New way to do front disc brakes

[cru62]

So, I was cleaning out the shop this afternoon and stumbled on something I did for my old '62DC. It had a '73 BJ beam and IRS. I wanted to switch to porsche pattern wheels and didn't want to use adapters due to problems I had experienced in the past on a couple of Bugs that I had. My friend, Brian Deavers, was showing me his new brakes on his SC at Solvang a few years ago. When I asked about what adapters he used he said "None". He said he had redrilled the front hubs for 5 x 130mm and save the 1/4".

I wasn't aware that that was possible. He pulled off a wheel and showed me. He said it was really simple and he did his in his garage at home.

So, at the risk of incurring the wrath of all the Safety Nazis (of whom I am one) I offer up a short tutorial on how to do it.

OK, here is the hub/rotor combination-

I know it looks like way too many holes and should weaken the structure. But Brian ran his for years. I ran mine for years and the guy who bought my DC is still running them 4 years later.

I, luckily, had a 5 x 112 to 5 x 130 adapter that I got somewhere. I installed it and used a transfer punch to locate where to drill the holes for the new Porsche pattern studs. Then I disassembled the rotor from the hub and drove out the original 14 mm studs,

The holes for the original studs are then countersunk and 14mm countersunk Grade 12 bolts are dropped in. I did this in a drill press with the rotor off the assembly. When they were done I put the rotor back on the hub and installed the two offset tiny allen head bolts that index the rotor to the hub. They are original. I installed the nuts on the backside, inside the hub with a split lock washer . I tightened them to 90#.

I drilled new holes for new threaded studs. I drilled them to accommodate the studs I had, so you will need to do that as well and make the holes fit your studs. I used a brand new bottoming 14mm tap on the new holes and installed the studs with blue Locktite.

Here is what the parts look like blown apart.-

Just looking at these pics makes ME doubt that this would work. I know it looks jury-rigged and dangerous. If you have any doubts, I wouldn't do it. I know that I drove around town for a long while with only short jaunts on the freeway before I trusted it. I checked all the bolts numerous times. But I never had any problems whatsoever.
Here is my DC with steel 912 wheels and very slight lowering-

Here it is at OCTO 2007 with about the same amount of lowering and Cosmics. That is Brian's SC with the same mods to the front brakes.-

Here it is with drop spindles from Old Speed and at a livable ride height-

I actaully had a little bit more drop available here, but less suspension travel, so I left it here.

Well, there you have it. I'm wondering if this would be a lower cost option than using Porsche brake parts and all the mix 'n matching that goes on to adapt to stock spindles. You could make a bracket for the caliper and slip the hub/rotor assembly right on. I'm just sayin'
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"My biggest worry is that when I die, my wife will sell all my parts for what I told her I paid for them"-Jon

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[65 Deluxe]

I have the same setup on my double cab and works well. I use a Porsche to wide 5 adapter when I want to use stock wheels. Early bay brakes converted to Porsche pattern.
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[zimblewinder]

It may work but until I hear you've had it engineered I wouldn't think that promoting this setup by posting here is a good idea. Looks like death warmed up to me. My friend works at Tickford racing developments (engineer) and he said this setup makes his hair stand on end.
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[Low Bräu]

Whether or not it has held up over the past couple of years without incident, I think most would agree this is not a good idea. Seeing this makes my hair stand on end as well.
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Specializing in repair and maintenance for Porsche, BMW, Mini, Audi, and Volkswagen.

1952 Standard Beetle
1960 SO-23 Westfalia
1961 L-380 Turkis Deluxe Beetle
1985 Vanagon Country Homes Camper (work in progress - EG33 swap)

[cru62]

[MrPolak]

Well, on the upside, the hub-centric design means the hub carries most of the static load.

On the other side, something tells me this design, while creative, would not earn a TUV certification.

I'd say load up the truck to max capacity and test the brakes and handling repeatedly, then analyze for stress.

[cru62]

My concern would be turning loaded at speed. I, fortunately, never had any cause for worry.

I have no doubt that this would not pass an MOT or TUV inspection. But, my old DC is currently rolling in France with no problems for the past 4 years. Go figure.
_________________
"My biggest worry is that when I die, my wife will sell all my parts for what I told her I paid for them"-Jon

Jokes about German sausage are the wurst.

Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!

[DubStyle]

[hebmuller3500]

Hi,
I just restord a so 34 bus from 61
I just need to solve the prblem with the steering collum, it is was very intense used.can anyone help me?
Chris

[cru62]

[marklaken]

[Brian_1952]

Maybe if I was stuck in Mexico with my split bus because someone stole all my Wide five wheels I may considerate it to get the hell out of there but if you do it because you think it's better than what's already out there your NUTS the smartest engineers in the world would never design anything with half a bolt hole
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[WideFive]

[cru62]

Thanks, Aaron. You beat me too it.

Brian-As Aaron has stated the stud is threaded into the hub AND the rotor. There is no half of a hole. There is as much meat in just the rotor than in the face of a drum into which a threaded stud typically in screwed. I figured the extra depth couldn't hurt.

And, Brian, I think this is what you really meant to say-
"the dumbest engineers in the world would never design anything with half a bolt hole".

I also built my own adjustable springplates for the IRS. Never had a problem with those either. Remember, I'm not offroading this or racing it. The top speed was 70 MPH in my bus. And also to clarify things, the example in the pics is my prototype to get all the dimensions and fit up, etc. dialed in.
_________________
"My biggest worry is that when I die, my wife will sell all my parts for what I told her I paid for them"-Jon

Jokes about German sausage are the wurst.

Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!

[marklaken]

I think I get it - the rotor is bolted to the hub via the countersunk bolts. The threading of the hub is just extra thread run out. Wheel bolt to the rotor. That is not much different than a CPP disc brake conversion I did on a '53 chevy truck: http://www.classicperform.com/Instructions/PDF/4759DBK-6.pdf
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[cru62]

That is correct.
_________________
"My biggest worry is that when I die, my wife will sell all my parts for what I told her I paid for them"-Jon

Jokes about German sausage are the wurst.

Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!