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dart330
Samba Member
Joined: July 19, 2004
Posts: 454
Location: Houston, TX
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 Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 12:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Can you post a link to the ebay seller and how the model was listed? All the results I see are for diesel units. |
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vanis13
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Joined: August 15, 2010
Posts: 3100
Location: ABQ NM USA.... Except when not
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Aimlesswanderlust
Samba Member
Joined: November 15, 2014
Posts: 1
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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Any updates on this? Did you get the Espar installed? Tried it out above 5k feet yet?
I was just about to get a Propex, but really hated needing to carry propane. Didn't know gas heaters existed until I saw this thread! |
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vanis13
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2010
Posts: 3100
Location: ABQ NM USA.... Except when not
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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Working on the Espar B4 install now.
Have some more pics to post when I have a chance.
Looking like it is fitting nicely in the hidden cabinet space behind the 110v outlets next to the water tank.
I also got the alt kit so expect no issues above 5k but still in the install stage so will need to report later on performance.
If you have diesel and don't need to camp is sub zero the D2 looks just like this but is smaller so even an easier install.
Some teaser shots.
It was easier to play with spacing by taking the heater out of its case.
The tube along the back is for supply air and the warm air will come out of the cabinet. I feel comfortable that enough supply air will be available considering the vent under the fridge, along the top behind the stove and the side of the fridge cabinet.
_________________
83.5 Westy with Subaru 2.5, 4 spd manual, center seat, COLD A/C on 134a!, Winter camp heated with an Espar B4 gasoline furnace
www.SuperVanagon.com - some stuff I make |
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HoustonPhotog
Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2013
Posts: 1514
Location: Houston, TX
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vanis13
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2010
Posts: 3100
Location: ABQ NM USA.... Except when not
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| Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 9:06 am Post subject: |
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Nice!
If you decice on the same outlet as I chose and have a clearance issues w.the outlet vent get in touch since I would make a small change of how I have it pictured above.
_________________
83.5 Westy with Subaru 2.5, 4 spd manual, center seat, COLD A/C on 134a!, Winter camp heated with an Espar B4 gasoline furnace
www.SuperVanagon.com - some stuff I make |
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vanis13
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2010
Posts: 3100
Location: ABQ NM USA.... Except when not
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| Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 2:15 pm Post subject: |
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Just finished the functional install and the thing seems to be heating fine.
Now for buttoning up the loose ends, re-install fridge, etc......
_________________
83.5 Westy with Subaru 2.5, 4 spd manual, center seat, COLD A/C on 134a!, Winter camp heated with an Espar B4 gasoline furnace
www.SuperVanagon.com - some stuff I make |
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HoustonPhotog
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Joined: February 20, 2013
Posts: 1514
Location: Houston, TX
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Jon_slider
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Joined: April 11, 2007
Posts: 5091
Location: Santa Cruz, Crowdifornia
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HoustonPhotog
Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2013
Posts: 1514
Location: Houston, TX
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Jon_slider
Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2007
Posts: 5091
Location: Santa Cruz, Crowdifornia
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syncrodoka
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2005
Posts: 12008
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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| HoustonPhotog wrote: |
MyWebasto gas version (sourced from Ebay) is sitting at home about to be installed... Can't wait.
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I am interested in your review of the air top 2000. They can be had for ~$400 less then the B1LC while they do still get favorable reviews overseas.
I have been considering getting that heater for some time now. |
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Jon_slider
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Joined: April 11, 2007
Posts: 5091
Location: Santa Cruz, Crowdifornia
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syncrodoka
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2005
Posts: 12008
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 12:56 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, I am aware of the alt adjustment but thanks for the links.
I have had an older B1L gas heater for a few years that I haven't installed but I am still interested in a stateside review of a webasto unit before I commit to installing mine. |
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davevickery
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Joined: July 16, 2005
Posts: 2887
Location: Fort Collins, CO
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| Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Jon_slider wrote: |
fwiw the B4 is 70% higher heat output than the D2 and uses twice the electric power. |
It' hard to see how you get double the power usage. On lower settings they use the same power. Only on higher settings do they use more power, but because of the higher heating capacity they are unlikely to be on high very long.
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youderian
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2014
Posts: 106
Location: Tuson, AZ
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| Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 8:20 am Post subject: |
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Really helpful thread. After freezing with the family during a sudden snow / windstorm yesterday on a longer trip in the van, this just became a priority add on!
Am leaning toward the Espar, but a bit intimidated by the install - particularly the part about tapping into the van's gas source. Can anyone tell me if you have to drill right into the gas tank, or if you can simply add a T line off of the existing fuel line going to the engine from the tank?
The install manual for Espar only showed drilling right into the tank....
Have a 90 Syncro tank / setup. Thanks!
_________________
1990 Westy Syncro with 2.5L |
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davevickery
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Joined: July 16, 2005
Posts: 2887
Location: Fort Collins, CO
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| Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 9:20 am Post subject: |
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Just put a tee into the gas line BEFORE the fuel pump. On a syncro it is trickier as the pump is right by the tank and only a short hose between them.
It shouldn't be much different than installing a propex. 2 holes for exhaust through the floor, hook up power and gas line and mount the thermostat. When I had an old BN-4, I mounted the fuel pump in the fender well (inside a piece of bicycle tube to keep the crap away). That style ticked and having it inside I could hear it. I think these are the same. Plus then it is outside.
I'd get the Espar unless you get the smaller Webasto. The Webasto units have some extra features and cost a bit more, but with my EVO 3900 I just noticed the lowest heat setting is 5K BTUs. I may have to keep the top open just to keep it running on low  It should be fine in winter, but fall/spring it may be too much. The Webasto will cycle completely off, but having it run on low is better, no startup noise. Oh well, that's what I have.
I also noticed the power draw is less on the BN4 or the B1LC compared to the Webasto. The smaller one would be nice for size. If you compared the big one to the small one, you would be surprised at the size of it. But the heat out would be nice, particular on the BN4 since it will go on low at 3400 BTUs vs. the B1 of 2900 which isn't much difference.
Look at the specs on the Espar above. Those are the diesel unis, but not much difference in fuel, output or power. On low they use 1/10 liter per hour. It would run all nice on a quart of gas. Awesome.
The few comments on altitude are nonsense. They make a high altitude pump that just decreases fuel. The controllers are used to maximize heat at lower altitudes and only adjust at high altitudes, but you can run a lower output pump at any altitude. I've also read plenty of sportsmobile threads saying it was never an issue with the stock pump.
Post up pics when you get one. |
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youderian
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2014
Posts: 106
Location: Tuson, AZ
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| Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 9:28 am Post subject: |
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| davevickery wrote: |
Just put a tee into the gas line BEFORE the fuel pump. On a syncro it is trickier as the pump is right by the tank and only a short hose between them.
It shouldn't be much different than installing a propex. 2 holes for exhaust through the floor, hook up power and gas line and mount the thermostat. When I had an old BN-4, I mounted the fuel pump in the fender well (inside a piece of bicycle tube to keep the crap away). That style ticked and having it inside I could hear it. I think these are the same. Plus then it is outside.
I'd get the Espar unless you get the smaller Webasto. The Webasto units have some extra features and cost a bit more, but with my EVO 3900 I just noticed the lowest heat setting is 5K BTUs. I may have to keep the top open just to keep it running on low It should be fine in winter, but fall/spring it may be too much. The Webasto will cycle completely off, but having it run on low is better, no startup noise. Oh well, that's what I have.
I also noticed the power draw is less on the BN4 or the B1LC compared to the Webasto. The smaller one would be nice for size. If you compared the big one to the small one, you would be surprised at the size of it. But the heat out would be nice, particular on the BN4 since it will go on low at 3400 BTUs vs. the B1 of 2900 which isn't much difference.
Look at the specs on the Espar above. Those are the diesel unis, but not much difference in fuel, output or power. On low they use 1/10 liter per hour. It would run all nice on a quart of gas. Awesome.
The few comments on altitude are nonsense. They make a high altitude pump that just decreases fuel. The controllers are used to maximize heat at lower altitudes and only adjust at high altitudes, but you can run a lower output pump at any altitude. I've also read plenty of sportsmobile threads saying it was never an issue with the stock pump.
Post up pics when you get one. |
Super helpful. Thanks Dave! Will definitely post pics up when it's all finished.
_________________
1990 Westy Syncro with 2.5L |
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1vw4x4
Banned
Joined: June 22, 2005
Posts: 472
Location: Pgh. PA
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| Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 10:19 am Post subject: |
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You have something wrong with your cooling system if you were freezing
while on a trip (driving). Forget the heater, fix the cooling system. I've driven my syncro in negative numbers temps. ... takes a while but if
everything is in working order, you will be in a tee-shirt with both heaters
running full blast. I really enjoy walking into a convenience store with
no coat, after a drive when the temps. are very cold. People stare
at you funny. You get some ice creme, and jump back into your
100deg. vanagon. Only reason for these heater is if you are not running
the engine. Poor heat output is a good way to tell if the cooling system
is not working properly....
| youderian wrote: |
Really helpful thread. After freezing with the family during a sudden snow / windstorm yesterday on a longer trip in the van, this just became a priority add on!
Am leaning toward the Espar, but a bit intimidated by the install - particularly the part about tapping into the van's gas source. Can anyone tell me if you have to drill right into the gas tank, or if you can simply add a T line off of the existing fuel line going to the engine from the tank?
The install manual for Espar only showed drilling right into the tank....
Have a 90 Syncro tank / setup. Thanks! |
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msewalson
Samba Member
Joined: September 14, 2009
Posts: 544
Location: Grand Junction, Colorado
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| Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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| 1vw4x4 wrote: |
You have something wrong with your cooling system if you were freezing
while on a trip (driving). Forget the heater, fix the cooling system. I've driven my syncro in negative numbers temps. ... takes a while but if
everything is in working order, you will be in a tee-shirt with both heaters
running full blast. I really enjoy walking into a convenience store with
no coat, after a drive when the temps. are very cold. People stare
at you funny. You get some ice creme, and jump back into your
100deg. vanagon. Only reason for these heater is if you are not running
the engine. Poor heat output is a good way to tell if the cooling system
is not working properly.... |
Might be jumping to conclusions here. Maybe the rear heater has been pulled from his van or the heater cores could be bad. I guess one could consider the heater cores as being part of the cooling system but I necessarily don't.
I have also been considering a heater like either the Webatso or Espar since my rear heater core is due for replacement. Obviously replacing the core and valve would be a lot cheaper than one of these heaters. But, an aux. heater running off a combustible fuel could be used to heat the rear portion of the van while driving and be extremely useful in winter camping conditions. I would go with a gasoline heater since I have a converted tintop camper and don't have a propane tank. When figuring the cost of an LP tank and Propex heater you would come close to the cost of one of these units. Then figuring in the convenience factor of operating on just one fuel is huge and a major selling point for me. It would be great if one or some of the major vendors started to carry aux. heaters that operate off of gasoline. I know I would probably purchase one from them if priced competitively.
One model that I don't think has been mentioned yet is the Espar Airtronic B1LC. http://www.esparparts.com/heaters-espar-airtronic-b1lc-c-860_1005.html . I'm waiting to hear back from them on price.
Matt
_________________
87 Syncro w/EJ22
Last edited by msewalson on Sun Nov 30, 2014 6:20 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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