What are these chunks I found in my oil screen?

[Teastberg]

I was changing the oil in my 72 westy for the first time since I've owned it and the screen is full of what appears to be little crushed up washers of some sort. They aren't magnetic and are quite brittle...any ideas on what they are? If I put them together the inside diameter ends up around a quarter inch.

[Glenn]

Valve stem seals.
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Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"

Member #1009

#BlueSquare

[Teastberg]

ah thanks! Searched those and found the answer i was hoping to get but didnt expect. back on the road!

[candyman]

[Wildthings]

[Desertbusman]

You've got a fantastic engine! Just like the human body rejecting strange items that don't belong. Your engine purged out parts that shouldn't have been there to begin with.

Our horizontal engines prefer not to have valve seals that hinder lubrication of valve stems and guides. So they got hard, brittle and broke up. And the pieces washed out of the rocker boxes and got flushed down the pushrod tubes and into the sump. Thankfully your suction strainer prevented the bigger pieces from getting into the pump.
I'd sure pull the valve covers and check to see if there are any remaining pieces of the broken or not yet broken hard rubber seals. There are probably more pieces still in the bottom of the case sump. No problem providing they stay in the bottom or get washed into the strainer where you can remove them. Apart from that I don't think there is really anything else you can do.

Time to get back on the road where buses belong.
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71 Superbug
71 Westy

[williamM]

X2- First build for the dealership- I was told to leave those in the gasket box.
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some days I get up and just sit and think. Some days I just sit.

opinion untempered by fact is ignorance.

Don't step in any!

[airschooled]

[Wildthings]

[Desertbusman]

^^^Ditto^^^

Inline and V OHV engines have their valves vertical or at least in an upward orientation. Oil working it's way down the clearance between the valve stems and guides ends up in the intake port to be drawn into the combustion chambers. Depending on how much clearance and wear it can result in substantial oil consumption. So those engines really need the stem seals and with the vertical valve orientation they still get good lubrication.

Gravity doesn't draw excess oil into our horizontal guides and stems so no real concerns or need for seals to prevent high oil consumption. But we do need the lubrication, that's for sure. Guides do wear and they wear quicker than most other wear items on our engines.

Instead of why did VW call for deleting seals the bigger question might be why they had them in the first place. It probably has all to do with changes in gasoline and oil formulations. And maybe the timeline had to do with the timing of the elimination of leaded gas. The lead had been the lubrication the guides needed. With the elimination of that lead lubrication the material composition of the guides has changed accordingly. And as a result probably the new material guides do need the oil lubrication that stem seals would prevent.

Currently we seldom hear it but just a very few years ago the requirement for non-leaded heads was talked about all the time. All head rebuilders and parts suppliers switched to unleaded valve guides. When buying heads these days we seldom hear of heads or head rebuilding being advertised as lead free compatable. In reality there are probably very few "leaded" heads in use anymore.

What was VW's published reason? That would be interesting.
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71 Superbug
71 Westy

[udidwht]

Get rid of the stock adjuster screws and nuts and throw in some Porsche swivel adjusters and you nearly eliminate all the wear introduced onto them from the stock set up which had increased side loads on the valve stems.
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1972 Westy Hardtop/Type-4 2056cc
96mm Biral AA P/C's~7.8:1CR
Headflow Masters New AMC 42x36mm heads w/Porsche swivel adjusters
71mm Stroke
73 Web Cam w/Web solids
Dual 40mm IDF Webers - LM-2 - 47.5 idles/125 mains/190 air corr./F11 tubes/28mm Vents - Float height 10.45mm/Drop 32mm
Bosch SVDA w/Pertronix module (7.5 initial 28 total @ 3400rpm)
Bosch W8CC plugs
Pertronix Flamethrower 40K coil
S&S 4-1 w/Walker QP 17862
3 rib 002 Trans
185R14 Hankook tires

[Desertbusman]

[old DKP driver]

I call B.S on Valve Stem Seals coming in a VW factory gasket set for any model.

I not only was a tech when the type-4 engine was brand New in the U.S. but,
also did some of the 1st tear downs for bad camshaft to lifter warranty in 1971 and WE kept the seals in the "UNIT ROOM" and not in the parts department.

There was NEVER a V.W.O.A. gasket set for type4 engine in the dealer parts
dept.

As for changing valve adjusting screws to Porsche swivel feet. A little more is needed than just the swapping of parts. Since the rocker needs to have 0.60 removed FIRST in order for the swivel feet to work.

The stem seals as DBM and Wildthings said were really a joke and didn't last long on the intake stems. and were deleted.
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V.W.owner since 1967

[udidwht]

[old DKP driver]

Udidwht, What I said was that the stem seals did not come in a factory
gasket kit.

You either kept them in the engine room or walked over to the parts department to get them. We had bins for gaskets & misc. items.

Yes they came on VW engines as far back as the 1950's and also factory
rebuilt engines.
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V.W.owner since 1967

[Wildthings]

[williamM]

[williamM]

[old DKP driver]

William, You are right on about the Rabbit problem as we did the campaign to
replace the valve stem seals and pull the carb replace needle & seats
re-drill a passage way in the carb and gasket and replace the rubber mount.
on the 1975 rabbits and late 74 dashers as well.

They were really a piece of shit and only became better with the introduction of CIS.

AS for the cam&lifter problem this was on only a small amout of the 1971 411 models and the Dealer where I worked in Orange county, CA.did our
share of them This was a metallurgy problem with the hardness of the lifters mushrooming.

It was at least 2 years later before a gasket kit was introduced for a type-4
engine. So, you took the work order to the parts dept. and got individual gaskets that were needed.

The water cooled cars really took their toll not only on me but quite a few of
older techs. (Warranty Repairs) paid terribly and I finally left and went to
Porsche in1978
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V.W.owner since 1967

[williamM]