Distributor and trigger points - running rough

[vwsplitvan]

Almost have my Cali import Squareback ready for MOT.

But the car is running rough, like its not firing on all 4.

I am after some advice on the trigger points as not had these on a VW before.

The square is a 71 auto FI. It had been sat off the road in a yard in California for many years before I purchased it.

I decided to take a look at the dizzy as everything else I have been through. New injectors, new fuel lines, valves adjusted, points adjusted, Injector connections checked etc

I removed the trigger points from the bottom of the dizzy and they looked to be in nice condition. But the lobe inside the dizzy had rust on the raised parts prob from lack of use for years. I tried to clean it up and it is a bit better than before. See pic Would this cause the injectors not to fire correctly and what is the best thing to do?

Just after advice on how to remove the rust.

Hopefully there are some guys that know there stuff on here

thanks in advance, looking forward to driving the square.

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SBS #20 UK

RHD 62 Ragtop Beetle Beryl Green
LHD 69 Squareback Peru Green
LHD 63 Splitscreen Highroof Pearl White

[Donnie strickland]

You could try some steel wool, or perhaps a Dremel with a tiny wire brush. I doubt that makes any difference in the running, though. Have you checked your fuel pressure? Also check your plug wires.
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71 Elm Green FI A/T Squareback

[vwsplitvan]

Thanks Donnie

I have installed new Bosch plug leads. All in correct order.

But not tested the fuel pressure yet. I will do that.

I would struggle to get a Dremel in there. Will try a bit of wire wool then clean out after.
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SBS #20 UK

RHD 62 Ragtop Beetle Beryl Green
LHD 69 Squareback Peru Green
LHD 63 Splitscreen Highroof Pearl White

[Mike Fisher]

Did you pull individual injector wires when it's running to determine which cylinders aren't firing? Sometimes it is even 2 cylinders not firing. Trigger points can cause 2 cylinders not to fire.
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https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold

Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey

[vwsplitvan]

Not tried that Mike.

Quick rundown:

To start with when I first got the car running (the engine was seized when I got it) diesel down cylinders and it freed up.

New fuel lines throughout, and a number of wires that had been chewed by rodents now fixed.
Washed out fuel tank and fitted new sock mesh, and fuel filter.
Replaced oil.
Changed out ATF
New battery

first time I drove it round farm was at walking pace as it had no brakes. But it revved up fine, after 10 mins it died and would not restart .

As I checked over the car I noticed I had left a clamp on the return fuel line. I removed it and eventually got the car started again but did not sound to good.

I checked all the FI connections and tweaked the crimps so connections were good.

When you go to rev the car it just dies like its air rather than fuel . and the tick over sounds like a tractor, definitely not right. Under load it just fluffs and conks out.

Any ideas from the symptoms.

I am going to check fuel pressure next.
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SBS #20 UK

RHD 62 Ragtop Beetle Beryl Green
LHD 69 Squareback Peru Green
LHD 63 Splitscreen Highroof Pearl White

[WhiteWhiskey]

After you clean and lube the distributor put the trigger points in and you can power on without putting the distributor in and spin it by hand. You should be able to here the injectors fire in pairs. If you can here the injectors firing in 2 pairs the points are good and reinstall the distributor. Make sure your connection to the trigger points is good. As the car heats so will that connector and it could be losing connection. Also I would get a fuel pressure gauge on the car. Make sure you are about 30 psi some people say a little less some say a little more up to you. At idle you should maintain 30 psi as well as when driving even under load. If you do not then you have a fuel delivery issue. Could be the pump, maybe a clogged filter or some other restriction prior to the fuel pump. The pump could be starving for fuel. For example one problem I encountered before was with a fuel filter I had on one of my squarebacks when I first got it running. Even though I had a brand new filter it did not flow enough and was starving the pump and I had similar symptoms to you it seems.

Good Luck

[Tram]

1. Check fuel pressure
2. Look for a disconnected vacuum line- especially the one for the auto trans at the bottom of the intake plenum.

Let us know what you find.
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Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.

[vwsplitvan]

I need to buy a fuel pressure gauge so I can test the PSI.

Currently the car just cranks but does not fire. This is since I adjusted the valves. So I checked and did the valves again. Still just cranks.

WhiteWhiskey
Took a quick look at the distributor. Removed it from engine again and turned by hand with cap off and the ignition on, I cannot hear the injectors firing. I can just feel the rotor catch / drag once per revolution.

I had previously removed the trigger points and brushed out the dried rust/grease and cleaned gently with a piece of card.

Thanks Tram, I will check the fuel pressure and the vacuum lines and then go from there. Should get some time next week. Gutted as so close to being ready for MOT, (then I can register the square), just want to get it running right and on the FI.
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SBS #20 UK

RHD 62 Ragtop Beetle Beryl Green
LHD 69 Squareback Peru Green
LHD 63 Splitscreen Highroof Pearl White

[Mike Fisher]

If you unbolt your pairs of injectors you can watch them spray gas on top of the engine if they are firing & flowing gas. I used a 0-100lb water pressure gauge form Home Depot to rig up a fuel pressure gauge.
_________________
https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold

Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey

[vwsplitvan]

I tried that test when the engine was running (not great) a few weeks back and 1 and 2 sprayed an even cone of fuel, 3 and 4 were a bit intermittent so tweaked the connections and they seemed to spray fine after that. But engine still ran crappy. That is when I checked valves and after that it would not start so went on to look at the trigger points.

I have a few things to check out, I will report back. Thanks for all the advice.
_________________
SBS #20 UK

RHD 62 Ragtop Beetle Beryl Green
LHD 69 Squareback Peru Green
LHD 63 Splitscreen Highroof Pearl White

[Mike Fisher]

Pull the spark plug wires & see if the are firing.
_________________
https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold

Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey

[vwsplitvan]

Fuel pressure tester arrived.

Fixed up and tested the pressure. The test gauge only reads up to 10psi WTF. So on the look out again for one that can read 30psi.
_________________
SBS #20 UK

RHD 62 Ragtop Beetle Beryl Green
LHD 69 Squareback Peru Green
LHD 63 Splitscreen Highroof Pearl White

[KTPhil]

[vwsplitvan]

Ok got a few mins on car, checked for spark and it is good and strong.

I will get down the hardware store and find a water pressure gauge that I can use.
_________________
SBS #20 UK

RHD 62 Ragtop Beetle Beryl Green
LHD 69 Squareback Peru Green
LHD 63 Splitscreen Highroof Pearl White

[vwsplitvan]

Not sorted the pressure tester out yet, but have a feeling that is not the issue.

Quick update

I checked for spark, It was nice and strong, checked on all plugs and spark strong.

Then did some checks on the injector electronic plugs and they are not receiving any pulse, or power.

All connections are looking good, earth to engine case good.

Where should I be looking to trace the power for the Injectors ?

What would have failed to cause this ?

Any pointers from the FI gurus please
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SBS #20 UK

RHD 62 Ragtop Beetle Beryl Green
LHD 69 Squareback Peru Green
LHD 63 Splitscreen Highroof Pearl White

[Donnie strickland]

Double check that harness plug for the trigger points. If it's not making contact the injectors won't fire.
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71 Elm Green FI A/T Squareback

[Clatter]

Have you been through the 'fuel injection relief' sticky?
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Bus Motor Build

What’s That Noise?!?

[vwsplitvan]

Yes Clatter spent many hours reading thru that thread. Great info.

Was starting to get all down with the square. Been thru all the connections 3 or 4 times, checked and tested all connections. Narrowed it down to there being no trigger pulse.

I had a spare manual motor in the garage so pulled the distributor and took the trigger points out and swapped them into mine, BINGO! motor fired right up and sounds much better

Quick drive round farm and it pulls well, but could do with some fine tuning.

Great feeling that its going again, I was loosing hope on the FI.

Yeah I know only half polished it
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SBS #20 UK

RHD 62 Ragtop Beetle Beryl Green
LHD 69 Squareback Peru Green
LHD 63 Splitscreen Highroof Pearl White

[Bobnotch]