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pat72
Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2014
Posts: 5
Location: France
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 Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 5:36 am Post subject: Manxter Exhaust ? |
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Hi all
Most of VW powered MANXTERs come with the basic Empi Dual Outlet exhaust or the Manx sidewinder. But both are loud, very loud...
I am looking for a QUIET exhaust to install on a street Manxter powered by a 2.0 liters type 1 VW engine...
I saw the TRI-MIL Bobtail (Baja Quiet) :
There are also all the street sidewinders available :
I will be very happy to have your feedback about about the possibility of installation of the exhaust on the Manxter and particularly issues of interference with the rear bumper of the Manxter |
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manxdavid
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2003
Posts: 1841
Location: David Jones, Anglesey, North Wales, UK. Manxclub #678.
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 5:58 am Post subject: |
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I run a Manx Sidewinder and no-way would I call it loud. One of the main causes of exhaust noise is not muffler/header style but camshaft overlap. The wilder the cam the 'raspier' the exhaust note.
I wouldn't say that my Sidewinder was any louder than the Tri-Mill quiet pack that it replaced. |
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BL3Manx
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2006
Posts: 6767
Location: Northern California
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 6:56 am Post subject: |
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Another option is to replace whatever muffler that's on the Sidewinder/Tri-Mil (probably a glass pack) with a modern muffler such as a carbon fiber Hayabusa motorcycle type.
It might mean welding a flange to the collector to mount the muffler. Start with a raw muffler and have it ceramic coated after.
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pat72
Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2014
Posts: 5
Location: France
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 7:53 am Post subject: |
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@manxdavid :
Yes I agree with you. It also depends on the compression ratio of the engine.
A low comp. mexico 1600 cc won't be loud, even with the Manx exhaust.
BTW I think that you agree that the Manx muffler cannot (physically) have the same noise reduction system (it's a small muffler)
@BL3Manx :
Actually, the Manx exhaust is not available with flange, the muffler is welded.
I was told that motorcycle exhausts are not a good option for VW engines because our motors have more CC than motorcycles and they cannot void all the gaz volume on a strong VW engine (there are not a lot of 1600cc + motorbikes !)
Any feedback with the Bobtail on a Manxter ? |
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LeeVW
Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2006
Posts: 1016
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 8:42 am Post subject: |
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I had a Manx Sidewinder on my 1600, and I considered it obnoxiously loud. Stock carb, cam, everything. I had a Supertrapp welded onto the end, but it still made too much noise. I eventually replaced the Sidewinder with an EMPI Baja style exhaust with Quiet Pack muffler, and the noise was dramatically reduced. A side benefit was low end power went up considerably.
Lee |
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wvbowtieman
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Joined: September 16, 2010
Posts: 195
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 9:02 am Post subject: |
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I run the Tri Mill 1.50" with the quiet pack muffler. Idles and cruises with a nice tone but gets just a little aggressive when you open it up. I run a 1835 with 110 Engle cam.
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manxdavid
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2003
Posts: 1841
Location: David Jones, Anglesey, North Wales, UK. Manxclub #678.
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 9:12 am Post subject: |
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| wvbowtieman wrote: |
I run the Tri Mill 1.50" with the quiet pack muffler. Idles and cruises with a nice tone but gets just a little aggressive when you open it up. I run a 1835 with 110 Engle cam.
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That's the system that I used to run before my Sidewinder. I'd say noise output's about the same but the Tri Mill has a lower exhaust note. |
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pat72
Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2014
Posts: 5
Location: France
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 9:36 am Post subject: |
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I have a big doubt that the Trimill will fit with the Manxter rear bars...
What do you think about that ?
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Lo Cash John
Samba Member
Joined: February 06, 2004
Posts: 2246
Location: Jacksonville, FL
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 10:47 am Post subject: |
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| pat72 wrote: |
| I was told that motorcycle exhausts are not a good option for VW engines because our motors have more CC than motorcycles and they cannot void all the gaz volume on a strong VW engine (there are not a lot of 1600cc + motorbikes !) |
That's a pretty apples to oranges comparison there. Most modern 4 cylinder sport bikes are making about 150hp/liter of displacement. Most normally aspirated VW's on the street are making anywhere from 45 to 75 per liter. Most of these bikes will turn 13,000 + RPM, ALL have 4 valves or more per cylinder and most have ram air induction to increase power. Compare that with our quaint little antique engines, and you can see that a straight cc to cc comparison means nothing.
Modern sport bike engines are damn near F1 technology for pennies (hell, pocket lint really) and the mufflers they have are designed to meet DOT mandated noise levels yet still not choke the performance out of them. Most of the bigger bikes over 1000cc will use dual mufflers and these are one of the very first things to get yanked off to a lighter, zoomier system. Call around some bike shops and you can probably find some stainless or titanium mufflers far cheaper than you'd imagine.
I had a Yoshimura carbon fiber muffler on street bug and it looked and sounded SWEET.
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didget69
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2004
Posts: 4927
Location: Raleigh, North Carolina
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 2:04 pm Post subject: |
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A 1-liter bike muffler will flow way more exhaust air at 12k RPM than a VW engine will vent at 5k RPM...
bnc
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I never found the need to impress people with any mechanic certifications, trophies or track wins... unless it was for Mom to post on the refrigerator door. |
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Bob Elgin
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Joined: April 11, 2012
Posts: 327
Location: Waco, TX
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FarmerJohn
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Joined: December 16, 2007
Posts: 417
Location: Long Island NY
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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I put a super trap spark arrestor on the end of my sidewinder and it quieted it down nicely
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Now I Drive A Hard Top Buggy ! |
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BL3Manx
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2006
Posts: 6767
Location: Northern California
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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| pat72 wrote: |
| Most of VW powered MANXTERs come with the basic Empi Dual Outlet exhaust or the Manx sidewinder |
I'm amazed that anyone would invest the work and money to build a Manxter and then put on something as inefficient as a dual shotgun system on a 4 cylinder boxer engine.
| Bob Elgin wrote: |
| So are you guys saying that certain type of headers cut down own your cc. Dose mine cause backflow problems? |
CCs are a measure of the volume displaced by the piston. It is absolutely determined by the physical dimensions of your engine, not by your exhaust.
However, what you are talking about is volumetric efficiency and yes it can be increased or reduced by header design.
Assuming there are no unusual obstructions caused by a broken baffle, etc., I would say your 4 into 1 collector header system improves the scavenging and flow of your engine better than a stock exhaust system and certainly better than a dual shotgun type system.
Why are you concerned? If its not running right and you need troubleshooting help, you should probably start a new thread. |
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sbussard
Samba Member
Joined: April 19, 2011
Posts: 432
Location: Pittsburgh, PA (near enough)
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 4:10 am Post subject: |
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| FarmerJohn wrote: |
I put a super trap spark arrestor on the end of my sidewinder and it quieted it down nicely
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John - I just did this, and it certainly quieted the sidewinder down. I used 6 discs but have 6 extra. How many did you use?
Thanks,
Scott
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Manxter #122
First time, garage built, and living out the childhood dream of owning a life-size Hotwheel!
Check out my build thread-->My Manxter 2+2 |
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pat72
Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2014
Posts: 5
Location: France
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 8:31 am Post subject: |
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| BL3Manx wrote: |
| I'm amazed that anyone would invest the work and money to build a Manxter and then put on something as inefficient as a dual shotgun system on a 4 cylinder boxer engine. |
May be because a Manxter project is always an expensive project and a cheap exhaust is a way to artificially reduce the bill ?
Alternatively, it could be the same problem as mine : the difficulty to find an exhaust system that is compatible with the rear tubes / bumper of the Manxter (see pix at top of the thread) |
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JCockrill
Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2016
Posts: 33
Location: Charleston, SC
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| Posted: Fri Feb 05, 2016 6:14 am Post subject: TriMil & Manxter Rear Bumper |
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| pat72 wrote: |
I have a big doubt that the Trimill will fit with the Manxter rear bars...
What do you think about that ?
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Anyone run a trimil with the manxter rear bumpers?
That is what I have planned to do but if it won't fit I would love to know. I read that the rear is somewhat adjustable during initial installation but I would love real world experience if anyone has any with this set up.
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'15 Manxter on a '72 pan with '74 engine/trans/and axles. Just trying to work out the gremlins in the build |
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dbsmith
Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2012
Posts: 240
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| Posted: Tue May 09, 2017 7:51 pm Post subject: Re: Manxter Exhaust ? |
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Wife wanted quiet..
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dbsmith
SoCal
#127 Manxter - 99.5% done.... |
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