Still no gas getting to '64 Beetle engine

George Stimson

Revisiting the problem first discussed here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=606963&highlight=
I still am not getting gas flow back to the engine. (Eight gallons of gas currently in the tank.)
When we took the tank out to drain it the gas drained out into a gas can as fast as it seemed it could, so I'm ass-uming the flow out of the tank is okay.
The cloth line between the tank and the metal line coming out of the front of the tunnel is new and not kinked. (I can move it around freely with my hand.)
I ran weedeater line through the metal line in the tunnel front to back and back to front six or eight time each direction. When I blew compressed air through this line it seemed to be as unobstructed as it could be.
I am able to get a dribbly flow out of the metal tunnel line where it comes out in back and goes into the cloth line (before the next short stretch of metal line, after which is the line going to the fuel pump. All cloth lines are new and not kinked.). But I'm still not getting enough gas to make it into the fuel pump, and eventually the dribbly flow stops.
Is it possible to be able to run weedeater line through the tunnel line, seemingly freely, several times in each direction and have an apparent clear air flow but still have enough obstruction that gas wouldn't flow sufficiently?
As for Plan B. what's the best way for me to run another fuel line to the back of the car without taking the whole car apart to get it through the tunnel?
This is a very frustrating problem: a beautiful '64 Bug just dying to start and run but not able to!

planenut

I may have missed something, but have you considered that your fuel pump may be inoperative?

George Stimson · Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 5:17 pm Post subject:

No I haven't, but since I'm not even getting fuel to the pump (which came as new in a 6 to 12 volt conversion kit) I don't know why that would be an issue. Shouldn't fuel flow at least as far as the pump on its own? I'm not getting fuel as far as going into the metal line that goes through the firewall to the engine.

planenut · Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 5:23 pm Post subject:

If the car is fairly level, you should get some. On the other hand, the inlet side of the pump should suck fuel.

57BLITZ

George Stimson · Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 7:09 pm Post subject:

Yes, the weedeater line came all the way through. I was able to pull it out. And I could run it completely through from front to back and from back to front, several times each way.

rcroane · Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 7:16 pm Post subject:

Have you tried disconnecting the line from the carb and turning the engine over to see if fuel pumps out (into a container of course!)?

hitest · Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 7:45 pm Post subject:

61SNRF · Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 7:59 pm Post subject:

Basically, you are trying to break through the built up rust scale on the inside of a small steel pipe. A weed-eater line is pretty small, so naturally will only produce a small stream of fuel.
Even then, anything bigger might just induce a pinhole leak or blowout anyway, so I'd suggest moving on to the other alternative for now.

Essentially you run an external steel replacement on the right side of the tunnel to mirror how the brake pipe is done on the left, as in by using anti-wear grommets/bushings through the bulkheads and fastened firmly down all along the way. All you have to do is remove the gas tank, seats and floor coverings.

The -'65 Bentley outlines the factory recommended routing, with pictures and text. This topic has come up here recently, but I don't have a scan of the instructions provided in that post.
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George Stimson · Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:34 pm Post subject:

hitest,

The reason the topic got dropped before is because I ran out of money and time to work on the project (not to mention not having any help) and so it got delayed until just recently. I apologize if my departure was abrupt and rude.
I did try the power drill and wire through the metal line in the tunnel, but it didn't go all the way through and I didn't want to force it and damage the line.
As for the other items on your bolded list, fair enough. I'll try them as I have the means to (I live in a very rural area and don't really have any help) and get back to you.

sturgeongeneral · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:14 am Post subject:

How many shims are under your fuel pump?
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Harleyelf · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:18 am Post subject:

If you park with the front wheels up on ramps and the rear end of the fuel line in a gas can, does the fuel flow freely? Do this for a couple gallons and any crud loose in the long line will pass into the gas can.

turboscotty · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 5:29 am Post subject:

One thing you can try again is using the compressed air method after you try the above post. I would keep going back and forth with the air, I have a feeling you have some build up in the line that just keeps moving around. If you have a helper get him to hold his finger over the other end with a rag as you blow air in the line, might help get whatever is in there to pop out, just trying to help.

George Stimson · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 10:18 am Post subject:

Okay, we pulled the tank today. Gas was coming out of the cloth line (new) attached to the tank at what seemed to be a steady stream (see pic). It took about 33 minutes to drain eight gallons of gas out of the tank into gas cans. The gas was clean. It was a similar flow when working on the problem earlier that caused me to think that blockage in the tank was not a possible cause. And as I recollect, that's why I didn't focus on the tank as being the problem.
But what do you other guys think? Is the gas flow indicated in the picture (8 gallons/33 minutes) sufficient enough that it should make it through the line in the tunnel and back to the engine (provided that the tunnel line isn't clogged)? Should I pull out the tank filter and check it anyway?

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Westy Steve · Samba Member Joined: February 25, 2006 Posts: 1095

Try these things:

1. Leave the gas tank out, and unhook the line "uphill" from the fuel filter and blow through the line. Can you blow through the line, or does it feel like it's not letting air through?

2. Did you change your fuel filter?

3. Put half a cup of gas into a little can or container. Then try have a friend try to crank the car while allowing the fuel pump to suck gas through a very short gas line. Does gas exit the other side of the fuel pump?

Do these things and you'll be able to pinpoint your problem.
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Miklo · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 11:08 am Post subject:

Is the fuel tank venting at all?
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George Stimson · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 11:09 am Post subject:

The only fuel filter in the whole line is a new one between the fuel pump and the carburetor. When you say "uphill," do you mean the direction from which the fuel is flowing?
And VeeDub Doug, pardon my ignorance, but what do you mean by "venting"?

Miklo · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 11:29 am Post subject:

Is the tank able to breathe? Is the breather tube hooked up?

The fuel will not want to leave the tank if the tank isn't breathing properly.

Have you tried filling the carbs float bowl up. Then try to starting the car?

Sometimes it takes that to get the fuel flowing properly.
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'55 Type1 "Ozma"
'66 Type1 "Charlotte" RIP
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Potsie · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 11:34 am Post subject:

It sounds like you may still have an obstruction in the metal line, but not enough to stop the flow completely. If it flows then stops, the tank may not be venting. There should be a cloth fuel line coming off the filler neck on the tank. This is routed down underneath the car and allows air in to replace the fuel that has left. Otherwise negative air pressure will build in the tank and stops the fuel from flowing. You can test this by just repeating the test where you let the fuel dribble from the cloth line that goes to the pump. But do it this time with the filler cap off. If the dribble doesn't stop with the cap off, then you know it's a venting problem.
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Potsie · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 11:38 am Post subject:

Last time I had the pump out, it would not prime when I tried to start the car. I had to take it off the engine (with the lines hooked up), then manually push the rod on the bottom until fuel came out the line that goes to the carb.
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Still no gas getting to '64 Beetle engine
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