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rgalla9146 Samba Member
Joined: July 27, 2005 Posts: 9
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 6:13 am Post subject: Vanagon / Boxster engine |
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Hi
I hope this has not been covered.
I think it's a twist on a old question.
I want to put a Boxster engine in my 89 Westy.
Will a Boxster engine work with a Vanagon trans ?
Is a 915 trans adaptable to a Boxster engine ? to a Vanagon ?
I understand that the engine is too tall for the stock engine cover.
I can work on that ( lower the stock manifold or fabricate a custom )
I know about the SVX but would rather keep it all in the family
And yes, I do know about IMS issues.
TIA
Rory |
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fraggle00 Samba Member
Joined: October 19, 2011 Posts: 356 Location: Bristow, VA
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:12 am Post subject: |
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The Boxter is in a mid-engine location, so you would need to adapt either a vanagon or other transmission.
The Porsche support systems and electronics is extensive. Best to start with an entire car and strip what you need. _________________ '91 Vanagon Carat
'87 Porsche 928S4 DOWN
'12 Fiat 500 Abarth |
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'88MoneyPit Samba Member
Joined: August 26, 2013 Posts: 146 Location: California
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 8:13 am Post subject: |
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Not that i dont love a cool idea, but why this engine? I undderstand the "why not?" response, but if you want a german power plant, and have to raise the deck lid, why not use a 1.8t?
S |
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insyncro Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 15086 Location: New York
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:09 am Post subject: |
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There are much better and way more cost effective conversions.
Go for it
Love that Porsche sound. |
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Zeitgeist 13 Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009 Posts: 12115 Location: Port Manteau
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:14 am Post subject: |
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I personally would never choose a flat engine for this application, but I suspect the bellhousing pattern on those would almost necessitate the use of a modern rear engine Porsche 911 transaxle $$$ _________________ Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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Tristar Eric Samba Member
Joined: July 25, 2004 Posts: 1242 Location: Portland, Or
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:20 am Post subject: |
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As much as I love Porsche, you have to ask yourself, what am I converting my Vanagon engine for?
1. to have bragging rights?
2. Driveablity?
3. Power?
4. reliability?
5. For the exercise and learning
There are better bang for the buck options available that are well supported. _________________ Vanagon/Transporter flares here: www.terrawagen.com
[email protected] |
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xoo00oox Samba Member
Joined: February 11, 2010 Posts: 2672 Location: East Nassau, NY
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 11:13 am Post subject: |
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Zeitgeist 13 wrote: |
I personally would never choose a flat engine for this application, but I suspect the bellhousing pattern on those would almost necessitate the use of a modern rear engine Porsche 911 transaxle $$$ |
That Boxtser comes from the factory with the same transmission as a B5 Passat. I've got one in my garage right now that I just bought with a bad engine. I'm considering attempting to bolt a TDi up to it. That would be a cool Boxster. |
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D Clymer Samba Member
Joined: December 22, 2005 Posts: 2978 Location: Issaquah, WA
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 11:16 am Post subject: Re: Vanagon / Boxster engine |
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rgalla9146 wrote: |
Hi
I hope this has not been covered.
I think it's a twist on a old question.
I want to put a Boxster engine in my 89 Westy.
Will a Boxster engine work with a Vanagon trans ?
Is a 915 trans adaptable to a Boxster engine ? to a Vanagon ?
I understand that the engine is too tall for the stock engine cover.
I can work on that ( lower the stock manifold or fabricate a custom )
I know about the SVX but would rather keep it all in the family
And yes, I do know about IMS issues.
TIA
Rory |
The Boxster (M96) family of engines actually shares the bellhousing pattern more or less with the Audi V6/V8/I5. The 915 transaxle had a bellhousing layout more like a VW Type 1, so the Boxster engine won't bolt up to a 915 transaxle. It will bolt up to a G96 6 speed transaxle out of Porsche 996, though, so that would be your best bet. The G96 actually isn't as expensive as you might think. It doesn't have a provision for mounting the starter, so it isn't useful to kit car builders the way the G50 is. You can get a G96 trans for $2000 to $2500 and that's a good value as far as upgraded transmissions go.
The intake manifold is indeed tall on the M96 engines and you can't really shorten it because there are engine accessories mounted under it. You'd probably have to go with a raised deck.
If I were doing this swap, I would go with the earliest version of the wiring and ecu because the early ones had a cable throlttle and no immobilizer to get around.
If you have the fabrication skills, I say go for it. This engine family has had other issues besides the IMS bearing, but as long as you know which version to choose, you should be fine.
Dave |
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svenakela Samba Member
Joined: July 19, 2006 Posts: 776 Location: Ekerö
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 11:29 am Post subject: |
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xoo00oox wrote: |
Zeitgeist 13 wrote: |
I personally would never choose a flat engine for this application, but I suspect the bellhousing pattern on those would almost necessitate the use of a modern rear engine Porsche 911 transaxle $$$ |
That Boxtser comes from the factory with the same transmission as a B5 Passat. I've got one in my garage right now that I just bought with a bad engine. I'm considering attempting to bolt a TDi up to it. That would be a cool Boxster. |
And with some handy work you can turn the tranny upside down and have the engine where it should be. No, wait... ....that's already done! |
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caravelle c Banned
Joined: November 03, 2014 Posts: 153 Location: Bavaria-Germany
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alijonny Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2007 Posts: 328 Location: Des Plaines, IL
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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if you are going thru the hassle of dropping the Japanese designed Boxter engine into your Van, why not drop a little extra dough on a 997 engine? _________________ 1965 Beetle
1990 Syncro Westfalia
1983 Westfalia |
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AustinVan Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2013 Posts: 63 Location: Austin, Texas and others
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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love the idea.
The question you need to ask is why not a 1.8T with APR tune. You can easily get close to Boxster power figures going this route. |
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'88MoneyPit Samba Member
Joined: August 26, 2013 Posts: 146 Location: California
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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SAH 1.8t with performance exhaust and APR tune = approx 250-260 hp i've been told. If i can spin the tires on my westy, that's enough hp!
S |
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fraggle00 Samba Member
Joined: October 19, 2011 Posts: 356 Location: Bristow, VA
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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OP didn't ask why, just how.
I'd go with a 996 with a tiptronic if I could fab it in such a way I did not have to raise the rear deck. Boxters may be easier to come by, but the transmission turns the wrong way. If you're going to fab this stuff up, might as well go with the Porsche engine and transaxle as a unit. The rear suspension could come with it, given the need to fab most of the "kit" anyway. Then, you could also salvage the computers and control systems. _________________ '91 Vanagon Carat
'87 Porsche 928S4 DOWN
'12 Fiat 500 Abarth |
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'88MoneyPit Samba Member
Joined: August 26, 2013 Posts: 146 Location: California
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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I wonder if subigears could cut a reverse ring gear? Toptronic in a bus would cool.
S |
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Tristar Eric Samba Member
Joined: July 25, 2004 Posts: 1242 Location: Portland, Or
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Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 11:34 pm Post subject: |
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Porsche did a factory 3.2 Carrera powered Vanagon in 85 called the B32. Total production was 11 units. They used the 915 transaxle. The engine compartment is raised about 6 inches for the 3.2
_________________ Vanagon/Transporter flares here: www.terrawagen.com
[email protected] |
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Merian Samba Member
Joined: January 04, 2014 Posts: 5212 Location: Orygun
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Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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alijonny wrote: |
if you are going thru the hassle of dropping the Japanese designed Boxter engine into your Van, why not drop a little extra dough on a 997 engine? |
2 errors in a single post....
but, yes, a "911" motor is what you want; why not the 'cheaper; 996? - or see if you can shovel in a DSG also
money is no object, right?? |
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fraggle00 Samba Member
Joined: October 19, 2011 Posts: 356 Location: Bristow, VA
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Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 5:11 pm Post subject: |
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The elusive B32!
In '85 that would have been air cooled. Updating the concept to a water cooled motor would be ideal. It should be shorter, eliminating the need to bump up the deck higher to clear the air cooling fan and ducting.
With a Carrera 996+tiptronic, no need to move ring gears or anything around, the configuration is already proper, rear engine and mid-mount transaxle. The tough part would be how to get everything to work with the excessive porsche electronic control systems, hence the desire for a front end wrecked base model Carrera as a starting point. _________________ '91 Vanagon Carat
'87 Porsche 928S4 DOWN
'12 Fiat 500 Abarth |
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D Clymer Samba Member
Joined: December 22, 2005 Posts: 2978 Location: Issaquah, WA
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Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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fraggle00 wrote: |
The elusive B32!
In '85 that would have been air cooled. Updating the concept to a water cooled motor would be ideal. It should be shorter, eliminating the need to bump up the deck higher to clear the air cooling fan and ducting.
With a Carrera 996+tiptronic, no need to move ring gears or anything around, the configuration is already proper, rear engine and mid-mount transaxle. The tough part would be how to get everything to work with the excessive porsche electronic control systems, hence the desire for a front end wrecked base model Carrera as a starting point. |
Actually, the watercooled series of 911 engines is just as tall as its air-cooled predecessor. Porsche configured the engine around the available space and came up with another tall engine. So, unfortunately, you would have to raise the rear deck for the newer engines too.
Dave |
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240Gordy Samba Member
Joined: May 15, 2008 Posts: 2354 Location: Vancouver, BC
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Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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The transmission is flippable?
Which way is it oriented in the B5? _________________ Tencentlife said,
"So, now that you know what you're doing, go to town."
2010 GOLF TRENDLINE 2.5
1985 GL now with more! a 2.1L
H&R SPORT(RED) Springs FRONT , SLAM SPECIALTIES RE6 AIRBAGS REAR |
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