and loading the pulley. The engine started making a noise and I found out the a/c pulley was completely loose.

I realized when you torque the pulley bolt, friction tends to rotate the a/c pulley clockwise, moving the hex-head bolt away from the edge of the hole. Then belt load with the engine running tends to pull the pulley counterclockwise, loosening the pulley bolt then probably banging the hex-head bolt against the side of the hole until it snaps.

It doesn't seem that the small hex-head bolt would be able to take the load by itself. I finally decided to just drill two holes through both pulleys and bolt them together. Here's the front and back of the pulleys afterward:

The front was countersunk so that the bolt heads are flush. I also countersunk the nuts on the back, and drilled the hole just a little undersize then tapped-in the nuts with a hammer, so the nuts are restrained in the pulley. This should lock the pulleys together.
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Lon

1969 Karmann Ghia convertible
1971 Westfalia camper

[NOVA Airhead]

[22manybugs]

[OLD VW NUT]

Has any of you guys with the Gilmore AC taken off the air vents? I want to remove mine to widen those 'metering holes' as Gilmore calls them but I'm worried about how thin the housing unit is. I'd hate to break it. I'm not getting quite the air flow out of the vents that I think I should be getting with those two big fans under the dash unit. I'm getting nice cool air - just not as much as I'd like. It works fine up to about 85* - above that I need more air. I asked Gilmore about the size of those holes - his answer was that it keeps the coils from freezing up - apparently a 'new' design right when I bought mine a couple of years ago.

I had to go out and turn on the air without the car started. Just had to hear if those fans were working - they are. No rattles - yet. Never have heard the fans while driving but that might be because of the Mondo muffler. Kind of loud - but I like it.

I was gassing it up the other day and had a guy come over from another pump - remarked on what a beautiful car it was - then had to ask what it was. I showed him the Volkswagen script (block letters on a 71) - he was surprised and had never seen a VW that looked like that and had never heard of Karmann Ghia. He was under 40 I'm guessing.
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71 Ghia Coupe - stock body - no rust! Powered by a 2110 W/Dual HPMX 44's - Rancho Pro Street Transaxle - A/C by Gilmore

Other car - 2013 VW Golf TDI

[22manybugs]

[OLD VW NUT]

Thanks for posting that. When I talked to Ed last August he assured me it would work as made. I disagreed having driven in my 95+ degree weather here but he seemed to think he was right. Maybe he got a flood of calls after I called him. Maybe I should call him back.

I was thinking of just taking off the center two vents and using a hole saw just make a few more holes next to those metering holes. Maybe I'll modify mine like your's is. 4 quarter sized holes aren't adequate and Gilmore should have known that. I doubt they tested out the design change - nobody could be very happy with the air flow in anything above 80* IMO. Using the AC in 95* weather was better than an open window but not exactly as cool as I'd like it. The AC pump is adequate for a much larger interior volume than a Ghia - those two squirrel cage fans inside pump lots of volume but that restriction just doesn't allow for enough air flow.

Even with the air flow problem I'm having I'd still recommend this to anyone looking to install an AC unit. The parts all fit and the heat exchangers under the car are quiet from inside the car - they are noisy from outside but no more than any modern car with the AC on - it activates the fans and no fan is quiet.
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71 Ghia Coupe - stock body - no rust! Powered by a 2110 W/Dual HPMX 44's - Rancho Pro Street Transaxle - A/C by Gilmore

Other car - 2013 VW Golf TDI

[22manybugs]

You're welcome. Yeah, it sounds like you are experiencing the same issue I was having. If the A/C doesn't hardly help on 95+ degree days, it's not very useful. It does seem that Gilmore has modified the design and improved the airflow.

[OLD VW NUT]

I have four holes - no rectangular slots - just four quarter size holes.

This picture shows the size of the hole that Gilmore expected to meter the air through and be sufficient. There are four of them in total - each about the size of a quarter. I was skeptical when I saw that but Gilmore assured me there would be enough air flow to make me happy. I'm happy - to about 80* - past that not so much. The piece that broke off was damaged in shipping and was epoxied back on. It broke off in a single piece. The plastic is very fragile. IMO for the price I paid it should have been made from fiberglass. I was also one hose short of a full kit. Gilmore should check their kits before shipping for missing parts. I know I sound critical of Gilmore - and I am - but I've read some of the horror stories from people that have tried some of the other brands. My problems are minimal compared to some of those. Still and all - Gilmore could do better.

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71 Ghia Coupe - stock body - no rust! Powered by a 2110 W/Dual HPMX 44's - Rancho Pro Street Transaxle - A/C by Gilmore

Other car - 2013 VW Golf TDI

[22manybugs]

Okay, your vent assembly is different than mine. Not sure how much of my experience applies to your system. Maybe you could open up the metering holes to be similar to what I have, but since your assembly is different, I'm just guessing. It might be better to talk to Ed first.

Regarding the plastic material for the housing, it's flexible but seems to be durable. I've had the entire assembly installed and removed a few times with no problem, and I had no problem using a small hacksaw blade to cut the rectangular opening a little larger. You should be okay to open up the metering holes a bit.

I think the airflow in mine will be acceptable now, but once the weather turns warm again and I can test the system, if the airflow still doesn't seem great, my first step will be to open up the holes and slot a little further. I'm not worried about breaking the plastic in that case.
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Lon

1969 Karmann Ghia convertible
1971 Westfalia camper

[22manybugs]

Latest info:

Well, Murphy is alive and well! Apparently I over-torqued a couple of the fittings and damaged the O-rings. About two weeks ago on the first warm day, I turned the A/C on and got nothing but warm air. I took it to the shop to check out, they found the damaged O-rings, replaced them and refilled the refrigerant.

I asked the shop owner about how to properly torque the fittings, he said it should be just snug them down, then tighten them "nnntt" just a little more. ("Nnntt" is a small grunt - just a little!) He said everyone tends to overtighten them because they're big fittings that need big wrenches, so it's easy to overtighten. There are special short wrenches that people working on A/C often use so it's harder to overtorque, but most people use regular crescent/open-end wrenches.

I also opened up the rectangular slot a little more to get more air to the driver side - took off about 1/8" over the 7" long side (right up to the glue line), so that's a decent increase is cross-section. I'm really happy now with the volume of air coming out.

I checked the air temp coming out by sticking a meat thermometer into one of the vents; it averages about 36 deg. I tested the A/C on a day with mid-80's outside temp, it kept the car plenty cold such that I had to turn down the fan speed from the highest setting. I am waiting for a really hot day (over 95 deg) for one last test, but based on current results I'm expecting it to perform great.
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Lon

1969 Karmann Ghia convertible
1971 Westfalia camper

[NOVA Airhead]

[NOVA Airhead]

[OLD VW NUT]

I'm going to modify mine and add that rectangular hole - taking out at least one of those quarter sized holes in the process. Its going to be 85* here today - about the max temp where this AC unit works well. Next month and into about mid-September is another story. Temps average 90* and above so I need to do something with it if I intend to drive it - and I intend to do just that in about 15 minutes - its time for a round of golf. The thermostat was coiled up and stuffed inside the air box - my understanding is the thermostat needs to be in contact with the evap coils to prevent icing up. Even where it is now it cycles the compressor - I can hear it clicking on and off while driving. Not sure what to do with that since it already 'works'.

Gilmore should have stuck with what works. Mine 'works' but only because a nephew and I had the time and equipment to be able to modify the compressor mount so it wouldn't interfere with the dual carb linkage. Gilmore seemed adamant about the kit clearing the linkage for dual 44mm carbs (HPMX - same as Weber 44 IDF) but I'm wondering if he actually mounted his kit on a car equipped with these carbs. There is nothing different between the HPMX and IDF setups.

And I'm still not happy having to spend $60 out of pocket for a hose that should have been included.
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71 Ghia Coupe - stock body - no rust! Powered by a 2110 W/Dual HPMX 44's - Rancho Pro Street Transaxle - A/C by Gilmore

Other car - 2013 VW Golf TDI