1st gear synchromesh (changed to AAP VS DK in an AAZ)

[Gizmoman]

[Gizmoman]

[Gizmoman]

[AndyBees]

[crazyvwvanman]

The Bentley doesn't have the gearing for the AAP 5 speed. In any case the 2,3,4,5 gear ratios of the AAP don't match the 1,2,3,4 of the DK at all. The only one even close is top gear in AAP of .82 vs .85 top gear in DK. Look at the earlier post of Gizmoman where he lists all of the gear ratios in both and road speeds in both.

Naturally one can replace the top two gears in either tranny with various ratios that are available.

EDIT: perhaps you are confusing the AAP 5 speed with the very different Syncro trannys with 4+G gearing. US spec Syncro trannys are AAK and AAN codes, listed in the Bentley. Not even close to the same gearing as the 2wd AAP true 5 speed.

Mark

[AndyBees]

[u]

[crazyvwvanman]

The Bentley lists the 5 speed tranny code in a few places. First place is on page 2 and DX is that code. It also lists all the gearing ratios inside that DX code tranny on page 34.1b of later versions. Versions vary.

The AAP has the tallest stock R&P and the tallest stock overall top gear VW offered in T3. Some people consider those to be advantages as well as the first gear.

Yes, you can make various other code trannys the equivalent of an AAP by changing out enough parts. You can also make just about any 4 speed into a gearing equivalent of any other 4 speed or customize either a 5 or 4 speed to a limited extent. Most people would have to buy those parts and pay a tranny guy to put them in.

Gearing success depends on matching up with the engine. I don't know why it seems that so many TDI guys can't seem to understand that other VW diesel engines may have different gearing needs.

Mark

[Gizmoman]

[Jon_slider]

[Gizmoman]

If I knew Excel and fluid dynamics better, I'd add a line going in the opposite direction indicating wind resistance increasing with speed
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82 Vanagon Westy - AAZ 1.9 TD, HE200 Holset, WAIC, 27.75 dia tires, Electric power steering, 5-speed AAP w/.078 5th
Oversize spare carrier - stock location (no longer for sale).

[AndyBees]

If your engine cannot handle the jump from Stock 3rd to .77 4th gear, there's something bad wrong with the 'estimated' 150 hp. I'm running a 1.14 3rd and the .77 4th. It handles the 1250 pound camper and 400 pound of stuff just fine, head wind or not... even 3% grades. The ALH engine is 90 HP stock. Mine has a Stage 1 Malone tune (110 hp). The exhaust, IP, Turbo, etc., are all stock and I am running the OE CAT.

I believe you could get a better understanding of the gearing if you looked at how different ratios affect engine RPM rather than miles per hour changes.

My Excel worksheet is already set-up. You just plug in different gear ratios, RPMs, tire size, etc., then look at the results. And, as I stated previously, the real world results in my case are almost spot-on.

One last piece of advice, I'd get rid of the water to air Intercooler and replace it with an air-to-air. If you are not running some sort of gauge, you have no clue how big of a heat sink it is. Once it is loaded with heat, the intended positive affects are diminished in short order.
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'84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003.

[Gizmoman]

Andy, your traveling achievements speak volumes for sure. And my "150 HP" is only a reflection of time and dollars spent A more believable number may be 110-120

The WAIC does have a quick acting probe in the intake manifold to a digital gauge. The heat exchanger is 2 X 7 X 26 with a 3.5 gallon res.

Charge air temps are generally 20-30 degrees over ambient after 50 miles depending on load.

The turbo is a Holset HE 200, boost is set to 21 psi but I rarely go over 14. Boost starts around 2-2.5K. Head has a mild port job. Giles IP.

Without dynoing both engines it's hard to say, but I believe you have a much broader torque curve and one that starts a bit earlier.

As an AAP tranny is not readily available, your suggestion is worth consideration.
Sadly after my arrival from work last night, I noticed several (more) oil drops in the driveway I may have other issues to deal with before a three week trip through the mountains.
_________________
82 Vanagon Westy - AAZ 1.9 TD, HE200 Holset, WAIC, 27.75 dia tires, Electric power steering, 5-speed AAP w/.078 5th
Oversize spare carrier - stock location (no longer for sale).

[crazyvwvanman]

The peak HP numbers are not the issue as far as gearing goes. The HP curve is the issue. The 1.9TDI has a very different curve than the 1.9TD does. They benefit from different gearing as a result.

Mark

[Waldi]

[Waldi]

[?Waldo?]

I agree with Mark on that. The IDIs do not build torque as quickly and are happier revving higher and so it is desirable to have gearing 10-15% shorter than gearing for a TDI engine with similar peak horsepower output.

I constantly see people posting on this forum that there is no advantage to a 5-speed over a 4-speed which is nonsense. Yes, you can certainly achieve the same top gear ratios with either one, but doing so on the 4-speed is extremely difficult without creating an overly large gap somewhere. Doing so with the 5-speed is fairly easy with comfortable gaps on each of the shifts and even some room to finagle within those comfortable gaps for driving style and personal preference.

3,000 rpms @ 70 MPH is what close to what I would shoot for with a TDI but taller than what I would choose for an AAZ. On the AAZ I would aim more for 3400 rpms @ 70 and 3800@75. IMO, the AAP looks decent on paper for the AAZ but IMO a shorter R+P with taller 5th(DX with 4.86 or 4.83) would be better and help with starting in first with a similar top gear ratio.

[Waldi]

There is a difference between stock AAZ or pimped AAZ, also there is a difference between stock TDIs between 1Z and AFN or chiped TDIs.
If we speak about a stock AAZ with 75hp and 150 torque, ok this is a lame duck. But its more than easy to get same hp and torque like the stock 1Z.
My AAZ has now full turbo pressure (fixed at 1bar) at 2k.
A friend is programing the chip for AFN to remind the torque under 2k in favor of the gearboxes. Chiptuning in other direction.

I was driving with my syncro with JX (intercooler,1,2bar) a 4,85x0,78 with 205/80-16 and it was perfekt. Now im driving same gearbox with the pimped AAZ and its still perfekt. Pulling a trailer i change to smaller tires.

But i know the gearbox ratios depends alot of how and where you drive. From the taste of the driver. So i would never say, hey this is the only gearratio u can drive. I just can say, yes i have tried it and it works. Or not.

[Gizmoman]

[Gizmoman]

[Wildthings]