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glutamodo The Android
Joined: July 13, 2004 Posts: 26315 Location: Douglas, WY
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Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:07 pm Post subject: Is it time to allow larger dimension photos in the Gallery? |
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Everett suggested I start a thread here asking this question. In another thread I said... well here's the quote:
glutamodo wrote: |
This is from the Gallery, and it's a 1600-pixel-wide image. I kind of wish there was a special 1920-pixel-wide category for desktop images, as that's what this image was for me before I had to downsize it to comply with Gallery requirements. (so, click on the image to enlarge to full size)
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EverettB wrote: |
If you want to submit it for a desktop image, I can add it HERE
Or if you think it's time to enlarge the max. size in the Samba gallery, start a thread in the Site Forum for feedback. |
Actually, since the Forum automatically resizes down to 750 pixels wide, I tend to keep images I intend for Forum use under that size most of the time, as I've seen it when images look pretty cruddy after that resize happens. However for some things, such as desktop images and fine-detail images, it might be nice to go up to larger dimensions. 1920 or 2400 pixels wouldn't be bad. I don't think there is a need to change the file size limit though, it's at 4 Megabytes now, which is plenty enough for jpgs that size.
Any comments?
-Andy |
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Clatter Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2003 Posts: 7537 Location: Santa Cruz
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Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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Having the pics be any larger wastes bandwidth/storage/time/money.
Some people are still on dial-up, and the pics uploaded are too big for them as it is... _________________ Bus Motor Build
What’s That Noise?!? |
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glutamodo The Android
Joined: July 13, 2004 Posts: 26315 Location: Douglas, WY
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Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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Depends on what you are using the Gallery for. I don't put much in there for direct display in the Forums. I use my own FTP space to store most of that kind of material and I always make those images as tiny as possible. I do get annoyed when someone puts images in Forum posts that are several times larger than they need to be. However the Gallery is used for more than just Forum images, and it's for those that I was suggesting larger images be allowed. And if people are smart about how they save their images - ie, use more jpg compression and make them "progressive" format, a lot of file size can be saved at little detriment to image quality. The problem with that is, is that most people don't know or care to learn how to do those things.
-Andy |
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Clatter Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2003 Posts: 7537 Location: Santa Cruz
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Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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Users...
If you can make the management of them automatic,
Then so much the better.
Not everybody has their own FTP server...
_________________ Bus Motor Build
What’s That Noise?!? |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69813 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 10:28 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, it could be an issue for people if we allowed huge images in the Gallery when viewing a Forum thread with tons of photos.
I already have trouble loading some threads at mobile locations with "high speed" internet compared to my home.
But if it makes sense to move up from 1600 max. per side to something a bit larger I am open to it.
For reference, you do not have to resize your photos down to 1600 pixels before uploading, the gallery will resize them if they are larger.
In terms of hosting photos elsewhere I recommend against that in almost all cases due to the massive "dead links" in old threads here.
glutamodo has his reasons but I admit he is one of the people where I am afraid one day every photo he has posted will be dead one day, which would be a serious hit to TONS of threads as his contribution to this Forum is massive and greatly appreciated. _________________ How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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glutamodo The Android
Joined: July 13, 2004 Posts: 26315 Location: Douglas, WY
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Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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EverettB wrote: |
glutamodo has his reasons but I admit he is one of the people where I am afraid one day every photo he has posted will be dead one day, which would be a serious hit to TONS of threads as his contribution to this Forum is massive and greatly appreciated. |
Thanks Everett. I know exactly what you mean. The main reason I've continued to use my "bonus FTP" space as part of my trainorders.com membership, is that I have complete control over it. If I want to replace an image, I can, and I have done so many times over the years. That is impossible with theSamba Gallery. At least a couple of times I've had to ask (Everett) to delete images from my Gallery that I found to have inaccuracies that needed correcting.
I do intend to keep my Trainorders account going as long as possible. When I started to post images, I had not idea it would snowball into what I have now. Once upon at time, I also used a "members.aol.com" FTP space as well, but then AOL axed that service, and yes I ended up with some dead links, but that was mostly before I was very active on theSamba.
Oh, I always manually resize the larger photos I've put in the Gallery, somehow I don't know if I trust the auto-resize function after seeing how poorly some Forum-resized images turn out. Probably just paranoia on my part though!
-Andy |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69813 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2014 8:42 am Post subject: |
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glutamodo wrote: |
Oh, I always manually resize the larger photos I've put in the Gallery, somehow I don't know if I trust the auto-resize function after seeing how poorly some Forum-resized images turn out. Probably just paranoia on my part though! |
Yes, there is no problem with you doing this and your resizing is most likely superior to what the Gallery does. On my own computer I often resize my images too and I've noticed one of my imaging programs does a lot better job of resizing than another one. The photos come out clearer.
The Forum thread resizing is not actually resizing the source photo in a permanent manner, it's just resized by your browser to fit the page so if it looks bad this is a function of the web browser and not the site. _________________ How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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John Moxon Samba Moderator
Joined: March 07, 2004 Posts: 13952 Location: Southampton U.K.
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Posted: Fri Feb 14, 2014 10:00 am Post subject: |
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There are a couple of reasons I don't favour going to a larger size than 1600 pixels.
1. Is as already noted the speed of download for those on slower connections and
2. My paranoia of supplying high res pictures whereby the unscrupulous can lift pictures from The Samba, print them and sell them on Ebay. It has happened to me already. Nobody is going to make a fortune out of my pictures but I did piss me off.
I too would love Andy to upload his personal Gallery to The Samba but I think it would probably occupy his every waking moment for several months to do it. _________________ John.
Judson Supercharger Information on The Samba
My 1958 Shorrock Supercharged Karmann Ghia
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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Mobiltune Samba Road Ranger
Joined: April 16, 2008 Posts: 499 Location: San diego county
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Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 1:04 am Post subject: |
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I say keep the 1600 pixel max and drop the max file size
some pages in the forums load really slow (pic heavy... non optimized photos)
Desktop Backgrounds by glutamodo... very nice _________________ Roadster Bus |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69813 Location: Phoenix Metro
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glutamodo The Android
Joined: July 13, 2004 Posts: 26315 Location: Douglas, WY
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Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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Oh, I thought by "drop the max file size" he was agreeing with my comment that 4MB was too high and should be reduced.
For Jpgs, I don't see any reason for there to be any more than a 1 or 1.5 Mb limit. For uncompressed formats, like bmp (which I don't even really use any more) then yeah, a larger file size. But even in my folder of 1920 pixel desktop images the largest one (an image of a detailed, non-VW painting) is only 875KB.
-Andy |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69813 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 9:45 am Post subject: |
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Yes, that is correct for a desktop upload.
The 4MB is to accommodate smart phone/tablet uploads where the user cannot do a resize/save as... the images to a smaller size and to add compression in order to shrink the file size.
In that case the images are larger than 1600x1600 as well but the site will resize them down to that size as a maximum, if needed. _________________ How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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Mobiltune Samba Road Ranger
Joined: April 16, 2008 Posts: 499 Location: San diego county
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Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 12:51 am Post subject: |
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Yes smaller file size
"Oh, I thought by "drop the max file size" he was agreeing with my comment that 4MB was too high and should be reduced. "
A screen cap of desk top all monitors, best jpeg seting 254.55 KB
The jpeg file is a fairly lite format.
I wonder if there is a way to "GET"( retrieve the image from the server) then on the fly convert to the forum "size" (thumbnail?) 750x?
750 pixels wide,
instead of client side download of the whole file then browser script (java) resize.......spent some time here looking in to it.../www.phpbb.com/search/?q=resize
644kb well it was resized by thesamba so it now 266k.
If uploaded as .bmp (windows bitmap) size would be around 6mb
"The 4MB is to accommodate smart phone/tablet uploads where the user cannot do a resize/save as... the images to a smaller size and to add compression in order to shrink the file size."
I have an HTC and it shipped with imaging apps
Ok
ongoing editing ...... _________________ Roadster Bus
Last edited by Mobiltune on Sat Mar 08, 2014 5:11 am; edited 4 times in total |
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glutamodo The Android
Joined: July 13, 2004 Posts: 26315 Location: Douglas, WY
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Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 12:57 am Post subject: |
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When Everett explained though, it does make sense for those people who just cannot be bothered to edit their photos, and are posting large original megapixel images. I mean, I certainly know better than that, but I've run in many people who just don't comprehend the enormous file size photo they took is wrong. For an upload that will get resized down to a decent file size at 1600 pixels, then yes I can agree with the 4MB limit.
-Andy |
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Mobiltune Samba Road Ranger
Joined: April 16, 2008 Posts: 499 Location: San diego county
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Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 1:45 am Post subject: |
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Yes can't be bothered to reduce file size smartphone users.
1 never had to go online at 28k speeds
2 never owned a 1.2 megapixel camera that's like 600x400 px
3 just got new phone has crazy resolution camera, 6Mb 4G internet access
4 can shoot,post and review their post in under 3 sec
Whatever..... The Samba is going to change from a 4:3 format to 16:9 or 9:16
(hahaha thats about the size of the "edit post" box.)
The point of image reduction, is to make most of the samba users time here enjoyable and productive.
I am looking for a way to maximize the gallery* post fie size and minimize the forum viewing size, this has 2 major advantages.
1 maximizes the through-put for all users (forum pages load faster)
2 reduces the bandwidth used (most phones have usage caps .25, .5, 1, 2, Gb )
* Some people like to have the ability to look at and or use hires photos.
This has a down side as-well some scamers like to steal our photos and use them for their scams _________________ Roadster Bus
Last edited by Mobiltune on Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
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John Moxon Samba Moderator
Joined: March 07, 2004 Posts: 13952 Location: Southampton U.K.
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Mobiltune Samba Road Ranger
Joined: April 16, 2008 Posts: 499 Location: San diego county
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Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:44 am Post subject: |
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My other concerns are the use of "offsite" images, and the almost total failure of some threads after say 2 years. and I will use this picture to illustrate use of the smartphone gen with this pic
The stickers on your bus....
.photobucket albums Mobile Uploads
_________________ Roadster Bus |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69813 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 8:02 am Post subject: |
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Mobiltune wrote: |
I wonder if there is a way to "GET"( retrieve the image from the server) then on the fly convert to the forum "size" (thumbnail?) 750x? 750 pixels wide
instead of client side download of the whole file then browser script (java) resize |
I understand what you are saying but I'm not going to grab images from other sites and store them here. I doubt that is even possible in all cases since most external sites don't want people being able to steal the content.
glutamodo wrote: |
When Everett explained though, it does make sense for those people who just cannot be bothered to edit their photos, and are posting large original megapixel images. I mean, I certainly know better than that, but I've run in many people who just don't comprehend the enormous file size photo they took is wrong. For an upload that will get resized down to a decent file size at 1600 pixels, then yes I can agree with the 4MB limit. |
Correct. For phone users, it's not a matter of being bothered, it's a matter of ease and the fact that most phone users don't have an App or the knowledge to do it.
In terms of the Gallery here and allowing larger images than 1600 pixels but still keeping the Forums fast, there could be another 750 wide version saved in the Gallery, same as it makes a thumbnail image, but I haven't seen a reason to add that complexity. All the Forum-posted images would have to be changed to be the 750 pixel image that links to the larger image instead of a link to the original.
BMP uploads are not allowed. _________________ How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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Mobiltune Samba Road Ranger
Joined: April 16, 2008 Posts: 499 Location: San diego county
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Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 8:54 am Post subject: |
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EverettB wrote: |
Mobiltune wrote: |
I wonder if there is a way to "GET"( retrieve the image from the server) then on the fly convert to the forum "size" (thumbnail?) 750x? 750 pixels wide
instead of client side download of the whole file then browser script (java) resize |
I understand what you are saying but I'm not going to grab images from other sites and store them here. I doubt that is even possible in all cases since most external sites don't want people being able to steal the content.
glutamodo wrote: |
When Everett explained though, it does make sense for those people who just cannot be bothered to edit their photos, and are posting large original megapixel images. I mean, I certainly know better than that, but I've run in many people who just don't comprehend the enormous file size photo they took is wrong. For an upload that will get resized down to a decent file size at 1600 pixels, then yes I can agree with the 4MB limit. |
Correct. For phone users, it's not a matter of being bothered, it's a matter of ease and the fact that most phone users don't have an App or the knowledge to do it.
In terms of the Gallery here and allowing larger images than 1600 pixels but still keeping the Forums fast, there could be another 750 wide version saved in the Gallery, same as it makes a thumbnail image, but I haven't seen a reason to add that complexity. All the Forum-posted images would have to be changed to be the 750 pixel image that links to the larger image instead of a link to the original.
BMP uploads are not allowed. |
I wonder if there is a way to "GET"( retrieve the image from thesamba server) then on the fly convert to the forum "size" (thumbnail?) 750x? 750 pixels wide
what kind of disk space is involved Gb? or Tb
For phone users, it's not a matter of being bothered, it's a matter of ease and the fact that most phone users don't have an App or the knowledge to do it.
moot (does not mean diddlysquat) thesamba will re-size any uploaded file (jpeg)to about 300kb max _________________ Roadster Bus |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69813 Location: Phoenix Metro
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Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 9:09 am Post subject: |
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Mobiltune wrote: |
I wonder if there is a way to "GET"( retrieve the image from thesamba server) then on the fly convert to the forum "size" (thumbnail?) 750x? 750 pixels wide
what kind of disk space is involved Gb? or Tb |
Yes but on the fly would be undesirable as that would be a huge load on the server doing all those conversions.
If I did that I would store another version in the Forum width for every photo in the gallery as it is uploaded, same as storing the little thumbnail image for each entry.
I'm not sure what the disk space would be involved but that is probably not a concern. It's GB, not TB. All of the full size images right now are around 250GB.
I don't see an overriding reason to do this though, unless I opened up the Gallery to images much larger than 1600x1600. _________________ How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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