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Hello. ToughBug family project
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houseofboyd
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Rust. Moment of truth. Patch weld or replace whole secti Reply with quote

runchman wrote:
ToughBug wrote:
Really making me think about what my goal is - a working driver or restored car that lasts and lasts.

Advice anyone?


I've struggled with this as well, as the money going out just seems to never end. Should I have just done the bare minimum and saved some $$$? Who can say.

My only advice is to determine your goal sooner, rather than later. In the end on my 71 super restoration in progress I decided I wanted it to end up as good or better than new - that means replacing A LOT of crap, and eventually that gets expensive. Everywhere you look, there's a plastic, fabric or rubberish part that is 40 some years old, and you decide it just doesn't make sense NOT to replace it. It all adds up as your orders tally up. TorqueMeister today, brake lines tomorrow. Wow, these ball joints are all really old. Maybe a paint gun because what the hell, you'll try this in your garage.

It can suck ya in.

I think either goal is worthy - a minimal-required-budget to make a reliable decent daily driver car project, or a do the best you can and screw the budget project.

The thing is if you wait to long to decide you're doing option A, you've replaced so much stuff that you rationalize yourself into option B.

My 2 cents of restoration philosophy.

(I also just got that torquemeister, and agree definitely worth the $$)


Well said...fact is, if you're going to do a reasonable restore, you'll never get the money out of it that you're going to put in it..it has to be a labor of love...My goal was to take a 1000 dollar Beetle and make it a 5000 dollar Beetle. Yes, I could've bought a nice reasonably built car, but what fun is that? lol
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runchman
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Rust. Moment of truth. Patch weld or replace whole secti Reply with quote

houseofboyd wrote:
...fact is, if you're going to do a reasonable restore, you'll never get the money out of it that you're going to put in it..it has to be a labor of love...


Oh yeah, I didn't even touch on that. when you add the sandpaper, the torquemeister, the this, the that, the 8,000 latex gloves, I'll probably be 3x the value of the car.
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1971 super total body-off restoration

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runchman
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But if you do dive in, it can also be one hell of a satisfying project, and one I'll be pretty darn proud of having done in the end. Can't put a price on that.
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ToughBug
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 26, 2014 4:34 pm    Post subject: Attitude, Christmas gift for the '73 Reply with quote

My dad got these from a nearby vw shop and restored them. Awesome. We think they are topline versastruts (not the maXX struts with the narrow springs).

I guess I'll be swapping out the sway bar to match.

Also got enough rust treatment to do the rusty panels I cut holes into. And wheel cylinders. Time to get to work!

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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ToughBug
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 26, 2014 7:44 pm    Post subject: Plan C Reply with quote

So, I think I'll try a torquemeister for the wheel nuts rather than break some tools and my knuckles. $75 at cip1.

Meamwhile, have to spray rust converter inside the open rear quarter panel, trim, and weld the new section. Then do the rear heater channel. Cut away the rust and patch.
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Tim Donahoe
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 26, 2014 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I bought that Cip1 Torquemeister knock-off. It works so well, you'll kick yourself for not getting one sooner. The price is not too shabby, either--if you plan to keep the bug, that is.

I have the 3/4 breaker bar and cheater pipe, and such. But how accurate is that for tightening the flywheel nut and rear wheel nuts to 253 ft. lbs.?

I just set my 3/8 torque wrench to 28 ft. lbs. Wrench it on the Torquemeister, and I get 252 ft. lbs. I add a teensy (I mean teensy) bit more to get to 253 ft. lbs, and call it good.

Be careful, though, it's shocking how your torque wrench signals that you're done--when you think, "Really?"

Well, it really works that easily.

Tim
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ToughBug
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 28, 2014 5:42 pm    Post subject: welding progress Reply with quote

Sounds great. Can't wait to try it!

Today we welded in the rear quarter panel - mostly just the wheel well and some metal forward and above. Cleaned it and did the anti-rust thing inside. Man. Sheet metal welding is tricky. Especially where I didn't trim perfectly and there was a gap to bridge.

But I've gotten good on the spots where the metal actually meets. For the other places I used spare pieces as a backing, inside the cabin and around the wheel well. Those thin strips helped a lot.

I have no idea how I will cut away the FRONT left quarter panel section just perfectly so the new panel lines up. Decided I'll spot weld that one in place and get a professional to do the welds on that, since it is structural. I do hope to keep my wheels pointing forwards!
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ToughBug
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2015 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Removing old struts to add versa struts. Only broke off three of the six rusty bolts in the process. Thought it'd feel better to bat .500. Confused Now to drill out the three. On the bright side I see I have newish ball joints - that's a surprise!

Soaking strut bases and preparing to bang them loose from the backing plates.
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ToughBug
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2015 12:20 pm    Post subject: Coooooooooold garage! Reply with quote

Well, it's been cold, cold, cold in my garage lately. And dark. And cramped since I need to make room for another car and a kids soccer goal. But I have made some progress....

1) rear quarter panel install is mostly done. My first attempts to weld body sheet metal were, er, interesting. I doomed myself by not getting the panel cut just right. I thought it was really good, but geez it has to be nearly perfect. Not enough flux core in the world to jump the gaps - so I backed up and added additional panel pieces. That helped. But I fear my cheapo MIG rig (no gas so, yeah, not *really* MIG, I know) might really limit my ability to get pretty welds here. My power settings are: high / low. Perhaps another wire diameter. In any case it was FUN. And it's strong. And the ugliness will be grinded down and, besides, in the wheel well. The other day I welded real (thicker) metal and, wow, it was easy!

2) Rear heater channel. Cut out, derusted, patched with slightly better welds. Ran out to standard phosphoric acid solution so I tried "naval jelly". Funny stuff. Like a pink ball of snot that could burn right through your nose. Tonight, it'll be painted. For the life of me I can't figure out why the actual heater pipe is wrapped inside the outer shell....I mean why the outer shell in the back is mostly sealed off (to the outside, but a hole in the cabin). Seems like an invitation to rust. But I repaired it as it was.

3) New toys: pedal assembly came from JBugs, torquemeister from CIP1. I have all brake lines and brake assembly parts in hand. Plus a new master cylinder. This car might not GO but it will STOP!

4) Best part: recently taught two boys to weld, and had a friend that knows how help us get started. Worst part: the rust can really be overwhelming.
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joemama
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2015 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know you have put the fuel pump issue aside for now, but I just came across your thread. Your pump is loud because it is not flowing fuel, when they are dry, they are very loud, but when there is fuel flowing thru them they quiet down considerably. I would start by looking in the tank and see if there is rust, next there is a small screen strainer in the fuel fitting under the tank. That could be blocked up. Disconnect the line from the tank to the fuel pump and blow compressed air thru it and see if its clear. And yes, those pumps push much better than they suck, so it should be moved under the tank. It should be powered from a wire that has power only when the ignition is on. A simple test light can help you with this. As for fuel hose, I like to use fuel injection hose available from your local auto parts store. In my experience it lasts a long time without cracking. Also, use fuel injection clamps of the correct size for the fuel line you are using. This type of clamp only tightens to the correct diameter, and also the screw does not back out by itself, I use a little blue loctite on the screw for peace of mind. Also use a fuel filter between the gas tank and the fuel pump, so junk is removed before it gets to the pump. One bummer about this set up is that you will get gas running down your arm when you change fuel filters, but you can find small petcocks on ebay, that you can add to shut off fuel if you want. Also, if the car has been sitting a while, your jets could be clogged in the carburetor from fuel varnish, and might never run right until you clean the jets.
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ToughBug
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2015 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks joemama. I remember those days when I thought I'd just fix the fuel pump and drive around a bit before the restoration Smile Good thing I didn't! But I'll get there and will remember this.
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ToughBug
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2015 7:20 am    Post subject: Needs / looking for Reply with quote

Thanks to all for your help.

FYI, I am currently looking for:

a 1973 SB body shell with little rust, or at least rust in different places. The hope would be to swap it with mine to avoid costly repair of front driver's quarter panel.

OR

a 71-72 SB body shell that might come with struts, dash items, and glass (all different than my 73)

Sure, I'd like to take a trip out west to admire the rust-free rollers out there....but for now I'm east coast-bound. Could imagine traveling from NY to NC to TN perhaps.

Tim, will visit one day to look at your rollers.

I have a chassis that is mostly repaired, except for wheels (currently rusted up tight)

OR front suspension items for a 73.

OR any thing that might move the repair of my engine along, so I feel like I'm making progress while I weld.

It's not that I'm being lazy so much as that I want to be smart(er) about the repairs.

Thanks!
Tom
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ToughBug
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2015 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the middle of winter I received my torquemeister in the mail. My rusty nuts wouldn't budge though and I broke a craftsman wrench trying. I realized the. that Rusty was going to test me. Then it snowed and snowed and snowed. And I pondered the rust and my plan. And tried to think of how to get out west to pick up one of those rust-free body shells that they give away for free there on the sides of the road, under swaying palm trees.

Now I may have a bit of time and it's a tropical 40 degrees outside so it's time to try once more.

Next up: getting those wheel nuts off and doing the brakes and bearings, doing basic body work on rusty areas, and figuring out how to remove and replace the whole front quarter panel. There's a lot of paint, bono, and rubbery goo forming the existing panel. Somewhere under that are the spot welds I'll need to remove.

Anyone have advice about cutting away front quarter panels?

(Or know of a super front clip for sale near PA? I could led in a replacement because I've gotten good with the welder.....)

Back in the saddle!
Tom
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Tim Donahoe
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2015 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you saying the Torquemeister wouldn't budge the wheel nuts? Hm? I haven't heard that one before.

I have a Torquemeister, which I use to torque the nuts back to spec., but I actually loosen the nuts with a 3/4 inch drive Craftsman breaker bar, a 3/4 inch drive 1 & 7/16ths inch socket, and a four-foot pipe.

Since I spent a lot of money on the big-ass breaker bar and socket, I just can't think of wasting it. Besides, it has never failed me.

Tim
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ToughBug
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2015 1:04 pm    Post subject: Back at it Reply with quote

Decided that Rusty '73 had a body shell that was beyond repair, or at least beyond my abilities. There just wasn't anything solid-ish to weld to. Found NotsoRusty '74 about an hour and a half away and got the shell, doors, hoods, etc. New body has a sun roof - that's fun! More importantly it has "regular" rust - minor welding and patching on channels and front. Nothing too bad.

So I'm back at it. Mating a 74 body to a 73 chassis.

Sooooooook much better. Occasionally there is actual metal to weld to!
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