'54 engine Woes

ZENVWDRIVER · Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:42 pm Post subject: '54 engine Woes

...put a 1961 stale air 40 into my 1954 Bug...was a tight fit. Besides that I connected a 900 CCA Optima 6v battery and the engine barely cranks. So, I connected a 12v battery and the car started right up...connected the 6v again and ran a jumper cable to the negative post and the other end to the bolt that goes from the starter though the top trans mount and it sort of cranked a little better, but not enough to start the car...thought it was a poor ground problem.

...will only start on 12 volts with a 6v starter. Am
tempted to convert to 12 volt, after I have exhausted methods of getting 6v to function ...Anyone have any ideas on how I could proceed and fix?
_________________
5/50, pastel green 11G - SOLD
8/50, gray 11A Beetle
6/52, pastel green 11C - SOLD
11/4/52, black Zwitter - SOLD to my little bro.
1954 Porsche, pre A, with VW 36 horse- SOLD
1/54, black 11C Beetle - TRADED
2/55 Iceland green Beetle, on a 1965 pan
3/55 113 Beetle, stratos silver
1955 Messerschmitt KR175 - SOLD, sadly
1960 single cab
1962 SO33, with SO 42 interior
9/63 Pacific blue, Ghia
'87 Toyota MR2
'02 WestFORDia E-150, GAVE TO OUR SON

All super-heroes, wear a MASK

Snort · Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:52 pm Post subject:

My 6V system is tuned pretty well with an Optima, good switches and starter. I've had a very stiff 1776 motor in there not too long ago and it worked hard to turn it over but it starts. My Son has a 6V 40hp Big Bore and it fires right up without a hitch and I've run 1500, 1600 and 1641 motors on 6V without any problems. So the question seems to be, what is the story on this 40hp motor and what's wrong with your 6V system?

Get busy and rebuild your electrical system so it is working properly and your 54 will be that much closer to original when you decide to go all stock again. The first step is to start working on all of your grounds especially the transmission ground, all battery cables, ignition switch and starter relay if you're so inclined. If you're looking for a reason to go 12V I don't see it yet.

By the way, if 36hp is in short supply in your life, I'm liking the 40hp stale air transplant. It's old school make-it-work stuff I wish more people would be thinking about doing with their Ovals.

ZENVWDRIVER · Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 12:30 pm Post subject: .

...appreciate your comments. I will go through my electrical system...you were the second person (out of 2) to advise checking the trans strap and all the grounds....good advise.

I have had this stale air 40 for going on 10 years now, and it performs well.
_________________
5/50, pastel green 11G - SOLD
8/50, gray 11A Beetle
6/52, pastel green 11C - SOLD
11/4/52, black Zwitter - SOLD to my little bro.
1954 Porsche, pre A, with VW 36 horse- SOLD
1/54, black 11C Beetle - TRADED
2/55 Iceland green Beetle, on a 1965 pan
3/55 113 Beetle, stratos silver
1955 Messerschmitt KR175 - SOLD, sadly
1960 single cab
1962 SO33, with SO 42 interior
9/63 Pacific blue, Ghia
'87 Toyota MR2
'02 WestFORDia E-150, GAVE TO OUR SON

All super-heroes, wear a MASK

2Dokas · Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:35 am Post subject:

ran a quick search,

what the heck is a "stale air 40"?
_________________
87 Doka 2WD Ej22,
56 Convertible

RareAir · Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:25 am Post subject:

EverettB · Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:44 am Post subject:

ZENVWDRIVER · Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 6:54 pm Post subject: .

Also, the stale air 40 horse uses a fan shroud similar to a 36 horse. Here's a pic of the engine # 5 472 220, a 1/61 ...

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
5/50, pastel green 11G - SOLD
8/50, gray 11A Beetle
6/52, pastel green 11C - SOLD
11/4/52, black Zwitter - SOLD to my little bro.
1954 Porsche, pre A, with VW 36 horse- SOLD
1/54, black 11C Beetle - TRADED
2/55 Iceland green Beetle, on a 1965 pan
3/55 113 Beetle, stratos silver
1955 Messerschmitt KR175 - SOLD, sadly
1960 single cab
1962 SO33, with SO 42 interior
9/63 Pacific blue, Ghia
'87 Toyota MR2
'02 WestFORDia E-150, GAVE TO OUR SON

All super-heroes, wear a MASK

ZENVWDRIVER · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:03 pm Post subject: kit

...saw a "hard start kit" for sale on thesamba. Will that help make the 6v engine start?
_________________
5/50, pastel green 11G - SOLD
8/50, gray 11A Beetle
6/52, pastel green 11C - SOLD
11/4/52, black Zwitter - SOLD to my little bro.
1954 Porsche, pre A, with VW 36 horse- SOLD
1/54, black 11C Beetle - TRADED
2/55 Iceland green Beetle, on a 1965 pan
3/55 113 Beetle, stratos silver
1955 Messerschmitt KR175 - SOLD, sadly
1960 single cab
1962 SO33, with SO 42 interior
9/63 Pacific blue, Ghia
'87 Toyota MR2
'02 WestFORDia E-150, GAVE TO OUR SON

All super-heroes, wear a MASK

kielbasa · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:39 pm Post subject:

Those are pretty much bandaids. Seems like you got something else going on
_________________
Gotta give my props to:
Wolfsburg Motorsports
Dubbers Toy Box
Jeff's VW Speed and Fab
4inbore.com
Kielbasa Industries

EverettB · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:57 pm Post subject: Re: kit

ZENVWDRIVER · Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 7:30 pm Post subject: hot start kit

...installed a 6v hot start kit purchased from a samba vendor in New Hampshire...was easy to install and the car starts right up every time...problem solved.
_________________
5/50, pastel green 11G - SOLD
8/50, gray 11A Beetle
6/52, pastel green 11C - SOLD
11/4/52, black Zwitter - SOLD to my little bro.
1954 Porsche, pre A, with VW 36 horse- SOLD
1/54, black 11C Beetle - TRADED
2/55 Iceland green Beetle, on a 1965 pan
3/55 113 Beetle, stratos silver
1955 Messerschmitt KR175 - SOLD, sadly
1960 single cab
1962 SO33, with SO 42 interior
9/63 Pacific blue, Ghia
'87 Toyota MR2
'02 WestFORDia E-150, GAVE TO OUR SON

All super-heroes, wear a MASK

tasb · Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:12 pm Post subject:

not really, you just applied a band aid. At least you kept it 6 v.
_________________
Roads Scholar &
1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018

1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc

1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse

jason · Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 10:47 pm Post subject:

Not really a band aid. More like a redesign.

tasb · Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 3:12 pm Post subject:

Can't agree. He took a band aid out of a box and put it on his boo boo. He redesigned nothing. He applied a band aid that covers up the real issue.

I'll admit to having run a hard start relay briefly. After three weeks I took the time and effort to clean all of my ground contacts. That was 15 years ago and I have not needed that relay since. I nursed my electrical system back to health without the need for a relay ie: band aid.
_________________
Roads Scholar &
1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018

1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc

1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse

ZENVWDRIVER · Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 5:59 pm Post subject:

ZENVWDRIVER · Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 6:09 pm Post subject: 6v

...played around with the 6v system, cleaning connections, replacing straps and cables and new components...think, I've done all I'm capable of, to no avail.
brought my 6v starter and 6v generator to an auto electric repair shop and asked to rebuild the starter and to change the 6v-size-starter to 12v. Three days later, i went back and got the starter which was cleaned, "reworked" and re bushed...that was $45. I also got back a 6v-size, 12v generator. That was $65.
Today, I removed the 6v generator from the '54 and transferred all of the associated fan and pulley parts and installed the 12v unit...fits like a stock 6v, but is 12v.
Still have to attach the belt pulley, belt and re connect the wires. Not sure where to place the regulator,...maybe under the back seat like was done in the late 60s when type one went to 12v initially.
After that, i'll change all bulbs and not run wipers till I figure something out. Will need to find 12v bulbs for the euro headlights.
This will work well. I'm happy that it'll be a 12v system, like my '60 single cab (converted in 2007).
I know, I will have my critics for not going completely stock and I would have if it made sense...this'll be a good alternative for the 1961 stale air 40. I'm content with the decision.
_________________
5/50, pastel green 11G - SOLD
8/50, gray 11A Beetle
6/52, pastel green 11C - SOLD
11/4/52, black Zwitter - SOLD to my little bro.
1954 Porsche, pre A, with VW 36 horse- SOLD
1/54, black 11C Beetle - TRADED
2/55 Iceland green Beetle, on a 1965 pan
3/55 113 Beetle, stratos silver
1955 Messerschmitt KR175 - SOLD, sadly
1960 single cab
1962 SO33, with SO 42 interior
9/63 Pacific blue, Ghia
'87 Toyota MR2
'02 WestFORDia E-150, GAVE TO OUR SON

All super-heroes, wear a MASK

txoval · Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 7:02 pm Post subject:

Do you mind posting contact info on the shop that did the work? That's pretty damn cheap compared to most or buying a Porsche generator...

tasb · Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 6:24 pm Post subject:

Sounds like you did your home work and made some decisions that were good for you.
_________________
Roads Scholar &
1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018

1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc

1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse


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