Porsche 944

[norcalmike]

Anybody a fan of the 944? I had one about 8 years ago and am currently looking for another nice original car.
This site isnt exactly 944 friendly, but Im sure someone here can share a 944 story.
I personally think they are great cars and although they carry the maintenance expense of a Porsche, they still are one of the most affordable Porsches around

[Jon Schmid]

There's a reason they're affordable. (Not meant to be unfriendly).

[my59]

I keep hearing that they were the poor man's Porsche.
I thought that was what 914's were supposed to be.
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my59: Well son, my grandfather died before I got to drive it, so does that answer your question?
our79: sunroof bus w/camper interior and 2.0 FI
Other:'12 Jetta, '77 Benz 300D, and a 74 MG Midget.

[Letterman7]

Parts are getting scarce, so not so affordable anymore. My brother is a fan of just about all things Porsche (and also in the San Jose area), and he had a turbo 944 that he took me for a ride in. Scared the crap out of me coming down whatever mountain road he lived on. Anyway, he loved that car and never had much negative to say about the 944 in general. The 924, however...

[Glenn]

[drscope]

I've had several 944's and love them. Still have one.

I prefer the standard bottom of the line 944 over the S or the turbo for street use. They burn regular gas and the insurance costs the same as for my mini van.

A while back I had 3 of them as pick up and delivery cars for my business. The expense of maintaining them was FAR less then the Hondas we had that the 944's replaced.

I had all young guys driving for me, most under 24 and they held up very well to the abuse and neglect.

In addition to the daily chore of being driven nearly 200 miles a day, they were also used on the weekends as track cars. In addition to sending everyone who worked for me through accident avoidance school at Summit Point Raceway, I also encouraged all my employees to do autocross and time trials with the company cars.

Biggest annoyance for us was the rear hatch. But we were opening that 15 to 20 times a day 5 days a week. On one car we replaced the rear hatch struts with new heavy duty struts and a short time latter the rear glass started to separate from the frame. After that if any of the cars had struts that got weak, we simply carried a prop rod in the back of the car. Not as convenient, but it got the job done and we never had any more glass separation issues.

Clutch job? Yep the dealer wanted a few bucks to do that job. I think we were quoted $2,500 for labor, so we did it here ourselves. Not as big a deal as you think. They came standard with a rubber center clutch disc and if you abused it the center would break out. But there is a spring center disc available.

When they made the big change on 85.5, the cars got a lot nicer. Much more comfortable seats and much better looking interior and dash.

If you want to get involved racing them there are a few things to consider. The early pre 85.5 cars had sheet metal lower front A-arms just like the Golf and Jetta. When you mount a big sway bar to them they would break. But they did the same thing when you mounted a big sway bar to a Golf or Jetta.

To eliminate this problem we beefed up the sheet metal a-arms.

They also have a tendency doing track events to loose the #2 rod bearing. There is a popular cross drilling of the rod journal that takes care of that problem.

After 85.5 they got the aluminum a-arms. The ball joints on those are glued in and it's not something you can replace your self. So you usually do an a-arm exchange when the ball joints wear out.

If you break a timing belt it bends valves.

They are prone to developing a small crack down in the battery well that allows rain water to come inside the cabin. That water normally runs down under the carpet. The front floor carpet stays dry but you get a puddle in the foot well of the back seat on the passenger's side. Best fix for this is to clean the area and seal it with a bead of RTV. Welding it up only causes the crack to move next to the weld.

The cars are getting harder to find. But for a long time they were one of the best used car deals going.
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Mother Nature is a Mean Evil Bitch!

[norcalmike]

Wow. Thanks for the insight dr scope. I will keep all of that in mind.
I do plan on tracking it occasionally. I'm still torn between the early or late model.
I'm in no hurry. I'm gonna wait until a nice well maintained car comes along

[drscope]

Trying to decide between an early or late car can be confusing and frustrating.

Our first 944 was an 87 – a late car. Since this was a company car and we had a fleet we always tried to have the cars the same so it was easier to stock consumable parts. I found a really nice 84 for sale and bought it in the hopes of being able to swap out the same parts stock. I had a lot to learn.

The cars underwent major changes in the 85.5 model. For us, some of the more frustrating issues were these.

Brakes. The calipers changed. So we couldn’t have 1 set of calipers on the shelf to fit both cars.

Wheels. While the tire size remained the same, the wheel offsets changed. We couldn’t run the early offset cookie cutters on the latter cars without some tire rub. And if you put the latter phone dials on an early car it looked really silly because the tires were tucked way under the body. (looked like the car would fall over if the wind blew) So we couldn’t really have a single stock of tires mounted and ready to go.

The windshields also changed and the later cars had the radio antenna in the new glass. This is something you need to be VERY aware of if you ever need to get the windshield replaced! BEFORE you let the glass guy have the car, make SURE you get with them and see that the radio works and gets reception. Then before you pay them, make sure you get with them and check that it still works!

The wire on the glass goes to a special box and it’s really easy for them to break this when doing the glass install. If you don’t verify with them that the radio works BEFORE they get started, they won’t cover the cost of replacing the wiring they break during the install. Putting an employee in a car that has no radio reception and making them drive for 6 to 8 hours a day is not good for employer/employee relations!

Since our cars were doing serious miles every day in all sorts of conditions, we replaced quite a few windshields during the time we had them.

Under the hood most things remained the same. The latter cars replaced the cast iron header with a much nicer tube header.

They also got an oil level light controlled by a float in the oil pan. This was a nice feature. But it could cause some irritation if you parked on a hill. If you start the car when the float is down the light comes on and stays on until you shut the car off and restart it with the float in the correct level. So sometimes if you parked on a hill the light will come on. Then you have to get to a level spot, turn the car off and restart it to make the light go out.

The latter seats are MUCH more comfortable. And we actually swapped out the seats in our early cars for latter seats.

Early cars had a manual sun roof while the latter cars got electric. The sun roof only opens in the rear, or you need to take it completely out. It doesn’t go back in the roof like most other cars because there just isn’t room for it to do that. This is sort of a pain if you like to take the roof out. It’s a little difficult to deal with when trying to put it back in by yourself if you are short or not real strong. The cars all came with a special storage bag to put the roof in when it was removed. But the roof panel is pretty big, so if you put it in the back of the car it takes up most of the floor of your storage area.

Plus, because of the rake of the windshield, the sun roof opening is really behind your head when driving. So for us at least in our part of the country, we probably only drove around with the panel out 2 times a year. On the latter cars this was always an ordeal because there is a special key sequence you needed to do in order to unlock the roof from the mechanism that raises and lowers it. Since we only did this once in a while, it was easy to forget what they special key sequence was.

As a track car or an autocross car they are one of the best handling cars Porsche ever produced. The 52/48 weight bias has a lot to do with that. This also made it very easy to really tune the chassis with simple sway bar adjustments for the given conditions.

All in all they are really good cars. The latter cars are much more refined then the early cars and if I was looking for another one to drive on the street I would probably stay away from the early ones unless it was a spectacular deal. But for a dedicated track car I would go either way.
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Mother Nature is a Mean Evil Bitch!

[norcalmike]

I have been leaning towards a later car due to the improvements. This will be a daily driver so I will take all the comforts I can get. I'll be looking at a few 87s this week in the 3k range. The one I'm leaning toward the most has records and a recent clutch but it does have 150k on the clock. Mileage doesn't scare me as long as it's been kept up.
I'm very picky about what car I go with. I'm willing to wait for that gem to come along.

Also, a 1992 968 came up. also very well maintained with a lot of work done including clutch for $7k. I dont know much about the 968s

[Jon Schmid]

The 968 has a bigger engine for starters. The convertibles don't look half bad. And, they were built in the Porsche factory in Zuffenhausen and not at an Audi factory. If you're going with the 924/944/968 line and you find a nice 968, I would look at it first.

[skills@eurocarsplus]

[old DKP driver]

Hi Mike, I think drscope has pretty much covered quite alot of info for all the
different 944 models through the years and alot of important items to consider
too.

I worked at Anderson-Behl as a tech from late 76 until 85 when i hurt my back doing under dash work on an Audi 5000 and also went to school both on the 924 & 944 but really only did a few jobs on either but, i still remember the
Big difference in power over the 924 since most test drives were from
Stevens Creek to 17 and to Los Gatos long before highway 85.

There is a Gentleman that used to write for the SF Chron. named "Bill Underwood that Still has a website and posts almost daily about his 944
Cars he has owned over the years. And his near Death experiences on HIGHWAY 9 & 35..

i ACTUALLY think he drove highway 9 like I and others did in the 70's
Parking lights Only on Full Moon Nights.. using only the Bott's Dot's for
guidance.

Good Luck with your NEW toy when you find it
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V.W.owner since 1967

[norcalmike]

Thanks! I have a wanted ad on Craigslist and I got a hit this morning on a nice, well maintained car owned by an enthusiast. He is selling off some things to travel the country and his cherished 87 944 is one of the things he has decided to part with. Tons of recent maintenance with records, Original paint and always garaged
Im going to see it tomorrow morning. sounds like this may be "the one"
Ill keep you all posted.

[drscope]

Just about all my experience has been with the standard, 2 valve 944 and not the 4 valve S or turbo models, but here’s what we have found.

As far as miles go, when it comes to the engine there is little to actually worry about.
I apologize for the long posts but I hope somebody benefits from reading along.

Shortly after I purchased my first 944 a close friend fell in love with the car and bought one of his own. My car being a company car and doing double duty as a track car was never cosmetically nice, but he found a really nice clean car and bought it. It came with all the service records and maintenance history.

About two weeks latter that car burned a valve. After about a week of feeling sick looking under the hood worrying about how bad this job was going to be we finally jumped in and began working on it.

What we discovered was that someone had put two intake manifold gaskets under one runner where it met the head and then missed the next cylinder. Turned out according to the records that this was actually a Porsche Dealer job!

That cylinder without a gasket leaned out and burned the valve. Anyway we pulled the head and replaced the valve.

That engine had over 125,000 miles on it. There was NO measurable wear in the cylinders.

A while latter something bad happened to my 944. While one of the office girls was driving it the water pump locked up. When the warning lights came on and the car started running badly she drove towards the office as fast as she could. She almost made it before it stopped running.

It got real hot. Enough to break the piston rings and badly score the cylinder walls. Aluminum has a tendency to loose dimensional stability after it has been overheated, so needless to say we decided to throw the towel in on that engine and not re-use any of it.

That engine was well past 175,000 miles at the time and it also had NO measurable wear in the cylinders.

I purchased a disassembled basket case engine from a friend who was racing 944’s at the time. We had no information on that engine’s history, but it also had NO measurable wear in the cylinders.

Our very high mileage 84 broke a timing belt, bent a few valves and when we had it apart it had NO measurable wear in the cylinders.

Biggest issues under the hood with high mileage cars seem to be the balance shaft seals leaking. That’s not a big deal to fix, but there isn’t a lot of room to do it while the engine is in the car.
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Mother Nature is a Mean Evil Bitch!

[MOCHABILL]

[norcalmike]

[norcalmike]

Well, the car was everything I hoped it would be and more. Almost perfect. Interior is MINT.
This guy knew Porsches well and knew how to take care of it. All belts, water pump and clutch done within last few years. drives like a dream! I am in love!

[drscope]

Gee, looks a lot like our 88!

Looks as if it has been taken very good care of. I think you found a winner!
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Mother Nature is a Mean Evil Bitch!

[norcalmike]

Nice! Love the Fuchs. My 84 had the Fuch option

[MOCHABILL]