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KingmanGhia
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2014
Posts: 11
Location: Los Angeles
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 Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 7:33 pm Post subject: Car will only occasionally start? |
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Hello,
I have a 1641 dp with a 34pict single carb that was recently rebuilt for my pretty much stock 66' coupe. Upon trying to start the car, sometimes it will start, sometimes it will not. It seems to be firing some spark, but will not finally engage. After I have driven it for 10+ miles it will not start up either. It always turns over, and the gas flow, grounds, fuses, and connections are good. The first few times this has happened I replaced the coil with a brand new one and it would start up. The coil does seem to get very hot even if the engine has only been running for a few minutes, even with the new ones.
I then replaced the distributor wires and cap, and did the timing and valves along with that.
It seems as though if it starts up like a regular car, then if it cuts out at stop signs due to it still being cold it will not turn back on.
But as soon as I get on the road and drive it, its fine and idles smoothly.
Some days it starts up fine, some days it does not.
Can anyone help me? |
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OLD VW NUT
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Joined: February 23, 2011
Posts: 2776
Location: High Desert of Washington 98823
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| Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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Did you gap the points? Points that are too close will cause the coil to heat up - coils do run hot but should take some time to get there.
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71 Ghia Coupe - stock body - no rust! Powered by a 2110 W/Dual HPMX 44's - Rancho Pro Street Transaxle - A/C by Gilmore
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KingmanGhia
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2014
Posts: 11
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 10:41 am Post subject: |
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| OLD VW NUT wrote: |
| Did you gap the points? Points that are too close will cause the coil to heat up - coils do run hot but should take some time to get there. |
I just gapped the points to the correct measurement today, and they are pretty new as well. Now there is even less spark, and it just turns over and over without ignition. |
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Era Vulgaris
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Joined: August 22, 2012
Posts: 1678
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:05 am Post subject: |
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You didn't mention the rotor. Has that been replaced?
Are the plugs in good shape, and gapped correctly?
If you're absolutely 100% sure you've got fuel flow, then it's got to be an issue somewhere in your ignition system.
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KingmanGhia
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2014
Posts: 11
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Era Vulgaris wrote: |
You didn't mention the rotor. Has that been replaced?
Are the plugs in good shape, and gapped correctly?
If you're absolutely 100% sure you've got fuel flow, then it's got to be an issue somewhere in your ignition system. |
Replaced the rotor, and got nothing.
The spark plugs all get spark, and I know the fuel system is fine because if it turns on those few times, then it idles and drives for miles nicely.
But as of now the engine simply turns over without igniting. The coil does seem to not get as hot as quickly anymore after fixing the points gap. |
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CiderGuy
Samba Member
Joined: December 23, 2013
Posts: 1351
Location: Bucks County, Pa
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| Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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| KingmanGhia wrote: |
| Era Vulgaris wrote: |
You didn't mention the rotor. Has that been replaced?
Are the plugs in good shape, and gapped correctly?
If you're absolutely 100% sure you've got fuel flow, then it's got to be an issue somewhere in your ignition system. |
Replaced the rotor, and got nothing.
The spark plugs all get spark, and I know the fuel system is fine because if it turns on those few times, then it idles and drives for miles nicely.
But as of now the engine simply turns over without igniting. The coil does seem to not get as hot as quickly anymore after fixing the points gap. |
Check the ground and your battery. Look for any bare wire that might come into contact with metal grounding out the electric system, and stopping the car. |
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Brassneck
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Joined: November 17, 2012
Posts: 420
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 1:45 pm Post subject: |
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| x2, I had a similar issue...that turned out to be a loose points wire (- from the coil) touching the inside of the distributor. This loose connection allowed the car to crank all it wanted, but wouldn't fire. |
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KingmanGhia
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2014
Posts: 11
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 4:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Brassneck wrote: |
| x2, I had a similar issue...that turned out to be a loose points wire (- from the coil) touching the inside of the distributor. This loose connection allowed the car to crank all it wanted, but wouldn't fire. |
Yup I checked that and all of the above; grounds, loose wires, and rotor. Still nothing. |
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c21darrel
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Joined: January 22, 2009
Posts: 8211
Location: San Dimas
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| Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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condensers rarely fail...but here is how to check them.
Remove distributor cap.
First, make sure the condensor is connected to the points properly.
Turn crankshaft until the points are fully open (any cylinder).
Disconnect the LT (green) wire from the coil.
Connect a test lamp wire to the ignition coil terminal and the other lead to the distributor wire.
Switch on the ignition. If the lamp lights, the condensor is grounded internally and must be replaced.
Now reconnect the distributor wire to the coil.
Pull the main high tension wire from the coil, and with the ignition on, turn the engine over. The spark should jump a 1/4 inch gap to earth. If it won't jump this distance, replace the condensor.
Are you sure you are getting fuel all the way to carb? and its shooting down into it? Use a mirror to look down throat, confirm good shot of fuel.
Tried a blast of ether? 
Have you done any other maintenance lately that could have a effect?
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Kmolenda
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Joined: June 18, 2013
Posts: 309
Location: Cottage Grove Mn
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| Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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| The ign system is pretty simple. I'm in agreement with a loose wire / bad connection idea. Dumb question, but is the cap on all the way and not cracked? I've had that one get me with new caps before. I would definitely verify spark by pulling the plugs and just turning the car over, see what color the spark is, if any. I'm also thinking you may be dumping gas after it stalls and fouling out whatever spark there is. Is the shutoff solenoid thing working? |
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KingmanGhia
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Joined: March 14, 2014
Posts: 11
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2014 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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Heres an update:
The car will no longer start, except for when I install a brand new coil. Then it runs fine for a few drives before hesitating during driving and eventually dying. Does that help narrow it down? |
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SoCalJes
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Joined: November 02, 2011
Posts: 1093
Location: Broward, FL
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 6:57 am Post subject: |
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are you maybe using a 6 volt coil in a converted 12 volt system??? Sounds like it runs until your coil burns out...
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Jesse
71 Ghia
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Just because it didn't come that way, doesn't mean it shouldn't have. |
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32634
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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KingmanGhia
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2014
Posts: 11
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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| djkeev wrote: |
Coil wired backwards?
Carb shut off solonoid wire grounding?
Back up light wire grounding?
These wires touching ground will be like turning off the key.
Dave |
No, everything is wired correctly, one negative to the distributor, one positive to the carb, one to the front harness, and one to the electric fuel pump. No back up light; the tranny is a 66'.
How many volts are supposed to get to the coil? When the wire that goes to the front of the car is unattached, it reads 11 volts, and as soon as I plug it into the coil I get a reading of 9.5 for my flamethrower coil and 10.5 for a brand new coil that has never been installed before. Is this normal? And if not, what could be causing it? |
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carl4x4
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Joined: March 20, 2012
Posts: 679
Location: United Kingdom
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32634
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Kmolenda
Samba Member
Joined: June 18, 2013
Posts: 309
Location: Cottage Grove Mn
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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| I had a real problem with several flame thrower coils on a 350 it would do the same thing you had going on. After the third one I went back to a napa coil and it worked flawlessly. But your voltage readings or not where the should be. Like stated before run a jumper from the battery and try that, then backtracked the source of your drop. |
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djkeev
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Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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kingkarmann
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Joined: November 05, 2003
Posts: 4114
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:34 am Post subject: |
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Are you measuring point gap with a gauge and a dwell meter. I have never had any luck setting the gap with a feeler gauge alone. Once the points have a few miles on them one side will develop a bump where they arc making it impossible to accurately set them by a feeler gauge alone. The dwell is set at idle 47°±3°.
Bigger gap = less dwell angle
Smaller gap + more dwell
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danielsan
Samba Member
Joined: September 18, 2008
Posts: 802
Location: Carson City, NV
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Try swaping out the 34 pict idle cutoff valve make -- install and give it good twist with your hand, not with a wrench. Common culprit with cars that stop running at stop signs. Good luck. |
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