we blew it ---

[Balonya]

Not a total surprise but surly a disappointment.
We bought our 88 Carat in April with the understanding that the engine had approximately 30K on the rebuild (done by owner a VW mechanic) so we we felt like we were buying the engine with an average body. so we would avoid this situation for a while. One month later the automatic transmission started to slip .... we had it rebuilt yeah yeah yeah

Our plan was to Vamp from Seattle to San Francisco and back over 14days!!! Which we did. WE HAD A BLAST, BEST TRIP IN YEARS!!! However, on the way back seemingly out of nowhere, 30 miles south of Coos Bay OR ourengine went. (It got too hot,even though the temp gauge looked fine) and we had to tow it home. SO I now have sunk $7000 in to a van that won't run. I just might have boarded the $$ to pay for it. (until I sold the truck it was to replace and then pay it back simple plan right!?!)

So this is not a sob story!!!!!

This is a we love our van and it will run again! SO now it looks like the cost effective way to get it back on the road is for me to take the plunge and put the engine in myself. I have some very basic experience but FAR from a mechanic. OK I am trusting our mechanic that I can do this. The plan is to go for a rebuilt 2.1 rather than a conversion, and unless "the right situation" presents itself I am leery of a used engine. SO ... North West connecting Rods here we come!

Any tips are welcome I will try to keep questions to this thread if the search button does not have the answer. Anyway here I go. Well soon we didn't even order the engine yet.

here is the link to my introductory post. with pic of the van. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=593812&highlight=

[Hammy1]

With your limited experience a rebuilt engine will be the easiest route. It could be done in a day and shouldn't take more then a weekend. Good luck!

Jon h.[/img]

[Wildthings]

The right used engine will be a proven runner. There is always an "IF" to a recent rebuild as you have recently found out. I suggest seeing what is available from Small Car. $500 for the engine, another $500 to get hoses, tanks, water pumps, thermostat, and other accessories right and a couple of days to put it in and get everything set up A-1.

[MarkWard]

My advice if you intend to swap out the engine yourself, is to concentrate on staying organized. For everything you disconnect, masking tape and a sharpie to mark not only the removed wire/hose, but where it came from. Digital camera to document everything as it was. Ziploc bags for organizing fasteners as they come off with notation from where they come from. I mention this, because while you are being told a day to do the job, most likely you will come across something unforeseen, and will be delayed a week or more. You can't trust your memory. Too many similar pieces for someone that does not have the experience.

Most important advice, Disconnect the battery ground cable and if equipped with two batteries, disconnect both ground cables before you turn a wrench on anything else. Level ground and jack stands are important to your safety. Good luck.
_________________
☮️

[dobryan]

X2 to this ^^^^.

When I disassemble an engine I get a little AR. I'll label each connection with a numbered masking tape as I remove it and also take a digital pic. When I am done I've got dozens of labels and pics. Then I can reassemble in reverse order of the numbers and I put the digital pic images on my garage TV and don't have an issue of forgetting something important or reassembling in the wrong order. YMMV.
_________________
Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2002 Subaru EJ25 and Peloquin TBD

"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson

MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646

Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371

The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794

[Steve M.]

Don't despair. I know you just put money into this, but I think you got screwed on the engine. I wouldn't trust the guy for any future mechanical work unless he's doing to to repair what he did for free.
There are many happy miles ahead of you yet.

One of the problems to be aware of with a rebuilt 2.1 is that the bolts used on the crank shaft or connecting rod bearings are a one-time use from the original factory engine. They stretch after that use. So you need to inquire about what bolts were used. The bolts used on the 1.9 engine are the bolts to use. So the possibility exists of the bearings slipping around the crankshaft.
Somebody can correct me on which bolts it is-the crankshaft bearing or the connecting rod bearing, (my brain is full).

See this post for ways to get the engine out:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=575003&highlight=removal+2x4s

The last method with the 2x4's works, the boat trailer crank is about $30 at Harbor Freight, but make sure the cable is inside the box!
and probably the least expensive method.

See if you've got a friend you can borrow this stuff from:

You need floor jacks - the highest ones you can get which I think is the 6 ton version, $40 again at Harbor Freight. But check around for sales or friends that have them already. (don't get the Delco brand jacks from Sears on sale-their cheap quality.)

Get a Bucket Head Vacuum at Home Depot, $22.00 or $30.00 I forget, also the orange bucket they sell for $3.00 to put it on.
Get a 1 foot length of clear 3/4" PVC hose that will fit inside the 1/4" vacuum hose.
Get the next smaller size clear PVC hose that will fit into the 3/4" hose. Again a 1' length.
Use this clean bucket to suck all the antifreeze out of the system into the clean bucket! It should be about 18 liters of coolant, you may need another clean bucket. Start by jacking up the front of the van and remember to open the Heater valves.
Then put the 3/4" hose into the coolant reservoir and suck out as much as you can. Then start with the individual hoses and engine block. the smaller pvc hose shoved into the 3/4" will fit into the engine hoses.
You should be able to get a lot of the coolant out, but there will always be a bit hidden in the lines or block so be ready for a small spill-tie your coolant hoses up out of the way so they di not flop down and spill fluid.

If you have a cat around they love antifreeze, but it will kill them so be aware of that.

Alternative to sucking the hoses dry is to clamp the hoses with hose clamps that squeeze them shut. Again Harbor Freight has them, but you need two sets to get the larger clamps. Think their about $12 a set. Red with a black plastic handle to turn down.

The two posts above about labeling...important!

Oh yeah...pictures are equally important for us out here in the viewing world!

[j_dirge]

[geodude]

I'll add that using colored sharpies or colored flags is very useful. Tag each side of every connection with matching color and label the connection. Helps to speed matching things back up (as long as you don't use the same color for everything!). Also get lots of ziplock bags and use one for each assembly you remove. One bag for the bolts for the engine mounts, one bag for exhaust related bolts, one bag for water pump, etc. And label each bag. I've wasted more time over the years looking for that one bolt that I put down and can't find than all the actual wrench turning time. Organization is key as others have said.

This is also the time to replace your coolant hoses and fuel lines.
_________________
1988 GL Camper
1991 Multivan — the basket case

[Balonya]

Thanks for the support and tips. I will be taking lots of photos, using plastic bags for all lose parts, and do ing the sharpie trio or some way to match parts up.
I spoke with small car and might end up with a used engine from one of their swaps.
How much more difficult is it if I use a syncro engine?
does anyone have any experience/ thoughts on a rebuilt from Bus Depot? there about a $1000 cheaper the NW connecting rods. with rebuilt heads
http://www.busdepot.com/025100771

[fleet_maintenance]

I agree with all of the above posts that organization is critical for the non- mechanic/first-timer/DIYer.

Instead of baggies I use cardboard, and working from left to right, top to bottom, poke holes in the cardboard and insert and label every fastener. I ziptie washers thru holes and label them too. Similar to the methods above, this gives me a "timeline" of what I took apart, where in the project I took it off, and the other parts removed immediately before and after.

Critical systems' fasteners (ie:bellhousings) may get their own piece of cardboard, to better record specific fasateners locations.

This definately helps speed re-assembly, and allows for unexpected delays without the anxiety a greasy pile of mixed fasteners and van parts can bring.

A few pieces of cardboard, an awl to poke starter holes, a roll of painter's tape (to tag and mark electrical and plumbing lines) and a sharpie are must have items for me.

A Bentley and internet DIY's/videos help a ton too.

EDIT: To be clear, the idea wasn't originally mine, but I have been using it for a few years, for work on all 4 of my vehicles. It's saved my tail (and my sanity) more times than I can count

[16CVs]

Interesting that you are throwing in the towel, do you really know what's wrong? did you break a coolant tower or a stuck thermostat or plugged radiator or some such thing. I would investigate what happened before sticking another engine in there. These boxers are resilient , I seized mine up from low oil and playing " Ricky Road Racer "on a series of off ramps. After a tow home it started back up and tapped a little and came back to life. Yea I am in the process of building an engine for it ,so I am not so worried.
When you do replace the engine ,look at your coolant tower and take the hoses of off each end of of coolant pipes and see what shape the tubes are in as well as the thermostat housing and the plastic couplers for the rear heater and numerous other hose joiners. These will leave you walking and are failry cheap compare to a tow truck ride home ,AAA or not.
So figure out what went wrong and report back to the forum of FKA's ,I know I am interested .

Stacy
_________________
1987 Syncro Westfalia Triple knob (bastard)
1989 Syncro Tristar Triple knob "Swedish"
2013 Jetta Hybrid a true "Zwitter"
Samba member # 14980
Call anytime number 650 722 4914 .
Keep Your van running and upkept tastefully for the love of the hobby.
Don't let your van end up in an "abortions" thread.

[Ahwahnee]

[rubbachicken]

i'd spend a couple of hours investigating before you pull the engine, there are a number of reasons it could have let you down, be a shame to pull it, and have someone look over it later a show you, that you only needed to change a small part.
_________________
lucy our westy

lucy's BIG adventure

meet 'burni'


markswagen {mobile mechanic} san diego area all early VW's cared for.

619 201 0310 or 617 935 4182

[hdenter]

Stick with a used engine for this first venture into major engine work. Even at $1000 bucks cheaper than other rebuilds, you are still spending thousands of dollars. With all the online support in the world, there is still a chance that a simple mistake will be catastrophic. Once the builder finds out that an inexperienced person put the motor in, he will likely be hesitant to honor a warranty if the engine fails early.

If you put in a used engine and it fails due to it's age or your mistake, you are only out $500 or so for the engine and the few hundred you spent on hoses and other bits. But, you will have gained some experience and confidence to move forward with. The new hoses will still be new and can be carried over to the next used engine or a rebuilt block for the second go around.

Best case is that the used engine has a lot of life left in it and you have years of good service for 1/4 of the cost of the rebuilt.

Hans
_________________
'79 triple white convertible bug
'84 sunroof vanagon
'85 weekender

[Balonya]

We did have it checked out by Han's Foreign Car Repair. He (Hans said that the thermostat housing melted to the engine so he knew it was dead. - had got to hot.
There is still compression and it starts but when we pulled over it would no longer go. It was also making hella clanking. Hans also suggested that I could do the swap myself when I was asking about cheaper alternatives and has offered to talk me through it, spend an hour or so with me to get me on the right start, and to finish of the final tuneup once I get to a place where I have gone as far as I can. So (maybe I am stupid) I feel like he is looking out and did not have to make himself available. HE also put one of his mechanic on the phone when we were on the side of the road, and called us the next day to see how we made out. With al of that I feel comfortable with his "its dead" There is a part of me who would like a more definitive explanation of why/how but I trust that it is dead.

[Steve M.]

[gears]

One caution about getting an engine from a converter: Quite often guys go for the conversion when their H2O engine is beginning to fail.
_________________
aka Pablo, Geary
9.36 @ 146 in '86 Hot & Sticky
'90 Syncro Westy SVX
'87 Syncro GL 2.5
https://guardtransaxle.com

[Balonya]

Hans sent me to NW conecting rods. I talked to small car and they just got I a automatic with 120 130 130 125 compression.
So I am looking at
NW CR for a rebut $3000
Bus depot $2000 with recondiond heads
Or used from small car for approximate $800.

The bus depot option is sounding good to me. Thoughts on the used ones compression.?

[MarkWard]

[Balonya]

I am really thinking about bit the used one from small car

Compression. 120-130-130-125. No leaks (as they could tell) $800.
Thoughts.